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Old 08-20-2017, 07:30 AM   #261
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Good friend of mine has been getting me back into looking at cars. And came across this one as a result. The Mercedes-Maybach cabriolet unveiled at Pebble Beach just a few days ago. Two passengers, as long as a ship, and 750 hp.

Electrically powered.

Gotta go check those Lotto numbers ...


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Old 08-20-2017, 08:58 AM   #262
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In 1988 I worked on the Olympics in Seoul. Mazda had provided an electric vehicle to lead the marathon with a rear facing camera. I seemed to be the only person who knew how to make a camera work, so I was picked to go with the Mazda while testing. It had to last for 26 miles, and was capable of 70 mph. The batteries were supper secret, and it was recharged at night in a separate building in case it blew up. For testing away from Seoul traffic(!!!) it was loaded on a flatbed and driven out in the country (rice paddies). OMG! I felt like I was in an episode of M.A.S.H.! We ran up and down a remote runway until we were stopped by guys with machine guns who didn't speak English. I't worked great, but then I never saw any further development. Until now.

The original question was "When to buy an electric tow vehicle?"
and the answer is "When it's feasible".
Recharging every 50 miles (while towing) to feel like you're on the cutting edge is not feasible.
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Old 08-20-2017, 09:00 AM   #263
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Recharging every 50 miles (while towing) to feel like you're on the cutting edge is not feasible.
Every 125 miles (actually more like 140 miles now with the 100D), and there are more important reasons besides feeling like one is on the cutting edge. That's beside the point.
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Old 08-20-2017, 10:07 AM   #264
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Two of the five guys sailing yesterday, towed their boats to the event with their Prius hybrids. There will be folks who have a hybrid or electric vehicle because it is best for their lifestyle. They also may want to enjoy the Airstream adventure by embracing smaller coaches. That is counter to the intent of this thread, but more ideas and perspectives are not a bad thing. Pat
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Old 08-20-2017, 10:24 AM   #265
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Two of the five guys sailing yesterday, towed their boats to the event with their Prius hybrids.
I happen to like the Prius. It's not an electric vehicle it's a hybrid. But what kind of boats did they tow?
I rest my case.
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Old 08-20-2017, 10:38 AM   #266
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I happen to like the Prius. It's not an electric vehicle it's a hybrid.
If it is plug in Prius (not all Prius are PHEV) then it is an electric vehicle.
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Old 08-20-2017, 11:46 AM   #267
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-- snip -- what kind of boats did they tow?
I rest my case.
The boats are considered to be lead mines as they are ballasted. However the point that you are trying to discount was that they used their vehicles for utility duty. Thanks for showing another example. Your case is rested on a slippery slope. Pat
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Old 08-20-2017, 11:54 AM   #268
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To get back to the original question, I currently have a paid-for truck with just over 100000 miles on it, so I'm not likely to be considering a new vehicle anytime soon. I don't expect we'll see a fully electric vehicle that will replace a large pickup truck in the near future, but I see definite potential in a hybrid similar to the system in a Volt or Workhorse.
I would love to have a truck that would do shorter trips on battery power, because the fuel economy on a short trip tends to be much lower than longer distance highway driving. I realize that the farther one drives each day the less advantage there is to that type of hybrid system, but for those of us who also use their tow vehicles for shorter trips or as a daily driver it would make a difference.
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Old 08-21-2017, 04:55 AM   #269
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Looks like Mazda new HCCI engines will make electric a dead-end all over again.

Not to mention the recent Forbes article about the bigger carbon footprint of electric.

Relegation to metro areas. And then by politics, not science.

Get rid of the tax credits, then Tesla and it's ilk are toast.
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Old 08-21-2017, 06:27 AM   #270
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And after the gasoline and diesel fuel run out?



Sometimes ya gotta look over the horizon to plan a trip . . .

[ . . . or past the end of your nose . . . ]

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Old 08-21-2017, 08:32 AM   #271
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And that will be?

Gasoline can be made from a carbon source. Doesn't have to be petroleum.
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Old 08-21-2017, 08:33 AM   #272
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Or at the end of the rainbow.
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Old 08-21-2017, 09:12 AM   #273
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Not to mention the recent Forbes article about the bigger carbon footprint of electric.
Which one was that?

This one from 2016, saying that a Tesla Model S lifecycle carbon is 53% less than a gas vehicle?

Or maybe this one from April 2017 showing that the total carbon output is 40% of ICE vehicles?

Both of those of course, reference the most thorough well to wheels comparisons, which are performed by the Union of Concerned Scientists. Check for yourself.

Important to note is how the gap between the two is continually widening. As the grid cleans up, electric cars get a bigger edge. As battery technology improves, electric cars grow a bigger edge again. As electric cars finally become built and sold at scale, the manufacturing processes get more efficient and carbon goes down.
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Get rid of the tax credits, then Tesla and it's ilk are toast.
We've been through this. Add an appropriate carbon tax, and tax other externalities of gas vehicles, and I'm happy to see the tax credits go away. The tax credits really aren't close to enough to level the playing field.
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Old 08-21-2017, 09:33 AM   #274
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And after the gasoline and diesel fuel run out?
What? The US could be the world's #1 oil producer. There is a glut of oil that's why the price is down. Don't fall for the "peak oil" fabrication.
Oil does not come from dinosaur fossils.

However, I have discovered it's folly to argue with true believers. Enjoy.

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I'm happy to see the tax credits go away. The tax credits really aren't close to enough to level the playing field.
All tax credits should go away. All tax deductions should go away. The income tax should go away, but that's never going to happen.

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Add an appropriate carbon tax
Sigh
Appropriate? 100% aughta do it!
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Old 08-21-2017, 10:11 AM   #275
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HCCI ends the thread AND the electric car.
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Old 08-21-2017, 04:44 PM   #276
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HCCI ends the thread AND the electric car.
You're dreaming. And obviously know nothing about what is going on in the industry.
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Old 08-21-2017, 05:18 PM   #277
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You're dreaming. And obviously know nothing about what is going on in the industry.
Ditto!

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Old 08-21-2017, 05:26 PM   #278
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HCCI ends the thread AND the electric car.
I don't believe HCCI will "end the electric car", but providing a 30% increase in the efficiency of ICE engines combined with very low emissions, it will surely extend the number of years ICE engines will continue to dominate...
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Old 08-21-2017, 05:44 PM   #279
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and not to mention that electricity rates in Ontario are simply out of control due to mismanagement and insane contracts with wind and sun generators. Many industries are bailing out of the province and relocating south where costs are less, including electricity. But yes we are getting cleaner, which I agree we must do but an intelligent plan prior to jumping in. Just my observations Y.M.M.V.
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Old 08-21-2017, 05:55 PM   #280
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Quote:
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HCCI ends the thread AND the electric car.


In what world!?!? One manufacturer planning it for "some future car" - this is an extremely limited release without a definite date yet. It will take years for this to propagate to other manufacturers and make the transition from small cars to light trucks.

Meanwhile the electric vehicles and infrastructure will continue to grow faster.
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