Difficult decision on 1/2 Ton TV with AS EB25 - what would you do?

[tjdonahoe]

3/4 ton not a heavy car

[dznf0g]

Originally Posted by tjdonahoe

3/4 ton not a heavy car

Now, that's just over-the-top.

[Ray Eklund]

IF Toyota comes out with a 3/4 Ton Tundra... I am selling my F350 Twin Turbo Diesel 4x4 Ford King's Ranch after the Test Drive. Ford needs to fix their front end 4x4 issues and emissions... some day.

(After the first year of production, so the 'bugs are worked out'. Like the 2007 Tundra... for those who know. I bought the 2008 and later Tundras.)

The Tundra 5.7L 4x4 stock... is light in the springs and even my Equalizer Hitch could not make me... happy. The ride was just rougher and the leaf springs were flat. The F350 uses the same Equalizer with 1,000# bars and I could probably tow 'on the ball'. The 750# bars may work, but set level, I can sway the bars out with little or no effort... No sway at any speed, up a hill or down.

The Toyota brand is Number ONE. I will pay more for a Toyota heavier tow vehicle, engine and transmission. I will sell the Ford, either F250 or F350 once I could get the Toyota bought and parked in our garage with our Airstream.

Even if it is Gasoline. I have seen Toyota Diesel Land Cruisers used in Australia and smaller Toyota pickups.

Been driving Toyotas since 1979 or 1980... the small 4 cylinder pickup with room for two people. Not until I went to a 25 foot I found Toyota at its match with 25 feet of Airstream. I was not going to fool around with hitches and 'magic' to change my opinion. The Equalizer Hitch with 750# bars was already too stiff.

Difficult Decision? Toyota... there is a big market out there for a heavier pickup. The Ford sucks dust into the cab and the fit of the rear tail gate with sealed shell is a vacuum cleaner. The Tundra... sealed and gaskets were well designed.

OK... I do not write short posts. My wife and I travel thousands of miles a year, maintain our trailers and vehicles. I do it mostly myself. The F350 has 67,000 miles and mostly towing two Airstreams. I like to drive it on the Highway as people see the bumpers, the Diesel twin turbo is a jet on wheels when needed. The fit of fenders, doors, cab and tailgate are not very good.

I will quit finding myself defending my experience(s) and will offer the OP to follow us and travel to places where experience is gained by actually traveling and using our tow vehicles and Airstreams... OFTEN. A weekend towing experience is just an introduction... to having answers.

[kscherzi]

Originally Posted by mefly2

I guess that most of the above posters did not read that we have already towed AS trailers with 3/4 ton trucks and want to know what folks have done to make their 1/2 ton trucks more acceptable as TVs... choices and/or modifications.

Having only towed my 27FB about 45,000 miles across country twice and Alaska once with a F150 here are my thoughts. Truck has 1660 lbs payload, its a Lariat supercrew. Me, wife, dog come to 400 lbs. Trailer has 950 tongue weight. Don't carry much heavy stuff in the bed. But do have a Honda 2200 generator, chairs, toolbox, and golf clubs. The weight distribution hitch will shift a couple hundred pounds back to the trailer and a hundred or so onto the truck front axle. At the CAT scale all loads fall well under GAWR's.

If you opt for the F150 hybrid you don't need to haul a generator and fuel, so that partially offsets that trucks lighter payload rating.

My rig has no issues going up hill, even in Colorado. On steep long downhills over 6% grade with the 3.5 Ecoboost the engine braking is somewhat wanting due to its smaller displacement.

Another thing to keep in mind is trailer loading for the 25 footer. Heavy stuff in the rear, light fluffy stuff up front.tonthe extent possible.

[Dennis C]

Originally Posted by mefly2

What would you do?

I think most people who read the original post answered the question that was asked by the OP. I answered that I'd buy a 3/4 ton truck because that's what I would do.

[uraljohn]

Originally Posted by Bobbo

You know the answer. The numbers don't lie. Really, REALLY, wanting an insufficient 1/2 ton to work doesn't make it work. Use reason to decide, not emotion.



That is only on the stripped down base model truck. The OP wants the bells and whistles.

The HDPP is available on the XL and the XLT trim levels. The XLT can be nicely equipped. Not a bare bones model by any stretch. If OP does his homework and works with a decent commercial sales rep he or she can order up a very nice 1/2 tonner that is capable of getting the job done.

[Delcolight]

My 2 cents.. get a 3/4 of your choice.. I know the fuel will be not as great.. best thing you can do in the long run.. the safety of towing, and the extra grunt for the hills will pay for it self. Lastly, the wear and tear on a half ton.. over the long run the breaks, trans work, drive line etc. You will have more road time with the 3/4 vs the 1/2 and the money you spend for the repairs would meet or exceed the 3/4 ton. Over the life of the vehicle

[Bobbo]

Originally Posted by mefly2

I guess that most of the above posters did not read that we have already towed AS trailers with 3/4 ton trucks and want to know what folks have done to make their 1/2 ton trucks more acceptable as TVs... choices and/or modifications.

Please do not simply preach - get a 3/4 ton truck. Not a newlywed to AS towing ...We have been towing for over 50 years (mostly with 3/4 and above) and are looking for constructive suggestions from those who ARE CURRENTLY happy towing with their 1/2 ton pickup trucks ... be they standard cab, crew cab, extended cab, or super crew.
Been on here for over 11 years and surely note the recent tendency for posters to condescendingly pontificate rather than trying to be helpful. Yes, I understand weights and balances from USN flight training in 1969 and also wrote on AF lengthy postings on EQ hitches and modifications. We are aware that Can Am sets up vehicles (including those with less advertised cargo capacity) to safely tow longer length AS trailers and are asking if there are readers that can make constructive suggestions to that end.

Thank you for not turning my inquiry into another 1/2 vs 3/4 TV debate. It is truly a dilemma for this 73 year old - to check back to my original AS factory specs on our AS that are off by more than 150# tongue weight... 1,000 # not the 835# advertised! It is my own fault that I was too frugal to spend the $$ to buy a Sherline scale years ago! Hence the current dilemma ... LOL

OK. Get an STX with HDPP and Max Tow. HDPP is not available on higher trim levels. Of course, you will lose the comforts that the higher levels have.

[DustyTrails]

Yup. This is the reason we went for a Ram 2500 instead of a 1500 or F-150. The math did not add up and it would consistently put us too close for our own comfort and might limit things we would want to take like our kayaks and such.

I do want to say one thing here about the plethora of comments I see on the forum about the 3/4 trucks not being as comfortable of a truck or a good commuter. I would completely disagree. Do I WANT to commute in to my work in a 2500 that eats up A LOT more gas than our Mini Cooper? NO. But is it uncomfortable or a bad commuting car, NO. It still fits (with 3 inches to spare) in my hospitals 7 ft high parking garage. I can still get it into the parking spots. It is extremely comfortable to drive. You have a good view of the road and can clearly see the traffic and issues far ahead of you. For me it works fine as a commuter and we have opted to have me drive it instead of my husband to work because his commute is further, parking can be tougher and it would have to be parked outside all day. I definitely understand there are issues with it not being OK for commuting if your parking is super limited, spaces are small or parking garage is under 7 feet. But from a comfort and driving standpoint, it's a great vehicle to commute in and I certainly do not mind it. Just something to consider.

[jondrew55]

Love my RAM 2500 but I’m in line right behind you for a 3/4 ton Tundra. My son still has my 2008 and just turned 150k miles.

Originally Posted by Ray Eklund

IF Toyota comes out with a 3/4 Ton Tundra... I am selling my F350 Twin Turbo Diesel 4x4 Ford King's Ranch after the Test Drive. Ford needs to fix their front end 4x4 issues and emissions... some day.

(After the first year of production, so the 'bugs are worked out'. Like the 2007 Tundra... for those who know. I bought the 2008 and later Tundras.)

The Tundra 5.7L 4x4 stock... is light in the springs and even my Equalizer Hitch could not make me... happy. The ride was just rougher and the leaf springs were flat. The F350 uses the same Equalizer with 1,000# bars and I could probably tow 'on the ball'. The 750# bars may work, but set level, I can sway the bars out with little or no effort... No sway at any speed, up a hill or down.

The Toyota brand is Number ONE. I will pay more for a Toyota heavier tow vehicle, engine and transmission. I will sell the Ford, either F250 or F350 once I could get the Toyota bought and parked in our garage with our Airstream.

Even if it is Gasoline. I have seen Toyota Diesel Land Cruisers used in Australia and smaller Toyota pickups.

Been driving Toyotas since 1979 or 1980... the small 4 cylinder pickup with room for two people. Not until I went to a 25 foot I found Toyota at its match with 25 feet of Airstream. I was not going to fool around with hitches and 'magic' to change my opinion. The Equalizer Hitch with 750# bars was already too stiff.

Difficult Decision? Toyota... there is a big market out there for a heavier pickup. The Ford sucks dust into the cab and the fit of the rear tail gate with sealed shell is a vacuum cleaner. The Tundra... sealed and gaskets were well designed.

OK... I do not write short posts. My wife and I travel thousands of miles a year, maintain our trailers and vehicles. I do it mostly myself. The F350 has 67,000 miles and mostly towing two Airstreams. I like to drive it on the Highway as people see the bumpers, the Diesel twin turbo is a jet on wheels when needed. The fit of fenders, doors, cab and tailgate are not very good.

I will quit finding myself defending my experience(s) and will offer the OP to follow us and travel to places where experience is gained by actually traveling and using our tow vehicles and Airstreams... OFTEN. A weekend towing experience is just an introduction... to having answers.

[Jim H]

We ordered a fully loaded F150 XLT Crewmax with tow package and heavy duty payload package. The payload is 2270#. 1000# more than my Tundra.

Lariat and higher models don’t offer the HDPP.

[nryn]

Originally Posted by mefly2

Wife, me, and dogs plus tonneau cover are just over 500 pounds???
We had a nice 3/4 diesel but prefer the 1//2 T for daily use ...
We prefer to not have another 3/4 T...
What would you do?

I have a 250 but I often travel with my family of four. Like you, I really wanted an F-150 so I could use it in the city as a daily driver. But I ended up going with a 250 so I wouldn’t have to play weight games (shift things around, not take some things, whatever) to make the numbers work. In the end I’m very glad I chose to separate my daily driving (a Volvo) from my towing (the 250), not the least of which is that the 250 makes an excellent truck for the farm and in rural areas. My truck has roughly 2800 lbs of payload and on our longest trip (80 days) we were at about 2400 (almost 1200 of that is tongue weight for our 27FBT).

But that’s for a family of four (two of which are growing like weeds) that bikes and who can have separate vehicles for towing and daily use. I also specced that vehicle for the Alaska trip, on which I saw many vehicles (trucks and otherwise) on the side of the road with broken axles. But not all trips are on the Alaskan Highway (thankfully).

If you don’t mind the trim level, a 150 HDPP would be in many respects the best of both worlds. You’ve driven both and if I’ve read this thread closely, are in your 70s and have plenty of experience under your belt. If you want a 150 that’s what you should get.

[Bcc75]

Payload is too marginal. Go 3/4.

[Pappy3393]

I went through the same analysis as you. I concluded that a 3/4 ton truck was the only safe way to go. I went with a RAM 2500 gas engine. It is more luxurious than most cars, rides better than my Yukon or a Lexus GX 460 and I use it for every day use. I never looked back. I think if I tried to tow my AS with my Yukon, I would always be second guessing.

[Rich Anthony]

I just went through this kicking and screaming about having to trade up. Went from a 2019 1/2 ton GMC Denali 6.2 gas to a 2020 GMC Denali Duramax 3/4 ton towing a 2021 25' Globetrotter 1000-1100 tongue weight,when trucks are commanding top dollar. Simpley put after me and the dog in the truck I only had a couple hundred pounds of payload left, its not enough for me. Blue Ox hitches according to the company will not reduce payload. The 3/4 ton is far more than I need, but the 1/2 ton was pushing the limits on the hitch and truck. Yes,the 1/2 ton can do it but the 3/4 ton is peace of mind. And of course a completely different towing experience.

[davidrrand]

Originally Posted by Daquenzer

https://www.rvlifemag.com/towing-hal...e-quarter-ton/

Read this before making a decision. This helped me a great deal.

I tow a 28’ with an F150 max payload, and a Propride Hitch. It is perfectly level. Rides wonderfully. Tows marvelously. Plenty of power.

The only thing I would recommend is putting a roadmaster suspension system on the F150. Some recommend Bilstein shocks. I put on 20” tires which increase the rear axle weight rating nearly 300lbs.

I get 17 to 18mpg for everyday driving. And 21 to 22mpg on the highway when not towing. I can get into the truck easily, and the bed of the truck is accessible.

Question:

How does “putting on 20” wheels on create larger axle rating? Did you order 20” wheels and truck that has a heavier rated axle? That makes sense.

Thanks

Dave

[Daquenzer]

Originally Posted by davidrrand

Question:

How does “putting on 20” wheels on create larger axle rating? Did you order 20” wheels and truck that has a heavier rated axle? That makes sense.

Thanks

Dave

All I know that with the 20” wheel package the towing capacity and rear axle rating increased according to Ford.

Max GCWR/Max Tow achieved on SuperCrew® when equipped with 20-inch Wheels. This configuration will also come equipped with max springs, steering gear, and upgraded stabilizer bar."

[BogeyPro]

Originally Posted by Pitou49

I got an F-150 XLT Crew cab 6.5' Ecoboost 3.5
, payload max and tow max.
2441 payload


I pull a trailer, AS25 FC, and work trailer, 56% of my mileage. It is perfect.

YES!!! I just ordered the 2021 F-150 XLT 3.5L Powerboost Hybrid with Max Trailer Tow Package. 4x2 wheel drive with 20" wheels. According to the Ford Towing Guide, I should get 2120 lbs. payload. Fingers crossed.

[Mollysdad]

Originally Posted by mefly2

tongue weight (with full propane tanks, AGM factory batteries, minimal gear stored in front ~ 30 lbs, mattress topper, and NO water) of 1,000 lbs.
The hatch in the rear of the Eddie Bauer does not seem to mitigate the tongue weight measurably.

Wife, me, and dogs plus tonneau cover are just over 500 pounds???
We had a nice 3/4 diesel but prefer the 1//2 T for daily use ...
We prefer to not have another 3/4 T...
What would you do?

Well, The only people who'll tell you a 3/4 ton vehicle is a bad idea are those towing with a 1 ton vehicle.
But I agree with you, I don't want to drive a F-250 to the grocery.
Water tanks don't always effect tongue weight because with mine, it's between the axles.
I'm always being lectured by learned hitch scholars the a W/D hitch moves some of your rear axle weight to the trailer axle.
If so, is this factor enough to get you in the ballpark?
For me, with the Tundra, I have plenty of towing power. I worry more about the brakes than the horsepower.

[RickSap]

Buy the Lariat with the 3.5 eco boost. That is what I did. The hybrid adds another 2-300 in payload. My lariat with max tow, 360 camera and some other options is 1800 lbs which will be fine for the 25. I avoided the off road since that adds 75 lbs. also will not get a bed cap, just a tonneau to keep payload down. I just didn’t want a 3/4.