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Old 10-15-2008, 04:17 PM   #337
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A watched pot never boils...while I was absent Bob gets reinstated. CONGRATULATIONS Bob! Don't know if that is "the" proper salutation under the circumstances but I'll use it. I am so glad the suspension was reversed and an apology to the unit, region, Bob and the Mrs. are extended and to be printed in the BB and on the web.


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Old 10-15-2008, 08:55 PM   #338
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Originally Posted by wheel interested View Post
I am so glad the suspension was reversed and an apology to the unit, region, Bob and the Mrs. are extended and to be printed in the BB and on the web.
It will be interesting to see if this news is reported in the Blue Beret. The appeals board requested that but I am not aware that they have the authority to order it. (Note that his suspension wasn't reported in the Blue Beret.)

Let's not forget that we are still waiting for "the other shoe to drop" in the matter of Leo Garvey. It is to be hoped that the Executive Committee's enthusiasm for disciplinary action against leaders of the loyal opposition has waned since Bob Thompson's hearing, but that remains to be seen.

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Old 10-15-2008, 09:01 PM   #339
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I think rickandsandi hit the nail on the head (though I admit I have no first-hand knowledge.). All the railing and knashing of teeth did not affect the outcome. But well-placed letters and appeals induced the leadership to forgive the transgressions and restore the status quo ante. I appreciate their forbearance - truly the mark of greatness is the abilty to absolve transgressions.

But isn't there something wrong with an ethics rule that is invoked by hurt feelings? And an enforcement wing to handle the smack-down? I'm an accountant - a CPA - and I have a strong sense about ethics and how important they are to a civilized society. I just have a hard time connecting an ethics failure with impulsive speech.

But, as Jimmini says, one shouldn't run off at the typrewiter. Thanks for the reminder. I would like to know how he got the little red book translated, however.

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Old 10-17-2008, 06:02 PM   #340
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We can always find the negative in any situation or another reason to moan and groan. It truly is time to look at the up side of this in that the intent was a hoped for reversal of a decision and that took place. An apology was given and an all inclusive one at that which makes it clear that this was a mistake from the start and those involved have been acknowledged both for the good and for the bad done.

That to me says lets get on with fixing the things in the club that we think need fixing. I've noted this on the WBCCI forums - the executive are hearing from a relative few people about issues and have 6,000+ members to keep happy. I suspect the vast majority of the members are not making waves so for the executive to try to keep that vast majority happy they need to know what it is they actually want. Not what this small vocal group are saying, but what the overall majority want the elected stewards of our club to do.

So, if you are a WBCCI member and have not been posting your views on your forum please take the time to do so and encourage others to do so as well. Please offer solutions. That is what we need. There is enough criticism in the world without us adding to it. If you have something that you feel needs to be addressed you need to be able to explain what the problem is, why you believe it is a problem for the majority of the membership, and what you would recommend as a possible solution or if you don't know that, ask other members for their input as to whether they agree and for their suggestions. Make sure you also are offering your time to help to drive this through to completion. Just dropping a problem on someones lap and saying here, I/we don't like this, you fix it, is not the way a volunteer organization works in my view.

If you are not a WBCCI member and want to be part of the solution then you need to step to the plate and join. We need you to join because we need your insight and your help getting the club back on track.

If you are a MAL then we need your help in figuring out a way to get your votes counted. Being silent if you are unhappy the way MAL's are accounted for is not the way to get what you need. Raising it here and not on the WBCCI forum as well is nothing more than the whiz thing mentioned in earlier posts.

Get involved. This threads issue is no longer current, it has been dealt with effectively and appropriately. So focus on more than just the next issue, help us focus on moving the club as a whole forward. 6,000+ members is still a very large club and there are a lot of very content members in that number. For good reasons. There is great value to be had in this camping club and a few issues that look big and get lots of press and cause folks to not join when in reality those issues are only a small overall piece of a great big outstanding camping fraternity. Come out and play with the rest of us

That's my story and I'm sticking to it
Barry & Donna
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Old 10-17-2008, 06:22 PM   #341
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Well I'm a MAL and want a vote. Post this on WBCCI? It seems a futile exercise. As far as I can deduce from follow up posts there are the same few posters involved in the threads and you are also here. The advantage of here is that there is response and energy and an assemblege of what I hope and do consider my peers.

Simple answer how to get MALs a vote is to rank them as 000 unit, is that what 2Air mentioned we were listed as? There's a bunny who knows his mind too. It would be up to the units to make this initative on MALs behalf. If members' databases were filed and kept current, voting, dues, rally payments, history and contact info would all be a keystroke away and save tons of money. I asked on WBCCI long long ago if there is a central database of MALs and if it could be made available to me so I could know and contact other MALs and there still has been no response. I think someone mentioned it takes time and i should have patience in waiting for answers, um...ahuh. So I am a MAL in a holding pattern, which no doubt the club leaders do not intend to monkey with. Voiceless they have little to deal with, united it could be a force to be reckoned with.

Nuvi I am hoping Leo fares well and trying to keep apprised of the situation. His option of be there or pick up a teleconference or not, was not the venue he had requested to present his witnesses. Bucking the system is never easy and this system makes rules on the fly to win.Let's hope we all grow up soon.

As to the couple of the 3rd grievance who is expelled, as beginning to be made inquiry of on SaveWally, I too would like to know the circumstances. Sunshine laws sound good to me. Too much overt and confidentiality and closed door proceedings does not bode well in the current climate of frustration and no confidence. They no more want to reach out and develop relationships outside of their elite circle than I want to squeeze a porcupine. They like the dogs are sleeping for the most part. It gives them free range to rule. Communication with leadership is like talking to the hand.

Shall we all try very hard and become the next targets? Or shall we all try very hard for efforts to come to naught AGAIN?

I actually don't know if I am a MAL now. I am holding onto my money this year and waiting to see what I want to attend before hitting the button. For all I know Madison may be cancelled for lack of interest. Beyond the international rally and an additional hefty price tag to attend, a MAL gets zip and pays the most dues. a MAL belongs not because of the activities of local functions and a regular assemblege of friends but for the pride of being a member of the WBCCI. That pride is being chipped away by the leadership. In good conscience I would never even try to recruit a person into the club at present.

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Old 10-19-2008, 04:11 PM   #342
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When we heard of the WBCCI, we wondered what that was all about. First thing I found out was you get those cool numbers. Then Barb wanted to go to an Airstream rally, but I found out you had to be a member to go to a WBCCI member group rally. Then, after I asked about it, we got invited to check one out. It was a Four Corners Unit rally and very informal. We liked that. If I didn't have to join WBCCI to join FCU, I would have.

By then I had discovered there was dissension in the WBCCI about rules, red jackets, flags and what appeared to be an arthritic organization. I've got enough arthritis already. I may be a geezer, but I'm not sure I want to be in an organization run by geezer attitudes.

Now that I've read too many posts here, the only reason to me to join WBCCI would be to reform it. I've been in plenty of organizations that needed reforming and found it extremely difficult to change much of anything. I think Hampstead38's posts about the changes in how organizations work today are worth considering.

What has happened is that there are two organizations of Airstream owners. The WBCCI and the Forum. One is very organized and the other less so. Each have rallies.

If I had invested a lot of time into WBCCI and felt the organization could be reformed, I suppose I'd stay. It's hard to let go of something like that. But for someone who has never been a member, I suspect there is little or no appeal to joining. WBCCI may not die, but I think it will shrink until newer people take it over, and that may not stop the bleeding either.

In my experience, organizations become more and more complex as they grow. It's easier to make rules than eliminate them. People who like rules tend to become directors and officers. Robert's Rules are needed to run a meeting and some people don't like that (I have no objection to sensible rules and Robert's Rules are sensible though confusing to many people). After a while, the rules are called "tradition" and if you don't like them, maybe you should leave. You may not be the right quality, maybe not patriotic enough. An exclusive organization will shrink to include only those who meet the "right" personna. Those who see what's happened either quit or redouble their efforts to reform. But with the Forum as competition, reform seems less likely. Seems kind of sad, but hardly a new story.

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Old 10-19-2008, 04:47 PM   #343
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Whew! Talk about bandwidth waste.
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Old 10-19-2008, 05:53 PM   #344
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Well Said Gene
Forums maybe a competition that WBCCI does not want. But its here. We have had fun at Fourms Rallys this yr. There was not one business meeting with Roberts RULES employed . THANK GOD. I studied ROBERTS RULES extensively when in HighSchool. I never did like it.We camped with WBCCI members this yr but they were not the STUFFED SHIRTS that run WBCCI.
Most are just wonderful people who love to camp and have fun. I have to agree that the orginzation will shrink till there is nothing left and the young will take over and run the orginazition as Wally Would have wanted, Just to camp have fun and enjoy friends.
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Old 10-20-2008, 01:12 AM   #345
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Originally Posted by Mike Leary View Post
Whew! Talk about bandwidth waste.
Yes Mike, your comment was bandwidth waste, as is this. The disgruntled will always be disgruntled. Try not to kick your dog today, it was your choice to take him home.
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Old 10-20-2008, 05:45 AM   #346
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Originally Posted by Mike Leary View Post
Whew! Talk about bandwidth waste.
Mike - Every post of yours that I've seen has been negative . You didn't like Airstream Life and now you have sharp comments on a post. Do you even enjoy your Airstream ?

An old saying in Texas - "If you don't have anything nice to say, keep your yap shut".

Remember to take your medication this morning .
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Old 10-20-2008, 06:05 AM   #347
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Originally Posted by CrawfordGene View Post
What has happened is that there are two organizations of Airstream owners. The WBCCI and the Forum. One is very organized and the other less so. Each have rallies. Gene
Good points, Gene. Kim and I have pretty much felt the same way regarding WBCCI. These threads have been very "illuminating" as to the club and issues. The good thing about forum rallys is that they're "organized" to have fun and appreciate the aluminari, not into rules, rituals & protocols. An informal club, as it were...

Besides, we got numbers, too & they cost alot less. Blue ones...

OK, I'll quit wasting your bandwidth, Mike...
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Old 10-20-2008, 11:27 AM   #348
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This thread has grown to 27 pages and I'm not sure if it really is keeping with the original intent. Does any body have an update on Jerry?
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Old 10-20-2008, 06:45 PM   #349
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Originally Posted by Minnie's Mate View Post
This thread has grown to 27 pages and I'm not sure if it really is keeping with the original intent. Does any body have an update on Jerry?
Sorry if I'm not paying adequate attention here. . . who's the "Jerry" you are referring to?

Updating all that I know of,

Jerry Larson is still International President of WBCCI.

Region 1 President (now Immediate Past President) Bob Thompson was suspended by the Executive Committee upon recommendation of the Ethics and Grievance Committee but the suspension was recently overturned by the Appeals Board.

The grievance against New York Metro Unit President Leo Garvey is still in process.

We are informed that a third member from Region 3 was expelled, but know no further details.

So those of who are concerned about the recent spate of disciplinary actions are still waiting to hear Leo Garvey's fate.
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Old 10-20-2008, 08:21 PM   #350
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Not all grievance proceedings involve public figures (folks who received votes for International Office) in the club.

Are you sure the 3rd case is related?

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