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Old 10-17-2008, 06:22 PM   #341
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Well I'm a MAL and want a vote. Post this on WBCCI? It seems a futile exercise. As far as I can deduce from follow up posts there are the same few posters involved in the threads and you are also here. The advantage of here is that there is response and energy and an assemblege of what I hope and do consider my peers.

Simple answer how to get MALs a vote is to rank them as 000 unit, is that what 2Air mentioned we were listed as? There's a bunny who knows his mind too. It would be up to the units to make this initative on MALs behalf. If members' databases were filed and kept current, voting, dues, rally payments, history and contact info would all be a keystroke away and save tons of money. I asked on WBCCI long long ago if there is a central database of MALs and if it could be made available to me so I could know and contact other MALs and there still has been no response. I think someone mentioned it takes time and i should have patience in waiting for answers, um...ahuh. So I am a MAL in a holding pattern, which no doubt the club leaders do not intend to monkey with. Voiceless they have little to deal with, united it could be a force to be reckoned with.

Nuvi I am hoping Leo fares well and trying to keep apprised of the situation. His option of be there or pick up a teleconference or not, was not the venue he had requested to present his witnesses. Bucking the system is never easy and this system makes rules on the fly to win.Let's hope we all grow up soon.

As to the couple of the 3rd grievance who is expelled, as beginning to be made inquiry of on SaveWally, I too would like to know the circumstances. Sunshine laws sound good to me. Too much overt and confidentiality and closed door proceedings does not bode well in the current climate of frustration and no confidence. They no more want to reach out and develop relationships outside of their elite circle than I want to squeeze a porcupine. They like the dogs are sleeping for the most part. It gives them free range to rule. Communication with leadership is like talking to the hand.

Shall we all try very hard and become the next targets? Or shall we all try very hard for efforts to come to naught AGAIN?

I actually don't know if I am a MAL now. I am holding onto my money this year and waiting to see what I want to attend before hitting the button. For all I know Madison may be cancelled for lack of interest. Beyond the international rally and an additional hefty price tag to attend, a MAL gets zip and pays the most dues. a MAL belongs not because of the activities of local functions and a regular assemblege of friends but for the pride of being a member of the WBCCI. That pride is being chipped away by the leadership. In good conscience I would never even try to recruit a person into the club at present.
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Old 10-19-2008, 04:11 PM   #342
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When we heard of the WBCCI, we wondered what that was all about. First thing I found out was you get those cool numbers. Then Barb wanted to go to an Airstream rally, but I found out you had to be a member to go to a WBCCI member group rally. Then, after I asked about it, we got invited to check one out. It was a Four Corners Unit rally and very informal. We liked that. If I didn't have to join WBCCI to join FCU, I would have.

By then I had discovered there was dissension in the WBCCI about rules, red jackets, flags and what appeared to be an arthritic organization. I've got enough arthritis already. I may be a geezer, but I'm not sure I want to be in an organization run by geezer attitudes.

Now that I've read too many posts here, the only reason to me to join WBCCI would be to reform it. I've been in plenty of organizations that needed reforming and found it extremely difficult to change much of anything. I think Hampstead38's posts about the changes in how organizations work today are worth considering.

What has happened is that there are two organizations of Airstream owners. The WBCCI and the Forum. One is very organized and the other less so. Each have rallies.

If I had invested a lot of time into WBCCI and felt the organization could be reformed, I suppose I'd stay. It's hard to let go of something like that. But for someone who has never been a member, I suspect there is little or no appeal to joining. WBCCI may not die, but I think it will shrink until newer people take it over, and that may not stop the bleeding either.

In my experience, organizations become more and more complex as they grow. It's easier to make rules than eliminate them. People who like rules tend to become directors and officers. Robert's Rules are needed to run a meeting and some people don't like that (I have no objection to sensible rules and Robert's Rules are sensible though confusing to many people). After a while, the rules are called "tradition" and if you don't like them, maybe you should leave. You may not be the right quality, maybe not patriotic enough. An exclusive organization will shrink to include only those who meet the "right" personna. Those who see what's happened either quit or redouble their efforts to reform. But with the Forum as competition, reform seems less likely. Seems kind of sad, but hardly a new story.

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Old 10-19-2008, 04:47 PM   #343
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Whew! Talk about bandwidth waste.
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Old 10-19-2008, 05:53 PM   #344
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Well Said Gene
Forums maybe a competition that WBCCI does not want. But its here. We have had fun at Fourms Rallys this yr. There was not one business meeting with Roberts RULES employed . THANK GOD. I studied ROBERTS RULES extensively when in HighSchool. I never did like it.We camped with WBCCI members this yr but they were not the STUFFED SHIRTS that run WBCCI.
Most are just wonderful people who love to camp and have fun. I have to agree that the orginzation will shrink till there is nothing left and the young will take over and run the orginazition as Wally Would have wanted, Just to camp have fun and enjoy friends.
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Old 10-20-2008, 01:12 AM   #345
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Whew! Talk about bandwidth waste.
Yes Mike, your comment was bandwidth waste, as is this. The disgruntled will always be disgruntled. Try not to kick your dog today, it was your choice to take him home.
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Old 10-20-2008, 05:45 AM   #346
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Whew! Talk about bandwidth waste.
Mike - Every post of yours that I've seen has been negative . You didn't like Airstream Life and now you have sharp comments on a post. Do you even enjoy your Airstream ?

An old saying in Texas - "If you don't have anything nice to say, keep your yap shut".

Remember to take your medication this morning .
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Old 10-20-2008, 06:05 AM   #347
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What has happened is that there are two organizations of Airstream owners. The WBCCI and the Forum. One is very organized and the other less so. Each have rallies. Gene
Good points, Gene. Kim and I have pretty much felt the same way regarding WBCCI. These threads have been very "illuminating" as to the club and issues. The good thing about forum rallys is that they're "organized" to have fun and appreciate the aluminari, not into rules, rituals & protocols. An informal club, as it were...

Besides, we got numbers, too & they cost alot less. Blue ones...

OK, I'll quit wasting your bandwidth, Mike...
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Old 10-20-2008, 11:27 AM   #348
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This thread has grown to 27 pages and I'm not sure if it really is keeping with the original intent. Does any body have an update on Jerry?
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Old 10-20-2008, 06:45 PM   #349
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This thread has grown to 27 pages and I'm not sure if it really is keeping with the original intent. Does any body have an update on Jerry?
Sorry if I'm not paying adequate attention here. . . who's the "Jerry" you are referring to?

Updating all that I know of,

Jerry Larson is still International President of WBCCI.

Region 1 President (now Immediate Past President) Bob Thompson was suspended by the Executive Committee upon recommendation of the Ethics and Grievance Committee but the suspension was recently overturned by the Appeals Board.

The grievance against New York Metro Unit President Leo Garvey is still in process.

We are informed that a third member from Region 3 was expelled, but know no further details.

So those of who are concerned about the recent spate of disciplinary actions are still waiting to hear Leo Garvey's fate.
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Old 10-20-2008, 08:21 PM   #350
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Not all grievance proceedings involve public figures (folks who received votes for International Office) in the club.

Are you sure the 3rd case is related?
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Old 10-20-2008, 08:51 PM   #351
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Are you sure the 3rd case is related?
Related to what? The 3rd case certainly went through the Ethics and Grievance Committee and was acted upon by the Executive Committee; to that extent it was "related". Beyond that, we don't know.

I don't think the Ethics and Grievance committee has had anything to do for years, so the sudden flurry of grievances is noteworthy in itself.

In his memo regarding the Bob Thompson and Leo Garvey disciplinary actions (which can be viewed over on the WBCCI forums), Mr. Larson mentioned a third disciplinary action which had been settled "to the satisfaction of all parties", or words to that effect. Only recently did it come to light (over on the Save Wally forum) that a couple from Region 3 had been expelled. Apparently they were satisfied with being expelled.
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Old 10-20-2008, 09:07 PM   #352
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Related to what? The 3rd case certainly went through the Ethics and Grievance Committee and was acted upon by the Executive Committee; to that extent it was "related". Beyond that, we don't know.

I don't think the Ethics and Grievance committee has had anything to do for years, so the sudden flurry of grievances is noteworthy in itself.

In his memo regarding the Bob Thompson and Leo Garvey disciplinary actions (which can be viewed over on the WBCCI forums), Mr. Larson mentioned a third disciplinary action which had been settled "to the satisfaction of all parties", or words to that effect. Only recently did it come to light (over on the Save Wally forum) that a couple from Region 3 had been expelled. Apparently they were satisfied with being expelled.
Not that many years, I was informed by Mr. Larson that several members received probation (whatever that is) for offenses at the Salem International.

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Old 10-20-2008, 09:22 PM   #353
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I was informed by Mr. Larson that several members received probation (whatever that is) for offenses at the Salem International.

Bill
Curiouser and curiouser...probation offenses at a rally Beyond the special brand of WBCCI legalese what really does this all mean in reality? This club is intense. Kind of s c a r y hidden under the beret and packaged appearingly as fun.
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Old 10-20-2008, 09:27 PM   #354
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... This club is intense.
For half a second I read that as "in tents."

I can't imagine that anyone's happy with the way things are turning out.

However, what if the guy who started all the grievance filing gave himself one for making the club look bad. We could all have a laugh, burn some tuxes over a fire, and put it behind us.
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Old 10-21-2008, 06:11 AM   #355
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I was informed by Mr. Larson that several members received probation (whatever that is) for offenses at the Salem International.
Sorry to hear that. How sad. Another good reason not to go to Internationals, I guess.
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Old 10-21-2008, 06:25 AM   #356
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What's next, double secret probation?
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Old 10-21-2008, 11:42 AM   #357
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...I was informed by Mr. Larson that several members received probation (whatever that is) for offenses at the Salem International.
Wow, that's a way to encourage folks to drop out next time dues are due!
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Old 10-21-2008, 12:01 PM   #358
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The next thing we will be seeing is a Police Blotter in the Blue Beret list members along with their infractions.
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Old 10-21-2008, 01:00 PM   #359
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OK, I'll quit wasting your bandwidth,Mike...
Never meant to hurt anybody's feelings. ::::note to self, refrain from horning in on threads that seem to have a biased opinion:::::
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Old 10-21-2008, 02:10 PM   #360
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Sorry if I'm not paying adequate attention here. . . who's the "Jerry" you are referring to?

Updating all that I know of,

Jerry Larson is still International President of WBCCI.

Region 1 President (now Immediate Past President) Bob Thompson was suspended by the Executive Committee upon recommendation of the Ethics and Grievance Committee but the suspension was recently overturned by the Appeals Board.

The grievance against New York Metro Unit President Leo Garvey is still in process.

We are informed that a third member from Region 3 was expelled, but know no further details.

So those of who are concerned about the recent spate of disciplinary actions are still waiting to hear Leo Garvey's fate.
OK, see how far it has gone...I have lost track of who the players in this tragic saga are.

Guess I'd better take more ginseng or stay better awake at the key board.
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