BMW X5 payload

[bono]

Hello,

Trying to figure out how to read the numbers:

- the yellow sticker on the driver door states: The combined weight of occupants and cargo should never exceed 500 kg or 1102 LBS.

- the spec details available e.g. here
http://www.treffseiten.de/bmw/info/d...e35d_09_09.pdf

BMW X5 : Datenblatt

state that payload (Zuladung) is 680 kg / 1500 LBS (or 890 kg / 1960 LBS for a vehicle with a third row… which has air suspension in the back).

What is the correlation between these two numbers, i.e. from the yellow sticker and from the general data? I believe the yellow sticker is standard one, regardless of the car features (not 100% sure about it).

Thanks,

bono

[Gsmblue]

The yellow sticker is supposed to take into account the full trim of your vehicle. The general number is just that, a general number.

The general number is always higher.

[rostam]

The published payload is the MAXIMUM payload, which is only available for a bare bones vehicle with no options and accessories. This number is pretty useless as you will almost never find a vehicle with that much payload (nobody wants a $60k vehicle without power seats, moon roof, etc).

The yellow sticker on the driver B pillar is the ACTUAL payload of your vehicle with all the options and accessories. This number is usually several hundred pounds less than the published payload.

You can verify the accuracy of the yellow sticker by weighing your car. Fill up the fuel tank and go to a CAT scale, with no cargo/passengers. Then simply deduct your weight from the gross weight. The actual payload of my vehicle was 43# more than the yellow sticker. Relatively accurate.

[bono]

Thanks guys! It makes sense what you are saying. However, I saw the same yellow sticker in a couple of X5 with different engines, with different options. So there is some confusion on me side around this.

Could anybody with the air suspension confirm what the yellow sticker states? There is significant difference in the payload for a regular (non-air) and air suspension.

[Ohiobrits]

Bono, as others have said, the yellow sticker is the correct number to look at. Even for similar vehicles the payload on the sticker can be different based on options fitted. If you add the Dynamic Handling package with active anti-sway this adds weight, payload goes down. Rear air adds weight which comes out of payload but gives your a higher max rear axle load rating. You have to look at the label to see what payload you have for each vehicle. This label should also give you the max axle loads. The other label in the same area should give you the GVWR (curb + payload) and the axle load ratings.

For my Cayenne, max payload on the website is 1600lbs, I was expecting 1400 lbs and the actual sticker is 1263 lbs. I was buying the car from an out of town dealer so I him send me a photo of the label showing the axle ratings and GVWR which checked out with the online values so I thought "great" but I did not ask for the other label with the tire info and payload. Both labels give the full picture. Not a pleasant surprise!

On another point, my German is not very good- but I think your sheet shows the X5 in Europe is rated to tow 7600 lbs (3500kg). Strange how the US model is rated to 6600 lbs only? Same car, same assembly line....

[Bob662]

Originally Posted by Ohiobrits

...your sheet shows the X5 in Europe is rated to tow 7600 lbs (3500kg). Strange how the US model is rated to 6600 lbs only? Same car, same assembly line....

I bet it's the effect of U.S. litigation and in-house counsel's insistence there be an additional margin of protection from plaintiffs' attorneys.

[SteveSueMac]

Originally Posted by Bob662

I bet it's the effect of U.S. litigation and in-house counsel's insistence there be an additional margin of protection from plaintiffs' attorneys.

I would really love to know.

Are there ANY differences in manufacturing? Something about right vs left hand drive? Different bolts from different suppliers for US vs Euro versions? Some analysis of general road conditions/expectations? Driver habit studies?

I can't imagine it's arbitrary even though it sounds that way. If t really were arbitrary why change the rating at all? 😳

[bono]

Ohiobrits – the label looks like this, it does not provide a lot of info



The problem with the yellow sticker is that I saw the same sticker in 35i, 35d and 50i versions. It is not possible that all of the engine versions and all the option features result in the same max payload. Probably there is a shortcut BMW is doing and just using the same sticker assuming the max useable payload regardless of the version.

I think that this is pretty well known fact (for those who are interested) that the towing rating in the US was decreased (7700 LBS in Europe and 6000 LBS in the US). There are a number of theories, but generally this is the same car, the same components.

[Bill M.]

75 miles per hour towing versus 55 miles per hour towing might have something to do with the European/USA towing difference

[Ohiobrits]

bono, that label does look a bit suspect, a very round number.

Only way to know for sure is to fuel it up, hop in and weigh it. Your payload is the GVWR minus the as weighed weight.

Incidentally my tire label has my VIN on it - it is clearly vehicle specific.

Are the digits on the top right of the label the last few digits of your VIN?

[rostam]

Also 300# tongue weight on euro trailers vs 1000# on North American trailers may explain the "discrepancy"

[Ohiobrits]

I believe the difference in vehicle tow rating is the (tow)rating of the receivers fitted in Europe v US. The US version is rated lower than the Euro version (bono is probably right in that it is 6000lbs not the 6600 I stated) The vehicle that it is bolted to is the same (obviously).

[dkottum]

Originally Posted by Bill M.

75 miles per hour towing versus 55 miles per hour towing might have something to do with the European/USA towing difference

It may well be, which is why one might consider the difference in towing a low-profile, streamlined Airstream and a high-profile, flat front and sided conventional travel trailer, as well as the Airstream's independent suspension.

The Airstream is easier on the tow vehicle to pull and much more stable. Then one may wonder which travel trailer, as well as what country, the rating really applies to; how can it be accurately universal?

[bono]

Ohiobrits, this is not my VIN.

[rostam]

Originally Posted by Ohiobrits

I believe the difference in vehicle tow rating is the (tow)rating of the receivers fitted in Europe v US. The US version is rated lower than the Euro version (bono is probably right in that it is 6000lbs not the 6600 I stated) The vehicle that it is bolted to is the same (obviously).

The euro hitch has a tongue weight limit of 120 kilogram, that is 264#. It would be very difficult to find a 7700# camper with 264# tongue weight. Also euro Airstreams are narrow body.

[Glenritas]

The trailers in Europe are different then the American trailers. the axles or centered on the Euro trailers reducing the tongue weight and the towing speed limit is 45 M.P.H.

Here in America we tow at much higher speed and the tongue weight is at least 10%.
It takes a lot more power to move even an Airstream at 55 M.P.H then at 45 M.P.H. as speed increases the areo drag is exponentially increased.

So don't exceed the manufactures spec's in America and have a great trip.

[bono]

A tongue weight limit on Euro hitch is actually 150 kg (330 LBS). I know this exactly as until recently I had this Euro hitch installed in my car and need to switch to US hitch.

https://imgur.com/a/MtZIO

The speed limits for towing depend on the country - generally, 45-55 mph.

[Ohiobrits]

Originally Posted by Ohiobrits

I believe the difference in vehicle tow rating is the (tow)rating of the receivers fitted in Europe v US. The US version is rated lower than the Euro version (bono is probably right in that it is 6000lbs not the 6600 I stated) The vehicle that it is bolted to is the same (obviously).

Here's some dialogue on this topic over on Bimmerfest. I had to smile, there are lots of "experts" over there also and the thread turns into a discussion of Airstreams, 23 v 25, tire upgrades etc. Where have we seen that before?

[Ohiobrits]

bono,

I'm sure you already looked at your X5 manual. Out of curiosity I dug out a 2014 copy of the US X5 manual I had downloaded last year. The load capacity is, as you say, the same for all X5 versions (1,110/503 without 3rd row seat, slightly higher with 3rd row seat 1,350/612). This matches your tire label give or take a few pounds.

This is an odd way to calculate payload, typically you get a range of curb weights and a GVWR and have to go look at your specific tire label to see your payload for your particular build and options.

There is no way every single X5 with the many option combinations can all have the exact same payload.

Weigh it if you can and let us know. I for one am interested to see what you find. You may get a surprise and find your actual payload is something more. I think your theory that the label is a conservative generic low end value to save them having to calculate it out for each build would seem to be correct.

A trip over the CAT scales will reveal all.....maybe

[jcl]

For our 2007 BMW X3, the payload sticker is the same as the published number in the spec sheets. This particular vehicle was special ordered, and has practically every option available (panoramic sunroof, premium package, active steering, etc). It appeared to me that BMW printed a standard payload label for the doorframe and just made sure that no combination of options exceeded the design weight target. It is a reasonable approach if actual payload is not considered a marketing/competitive feature that will get them more sales.

While the door stickers are better to rely on than spec sheet numbers, they are not necessarily serial number specific. There was a recent thread with a poster who wondered why his new truck had a payload sticker that didn't seem to follow that rule. He ended up talking to factory engineers (RAM, IIRC) and they advised that their in plant system that printed the labels was not interfaced to the actual build consist computer, so they calculated the payload using a 'typical' option list.

The real way to check is to weight the vehicle as others have suggested. Full tank of fuel. Use the door frame label for GVWR, that is a firm number. The difference is payload.

Jeff