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Old 07-13-2011, 12:06 PM   #21
Silverman22
 
2008 34' Classic
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The place I'm near charges $10 per weighing.. could get pricy to weigh all my axles, but it's worth it to get an accurate tongue weight. By the way, really appreciate all the tips and opinions given!!
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Old 07-13-2011, 12:24 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by barts View Post
I'm not running one of these hitches, but have found that adjusting the Ride-Rite air lifts I added to the truck allows me to tune things so we get a smooth ride w/o porpoising, even over bad concrete roads. My guess is that as we typically tow at about 60 mph; the air springs let us change the resonant frequency of the truck far enough away from the 60 mph/length-of-concrete-slab to escape most of this.

- Bart
I also think resonant frequency is a big part of this. Spring rates, weight distribution springs, shocks, wheelbase, frame flex etc.

I never tried air lifts on my last tow vehicle, but did numerous adjustments on hitch and installed Bilstein shocks without completely solving the problem. It would really get going at about 55, almost to the point of being dangerous. I had to speed up to 62 to smooth it out. Yes I think something which would change the resonant frequency is the key. In my case a new tow vehicle solved the problem entirely. The wheelbase is about the same, maybe overhang is a bit different. Spring rates and shocks are different of course. But it has no tendency to porpoise at all, on the same roads, with the same hitch adjustment.

So my thought is the same. If you exhaust the hitch adjustment as a cure, try something to alter the spring rates.
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Old 07-13-2011, 12:37 PM   #23
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I rented a new F-350 crew cab and towed our basically empty 27 about three or four hundred miles, using only the Reese type receiver hitch on the pickup truck. I had read about porpoising, and sway, and was anticipating them, and neither ever happened. There was plenty of two lane road, with railroad crossings, etc. and maybe fifty miles of interstate with 18 wheelers flying by, overtaking me by at least 75 or 80 mph to my 65. It really was rock solid.

I am now looking at leasing the truck again, for a longer period, and loading a few more goodies into the trailer. Should I be concerned about not having the weight distributing hitch? The truck and trailer frame were just about dead level without any mods at all, and it towed great.

Why?
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Old 07-13-2011, 01:38 PM   #24
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Payload and towing capacity are not the same thing (in a manner of speaking). The static measurements are to allay dynamic problems; a 500# TW can become 10,000# under adverse circumstances for a given combination.

The point to a WDH is to reduce yaw. The re-distribution of the TW to the vehicle and to the trailer axles lessens adverse TV reactions when the TT starts to move away from the line of travel either side-to-side or up-down or, worse, a combination.

The owners manual will tell you it is a requirement. Those who do without aren't the most intelligent of the species.
It's cheap, easy to set up and maintain.
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Old 07-13-2011, 02:19 PM   #25
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Well, I checked. The owners manual that came with this 2011 International recommends a hitch with built-in sway control, ( page C-12) but it certainly doesn't tell me that it's a requirement.
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Old 07-13-2011, 02:54 PM   #26
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Weight distributing hitches are required above a certain tongue weight which depends on the vehicle. We don't use one w/ our 71 Tradewind and 4x4 crewcab F250 as the point for needing that is 750 lbs of tongue weight; we run about 500 w/ this trailer.

The ride rite air assists allow me to have completely normal ride height, and we're well within the axle load limits.

Some people feel that WD hitches are required for all trailers; OTOH most boaters don't use them. I would certainly use one if I used a light duty vehicle to pull this trailer... but the rig tows beautifully as it stands. We're running 30 psi in the ride-rites (fair amount of tools in the truck on this trip); and since the truck then returns to unladen height the ride is quite smooth; it's much easier on the trailer this way. Note also that w/ the long wheelbase vehicles, shifting significant amount of weight onto the front wheels takes a lot of tension in the WD setup.

- Bart
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Old 07-13-2011, 03:10 PM   #27
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Silverman:

You might want to check and see if there is a CAT scale near you. You can use their online locator to find them because I think their universal charge is $10 for first weigh and then either free for reweighs up to a certain number or a much smaller fee for each reweigh during the same time span. I could be wrong but that was the impression I got.
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Old 07-13-2011, 03:24 PM   #28
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Thanks! I'm definitely going to do that, plus I just ordered the Sherline tongue weight scale, just to have on hand. Cheapest was propride, which has it for $119.
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Old 07-13-2011, 04:00 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by silverman22 View Post
Thanks! I'm definitely going to do that, plus I just ordered the Sherline tongue weight scale, just to have on hand. Cheapest was propride, which has it for $119.
S22,

Don't know what the factory tongue weight for your rig is, but whatever it is.... it's LIGHT.
When we got the 25 Classic I figured I'd be safe at between 750 and 850lbs.
For whatever reason when I ordered the Shurline scale I got the 2000lb model, glad I did as my tongue weight regularly tops 1100lbs.

FWIW

Bob
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Old 07-13-2011, 04:33 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by silverman22 View Post
Thanks! I'm definitely going to do that, plus I just ordered the Sherline tongue weight scale, just to have on hand. Cheapest was propride, which has it for $119.

Thank you for the order, sir.

All of the above is excellent. Especially the "resonant frequency" comment from Bart.

I have been hearing this "marketing" term more and more often about hitches with "built in sway control." This is the first time I've heard of it being in the manual.

What exactly do they mean by the term "built in sway control?"

Wouldn't EVERY sway control hitch have "built in sway control?"
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Old 07-13-2011, 05:50 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ROBERT CROSS
...
For whatever reason when I ordered the Shurline scale I got the 2000lb model, glad I did as my tongue weight regularly tops 1100lbs...Bob
The Shurline scale is a model of simplicity. It is a cylinder and piston with a surface area of 1 square inch pushing a hydraulic jack oil. It uses a standard pressure gauge calibrated in pounds/square inch. You can easily change the capacity of the scale by swapping out the gauge since the displayed weight is an exact function of the pressure applied to the gauge. These gauges are more accurate mid-scale, so the 0-2000 gauge is reasonably accurate when the weight is between 500-1500 pounds. if you wanted to weight something that is close to 3000#, put on a 0-5000# gauge.

You can get a ballpark weight load on a wheel by placing the Shurline on the saddle of a floor jack and with everything safely blocked, jack up the axle close to the wheel and take a reading when the tire is just free of the ground.

Public scales such as those found at co-ops and grain elevators are typically a single section platform that gives only a total weight. If the scale master has the time and is willing, you can get individual weights but the process is a lot simpler if you go to a CAT scale. For those who have not done this before, the scale is segmented to provide individual weights for the steer, drive and trailer axles. Pull up so that the front axle is more or less centered on the front platform, this will put your rear axle on the 2nd segment and the trailer axles on the 3rd. The operator has a camera to see when you're on the scale and there is an intercom with a call button that is placed where the big rig drivers can reach it. For that reason and the noisy environment, I drop off the wife with her cell phone and she goes in to tell the operator what we're doing. Since our rigs are lighter than the big trucks, they sometimes have me pull forward or back a bit until they get a stable reading.
She pays and I pull off and pick her up. If I want to try an adjustment, I pull to an area away from where I might be in the big trucks' way and make my adjustment and reweigh. I think $10 is fairly universal with a $1-2 reweigh fee if done at the same scale within 24 hours. Once you get it where you want it, you shouldn't have to visit the scales again unless you change something significant.

You may want to get a weight of the solo TV as a baseline, then go back with the TT in tow.
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Old 07-13-2011, 07:47 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Woodruff View Post

I have been hearing this "marketing" term more and more often about hitches with "built in sway control." This is the first time I've heard of it being in the manual.

What exactly do they mean by the term "built in sway control?"

Wouldn't EVERY sway control hitch have "built in sway control?"
Sean, I'm guessing they are trying to tell people WD is NOT the same as sway control. I've had people complain to me they are experiencing sway with their trailer, and they have sway control. I walk outside, and see they have a Husky, Curt, Robin (fill in your favorite WD system here). Um, no, sir, you don't have sway control, you have weight distribution.
"Isn't that the same thing?"
Then the remedial training begins...
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Old 07-13-2011, 08:04 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Woodruff View Post
I have been hearing this "marketing" term more and more often about hitches with "built in sway control." This is the first time I've heard of it being in the manual.

What exactly do they mean by the term "built in sway control?"
Wouldn't EVERY sway control hitch have "built in sway control?"
What about the TV's with "built-in" sway control, lot's of buzz about that also.

Boy we're all a little redundant now.
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Old 07-19-2011, 09:23 PM   #34
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Well, we bought a 1999 Excella classic, widebody last year...we had the same miserable time trying to figure out why we were getting the porpoise affect also...we went through most of the suggestions as previously mentioned...after a lot of sweat and tears...we bought a airsafe hitch...class VII (2 1/2 inch shank) (pull with 2011 Chev.2500 Duramax)...don't have a problem anymore...we attached our equalizer hitch to the airsafe hitch...and the bridges and concrete roads have no adverse affect on the ride....smooth baby smooth....

The porpoise or rocking motion is extremely dangerous and it also pops rivets and can crack the skin...just behind propane tanks in the front...I agree with your wife on this....it scares you to death...hope you find the answer ...not familiar with the HA
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