Inner Dual Wheel Going Flat

[gmillerok1]

Originally Posted by Amg

Thanks Tireman

Are you saying you need to add steel valves to the inner wheel WITH the dually valve ?

Do you recommend using the Duallyvalve. I noticed some on the forum do others say it will cause more stress then plastic valves

I have over 50,000 trouble free miles with mine.

[Air99]

Originally Posted by Marks71

So I'm going to get these, but have a few questions:

http://yourtireshopsupply.com/image/...it-dl1spal.jpg

1) I assume the long stems are for the inners, and the shorter, curved ones for the outers?
2) are there only 4 in a set? what about the front? do I buy another set and, if so, which stems would I use...I presume shorter, curved ones? (my vehicle isn't close by, so I'm not looking at the wheels right now)
3) what are those flat "trays" at the bottom of the photo?
4) how specific is the model number of these to the exact wheel I have? (again, don't know precisely because I'm not looking at the vehicle) OR are they pretty universal?

Thanks for any input. I"m going to have my MB dealer put them on, but he suggested I buy the exact ones I want and they'll install

Will probably get the TST tpms as well.

Thanks again for all the helpful info in this thread.

I’m in the process of replacing all 6 tires on my 2014.5 with Michelin Defenfer LTX M/S and have a chance to look at various valve extenders that is so much discussed for the inner dually, the ones with metal rims inside the pretty Durabrite Alcoa. I don’t know why people have trouble checking or airing them and had to resort to having any extension kits. Using a proper tire / air gauge, see attached, you don’t need any valve stem extension on any wheel, front or rear, outside or inside IF your outer rims are the Alcoa wheels with larger access holes (on virtually all NCV3 based newer AI). Yes I tested by reading the pressure and airing every one of them using this tire gauge. The metal valve stems can be just 1.5” long all around and this tool can easily reach them all.
You can save yourself some grief and it’s only $35, great built quality, precision and US made! I plan on buying the Tireminder with Bluetooth TPMS to screw on them short metal stems they should be plenty stiff for the centrifugal force the wheels generate at +70mph. I’m I missing something?

[FlyFishinRVr]

Originally Posted by Air99

You can save yourself some grief and it’s only $35, great built quality, precision and US made! I plan on buying the Tireminder with Bluetooth TPMS to screw on them short metal stems they should be plenty stiff for the centrifugal force the wheels generate at +70mph. I’m I missing something?

Best luck with that when you pull into the gas station to check and fill your tires. Most gas stations have a crappy little 45* copper fitting on the end of a chewed up rubber hose. What you show in that pic won’t help you (no way to use it with the gas station hose) so without extensions you won’t have any way to fill your tires. I have a dual head gauge to check my tires and it works great, but I don’t have extensions so I’m stuck looking for a gas station that has a dual head, rigid fill like you show in that pic. Those aren’t always easy to find, as I discovered on a recent trip, so having extensions would make things a lot easier. Unfortunately, extensions seem to have their own issues, so I’m still not sure which way to go.

As for the TPMS, you’re adding at least 10g of weight in that one spot. Assuming you started with balanced wheels, be sure to pop 10g on the opposite side!

[Air99]

Originally Posted by FlyFishinRVr

Best luck with that when you pull into the gas station to check and fill your tires. Most gas stations have a crappy little 45* copper fitting on the end of a chewed up rubber hose. What you show in that pic won’t help you (no way to use it with the gas station hose) so without extensions you won’t have any way to fill your tires. I have a dual head gauge to check my tires and it works great, but I don’t have extensions so I’m stuck looking for a gas station that has a dual head, rigid fill like you show in that pic. Those aren’t always easy to find, as I discovered on a recent trip, so having extensions would make things a lot easier. Unfortunately, extensions seem to have their own issues, so I’m still not sure which way to go.

As for the TPMS, you’re adding at least 10g of weight in that one spot. Assuming you started with balanced wheels, be sure to pop 10g on the opposite side!

I see your point but rather take my air chuck and a small pump with me on the road instead of adding those thingamajigs to the wheels. Besides if a tire is losing air, I would park it until the culprit is found. Unlike a regular car, the AI is a tall and heavy beast it is not pretty if you lose a tire at highway speed. With regard to the added weight of the sensors I’m hoping that when mounted opposite each other in the rear dually they cancel out but the front ones may be an issue, thanks for the tip.

[Tireman9]

1. No one should be using standard "snap-in" rubber valves like TR412, 413, 414, 418, 423 and the large dia. TR415 & 425 in RV application or on a Pick-up or van application.

2. Please review my post on what type of valves to use.

3. The valves shown HERE all are bolt in metal valves. They may be pre-bent (for the outer wheels) or very long (for inner wheels) but you so not keep your old valves.

4. RE adding air. If you inflate your tires with the +10% margin I cover in my blog you should be able to go months or all season without needing to add air. If you are adding air weekly you have a problem that should be fixed.

[FlyFishinRVr]

Originally Posted by Air99

I see your point but rather take my air chuck and a small pump with me on the road instead of adding those thingamajigs to the wheels. Besides if a tire is losing air, I would park it until the culprit is found. Unlike a regular car, the AI is a tall and heavy beast it is not pretty if you lose a tire at highway speed. With regard to the added weight of the sensors I’m hoping that when mounted opposite each other in the rear dually they cancel out but the front ones may be an issue, thanks for the tip.

Before my last big trip I took my coach to a local tire shop to fix a nagging leak on my DS outer duallie. It is the only wheel that had an extension (came that way from the dealer, no clue why) and was the only one leaking so I had it replaced with the same short valve as on the other wheels. As a precaution, I replaced the air chuck on my pump with a dual head so I could easily pump my tires up if needed. Damn glad I did because that tire leaked the whole trip. When parked, it doesn’t leak a drop, but moving it leaks. I’ll have a different shop repair it again and hopefully this time it will really be fixed. Anyway, I found out how much of a PITA it is to find a gas station with a dual head chuck, and can’t stress enough the importance of doing what you can to prepare so you’re self sufficient on the road.

FWIW I keep my tires at 70psi (coach handles so much better on the road, much less mushy, rolling feeling) and would be down to 60psi when I checked each day. Not dangerous but absolutely needs to be fixed. As you say these are big heavy beasts and proper tire inflation is critical.

[Air99]

Originally Posted by FlyFishinRVr

FWIW I keep my tires at 70psi (coach handles so much better on the road, much less mushy, rolling feeling) and would be down to 60psi when I checked each day. Not dangerous but absolutely needs to be fixed. As you say these are big heavy beasts and proper tire inflation is critical.

I decided to go ahead with a Dill internal TPMS when changing out the old Contis, got 43,000 miles on them, the 4 in the rear still look quite good with about 1/8” left before reaching wear indicators evenly but the fronts showed clear signs of being under-inflated and on the right side, a good deal of positive camber wear on the outer edge with very little tread remained. I took ownership 6 months ago since it had 26,000 and being judicious with tire pressure checking, I think 61/61 psi factory recommendation is on the low side, especially for the front. I ran them 70/65 for our last 1000 miles trip and it did feel less squishy but slightly rougher on bad road, to be expected, yet highway cruising is still excellent and I saw slight mpg improvement as well. I’m scheduled for the new tires and TPMS install next week, already had the front end aligned, I will try 65/62 and report back on the new Michelin.

[Titus]

The tire shop installed metal valve stems and flow-through valve caps at my first tire rotation. No issues for two years and 20k miles. Then had new tires installed 1000 miles ago. New flow through valve cap had a slow leak. Got rid of it - but not before running up to possibly 100 miles with no air in outside dual. Thankfully no (apparent) damage.

I have put off getting a TPMS, not being sure if they would fit on the stems in the small space between the duals. But after this last experience I am going to buy a set a find out.

[Tireman9]

Originally Posted by Titus

The tire shop installed metal valve stems and flow-through valve caps at my first tire rotation. No issues for two years and 20k miles. Then had new tires installed 1000 miles ago. New flow through valve cap had a slow leak. Got rid of it - but not before running up to possibly 100 miles with no air in outside dual. Thankfully no (apparent) damage.

I have put off getting a TPMS, not being sure if they would fit on the stems in the small space between the duals. But after this last experience I am going to buy a set a find out.

100 miles at 100% overload and no damage! Try and find any tire company thet would put in writing that operating under those conditions woul not shorten the life of that tire.
I'm not saying it will fail tomorrow but I would be very surprised if you don't end up with a belt separation some time in the future and you will probably not associate you 100 mile overload with the failure a few weeks or months from now.

"Flow Through" valve caps seem like a good deal except they can allow particles of dirt to enter the sealing surface of the valve core. I show an example of this type of leak in my blog.

RE TPMS Unless the metal valve stems you have are long or the sensor is large, the TPM sensor should fit.

[3bcamper]

Originally Posted by Marks71

So I'm going to get these, but have a few questions:

http://yourtireshopsupply.com/image/...it-dl1spal.jpg

1) I assume the long stems are for the inners, and the shorter, curved ones for the outers?
2) are there only 4 in a set? what about the front? do I buy another set and, if so, which stems would I use...I presume shorter, curved ones? (my vehicle isn't close by, so I'm not looking at the wheels right now)
3) what are those flat "trays" at the bottom of the photo?
4) how specific is the model number of these to the exact wheel I have? (again, don't know precisely because I'm not looking at the vehicle) OR are they pretty universal?

Thanks for any input. I"m going to have my MB dealer put them on, but he suggested I buy the exact ones I want and they'll install

Will probably get the TST tpms as well.

Thanks again for all the helpful info in this thread.

Where do you get those?

[Boxster1971]

Originally Posted by Titus

...No issues for two years and 20k miles. Then had new tires installed 1000 miles ago. New flow through valve cap had a slow leak. Got rid of it - but not before running up to possibly 100 miles with no air in outside dual. Thankfully no (apparent) damage...

I agree with Tireman9. The tire that carried the load on one side for 100 miles likely has internal damaged that you can't see. When a similar incident happened to me I replaced the overloaded tire, but then I was due for a set of new tires as I was preparing for trip to Alaska. they were OEM Continentals with about 30,000 miles on them. Had two fronts with outer edge wear, damaged inner dual tire that went flat and the outer dual tire that ran overloaded. It was a an obvious choice for me.

[Protagonist]

Originally Posted by 3bcamper

Where do you get those?

You can get valve stem extensions as well as TPMS from that biggest of big-box stores, Amazon.com.

[Rig Rat]

Originally Posted by 3bcamper

Where do you get those?

Suggest shopping around.....At Yourtireshop.com they're $120....if your a good sam's member it's $43.92 at campn Wrld!

[Titus]

Note the 'up to possibly' in my post. I had checked the air 100 miles and 24 hours before noticing the flat in the morning. It could have got flat overnight, and thus had 0 miles on it. Zero still qualifies as 'up to 100'. My point in posting is that I no longer trust flow through caps.

[Air99]

Originally Posted by Air99

I decided to go ahead with a Dill internal TPMS when changing out the old Contis, got 43,000 miles on them, the 4 in the rear still look quite good with about 1/8” left before reaching wear indicators evenly but the fronts showed clear signs of being under-inflated and on the right side, a good deal of positive camber wear on the outer edge with very little tread remained. I took ownership 6 months ago since it had 26,000 and being judicious with tire pressure checking, I think 61/61 psi factory recommendation is on the low side, especially for the front. I ran them 70/65 for our last 1000 miles trip and it did feel less squishy but slightly rougher on bad road, to be expected, yet highway cruising is still excellent and I saw slight mpg improvement as well. I’m scheduled for the new tires and TPMS install next week, already had the front end aligned, I will try 65/62 and report back on the new Michelin.

Turned out the internal Dill TPMS did not fit through the Alcoa wheel valve stem holes, so no sensors for now but the Michelins were great, smooth and quiet at 67/62 psi front/back.

[Boxster1971]

Originally Posted by Air99

Turned out the internal Dill TPMS did not fit through the Alcoa wheel valve stem holes, so no sensors for now but the Michelins were great, smooth and quiet at 67/62 psi front/back.

Getting any internal sensors to work on the dually wheels of a 3500 Sprinter is very problematic. I've only seen one solution on the Sprinter-Source forum. It was a special hand made bracket from Borg Equipment. But I couldn't find it on their web page.
http://yourtireshopsupply.com/catego...lly-valve-kits

I'll try to find the Sprinter-Source post that had pictures of the brackets.

[Boxster1971]

Here is link to post on Sprinter-Forum with photos of a special bracket to hold internal sensors on Sprinter 3500 wheels.
https://sprinter-source.com/forum/sh...4&postcount=69

[Air99]

Originally Posted by Boxster1971

Here is link to post on Sprinter-Forum with photos of a special bracket to hold internal sensors on Sprinter 3500 wheels.
https://sprinter-source.com/forum/sh...4&postcount=69

Big thanks Boxster1971, the Discount Tires guy told me the Dills would fit the inner metal wheels just fine, it’s the thicker aluminum Alcoa that the stems cannot clear. Anyway I’m leery of the fix as suggested by the link, it’s too complicated. But thanks for digging it out!