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Old 12-07-2006, 06:28 PM   #71
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Thanks Wahoonc i have a feeling you are correct!
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Old 12-08-2006, 10:59 AM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Gobie
Andy, I have a 1500 Avalanche TV I ended up with a 77/31 International Sovereign I talked to Reese and gave them weights for a 68/30'. I think the 68 was to be 450. I didn't realize that the 77/31 would be so much heaver. It is listed at 710# and I am guessing a bit more with options. I am still planning to weigh it but I would like to know what size bars do you think would be correct. I have the model 66082 dual cam strait line which comes with 600# bars.
The 600 pound bars are correct.

If in doubt, take the rig to a trcuk scale.

Weigh the TV front axle, the rear axle and then the trailer axles (as one).

With the bars properly installed and adjusted, you should find the TV weights to be near equal.

For sake of discussion, since this seems to be a "huge" topic that is not understood, post the weights.

Then everyone can go from there.

I will predict that the bars will be bending about 1 inch.

Please let us all know.

Thanks.

Andy
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Old 12-08-2006, 11:11 AM   #73
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I will let you know when I have been to the scales. Thanks Phil
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Old 12-08-2006, 11:14 AM   #74
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I'm sorry, but advising 600# bars for someone who knows their tongue weight is well over 700# just seems, well, inadvisable, at best. In the event of an accident that was in any way remotely caused or exascerbated by the hitch setup, I'd love to be the hitch company defense attorney with the absolutely luscious opportunity to ask the first three questions:

1) What weight bars did you choose to use?
2) And, you WERE aware of the manufacturer's recommendations, were you not?
3) And, you KNEW your tongue weight was what, exactly?

Game over.

For your own sake, please just follow the manufacturer's recommendations. How can it be much more difficult than that?
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Old 12-08-2006, 11:31 AM   #75
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Originally Posted by dbradhstream
I'm sorry, but advising 600# bars for someone who knows their tongue weight is well over 700# just seems, well, inadvisable, at best. In the event of an accident that was in any way remotely caused or exascerbated by the hitch setup, I'd love to be the hitch company defense attorney with the absolutely luscious opportunity to ask the first three questions:

1) What weight bars did you choose to use?
2) And, you WERE aware of the manufacturer's recommendations, were you not?
3) And, you KNEW your tongue weight was what, exactly?

Game over.

For your own sake, please just follow the manufacturer's recommendations. How can it be much more difficult than that?

Hundreds of tests "proved without a doubt" that tongue weight "AND
the type tow vehicle combination, dictate bar ratings.

As an example, if you had 700 pounds tongue weight, what rating bar would be used for an older large size car and a Peterbilt?

Certainly not the same ratings.

The idea is that the bars "MUST" bend. The heavier the TV suspension, the less a given rating bar will bend.

I think, at this point, there are enough people interested in this question, to go and do the truck scale routine.

I know from 40 plus years experience, they will be glad they did.

Attorneys cannot argue Physics or facts, as opposed to opinions.

Proof, in this case, is what matters.

I, along with Caravanner Insurance Company, the old insurance company of Airstream, came up with that proof in 1970 and 1971.

But, some still disagree with the total of 2 plus 2, and so be it with hitches too.

Do the truck scale. Your life might depend on it.

Andy
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Old 12-09-2006, 03:45 PM   #76
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I just returned from the scales. I was a bit rushed and may not have received enough data but here is what I have

Avalanche 1500 6240 W/3/4 tank of gas and almost ho load
31' 1977 Sovereign full water tank empty holding tanks and mostly unloaded not more than100lb of misc.

Trailer gross as weighed. 6520
Tongue 610
5700 Trailer axles while connected
to the tow vehicle I think with the tow bars on? The trailer was not level (about 2" high in the front) I think because the truck did not have any load and made the truck higher which makes the tongue weight greater. This accounts for the difference if you do the math from the #s above. The rig was fairly level when we where loaded and the hitch was installed.
Truck only with the trailer connected 6220

I have a Reese strait-line Dual cam hitch with 600# bars
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Old 12-09-2006, 04:12 PM   #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Gobie
I just returned from the scales. I was a bit rushed and may not have received enough data but here is what I have

Avalanche 1500 6240 W/3/4 tank of gas and almost ho load
31' 1977 Sovereign full water tank empty holding tanks and mostly unloaded not more than100lb of misc.

Trailer gross as weighed. 6520
Tongue 610
5700 Trailer axles while connected
to the tow vehicle I think with the tow bars on? The trailer was not level (about 2" high in the front) I think because the truck did not have any load and made the truck higher which makes the tongue weight greater. This accounts for the difference if you do the math from the #s above. The rig was fairly level when we where loaded and the hitch was installed.
Truck only with the trailer connected 6220

I have a Reese strait-line Dual cam hitch with 600# bars
The correct way to weigh your rig, is with the trailer hooked up to the TV, ready to go, weigh the TV front axle, then the TV rear axle and then the trailer axles together.

Please observe the amount of bend in the bars during the weighing process.

With that information, you can easily determine your correct hitch bar rating should be.

Andy
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Old 12-10-2006, 11:27 AM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Gobie
I just returned from the scales. I was a bit rushed and may not have received enough data but here is what I have

Avalanche 1500 6240 W/3/4 tank of gas and almost ho load
31' 1977 Sovereign full water tank empty holding tanks and mostly unloaded not more than100lb of misc.

Trailer gross as weighed. 6520
Tongue 610
5700 Trailer axles while connected
to the tow vehicle I think with the tow bars on? The trailer was not level (about 2" high in the front) I think because the truck did not have any load and made the truck higher which makes the tongue weight greater. This accounts for the difference if you do the math from the #s above. The rig was fairly level when we where loaded and the hitch was installed.
Truck only with the trailer connected 6220

I have a Reese strait-line Dual cam hitch with 600# bars
This is great but...you really want to weigh locked and loaded.
Sorry to disappoint, try again next time you are packed up and heading out.
How/where you load will effect these weights.

Bill
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Old 12-10-2006, 11:35 AM   #79
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Thanks, I think I am going to replace all my running gear axlese(axles ect) which will change my tongue/level hight. I my as well wait till I have completed that & weigh again all loaded up. I think I will use the 600# bars initially and figure out whether I need to increase them later. Correct me if I am wrong but I figure the bar weight changes would be minimal and It should be OK for a trip or two?
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Old 12-10-2006, 01:40 PM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Gobie
Thanks, I think I am going to replace all my running gear axlese(axles ect) which will change my tongue/level hight. I my as well wait till I have completed that & weigh again all loaded up. I think I will use the 600# bars initially and figure out whether I need to increase them later. Correct me if I am wrong but I figure the bar weight changes would be minimal and It should be OK for a trip or two?
...and get a hitch with the proper drop/rise.
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Old 12-10-2006, 03:01 PM   #81
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hitch rating

Well, I've been following this thread with a lot of interest also. Here, FWIW, are a couple answers from Josh Jones at Equal-I-zer that I had. Choose the hitch that best suits your trailer's GVWR. Always go up one if the GVRW is somewhere in between hitch ratings. That initial choice of hitch will determine the spring bar rate as they are NOT INTERCHANGEABLE on an Equal-i-zer hitch! The bars, socket size, and hitch are a matched set. Josh's advice was simply change the bracket height to adjust the bar loading, the hitch angle, the hitch height, whatever, to get the proper weight distribution et al. The Equal-i-zer is almost infinately adjustable. The liability question pops up if you are using too light a hitch just to gain some advantage with the lighter spring bars. In this scenario, say using the 6000# hitch and 600# bars on your Trailer with a 6800# GVWR( or in my case , 7200# GVWR). These comments apply solely to the Equal-i-zer hitch.
Maybe this is all a rehash of info, or maybe it's of some use, but it cleared it up for me.
Cheers, Jeff
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Old 12-10-2006, 03:22 PM   #82
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I believe that each size rating of Equal-i-zer hitch uses a different physical size of weight distribution bars (in cross section). It is concievable that you could use a heavier rated hitch with lighter bars if you had fittings made to allow the smaller bars to physically fit into the oversize sockets, or perhaps you could purchase the smaller sized sockets and install them on the heavier hitch. I expect that this would not recommended by the manufacturer.
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Old 12-10-2006, 04:26 PM   #83
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Dan,
Yeah, that was my ?? to Josh Jones. As he stated, the sockets match the hitch head, ie you cannot put 600# bar sockets in a 10000# hitch. Any variation from their format is not recommended aaand probably not covered in any warranty, liability issues.
Cheers, Jeff
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Old 12-10-2006, 04:42 PM   #84
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Fortunately for me the Reese hitch is rated to 12,000# and tongue weight to 1200# The head is also adjustable for height. So basically I just need to determine the best spring bars and adjust the head height.
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