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perryg114 · 02-20-2012, 06:17 PM

You know we have always said to stay away from treated plywood but if you coated it first and used stainless steel fasteners would it matter? I looked at some 1/2" thick composite aluminum the other day. That would be sweet for a sub floor but you would have a lot of money tied up in it. I may still replace the section in front of the door with some of that stuff.

Perry

danlehosky · 02-20-2012, 09:43 PM

Well we just got back from a very wet cool trip to the southwest Washington state coast. There were three of us travelling and I really paid attention to inside humidity, condensation etc. Several weeks ago I bought a cheap digital humidity/Temp recorder at Home Depot and used that as my guide.
Inside temps were always between 68-70 and the humidity varied. I found that about 65 percent humidity I got window sweat and anything above 70 percent the walls began to sweat as well. Slightly opening both Fantastic Fans seems to keep the problem at bay. The weather was rainy and windy with outside temps in the 40-45 degree range. Positive inside air pressure may be a good solution. I have to think about this. Where would be a good air draw point? A minimal inside positive pressure differental would push water and moisture out. But think about this. Combustion from the cooktop would need outside air thereby creating a negative pressure and the combustion process itself creates moisture. So cooking is bad on two counts. I have to stop now. My head is starting to hurt.
All I know is I am to old to go back to the tent.

danlehosky · 02-20-2012, 11:43 PM

The Airstream rep assured me that marine gradw plywood is used. Is this a recent development?

perryg114 · 02-21-2012, 04:41 AM

I think Airstream has used OSB off and on. Someone on here said they have not used it since 2006 but other have said they have it in newer trailers. If I was buying a new one I would say SHOW ME. If customers start demanding plywood then maybe they will use plywood. My 81 has regular plywood not marine grade. As much as these things cost they should make the floor out of something that won't rot at all.

Perry

Gene · 02-21-2012, 08:18 AM

Perry,

The OSB thing is confusing. Some said it was used on the smaller trailers, maybe the Sport models, and then it was said Airstream stopped using it because it was causing lots of problems since OSB deteriorates fast when wet. I also recall some statements that it was used again, but I was not sure that was true; it seemed like a rumor.

There have also been statements posted about Airstream using marine grade plywood, but they may be rumors too. Ours has what looks like BCX or BDX grade. I can't see the bottom, so I don't know what that looks like.

All this makes my head hurt too.

Gene

perryg114 · 02-21-2012, 08:46 AM

Here is what is in my 81 Excella II. It looks like run of the mill exterior glue clear on one side plywood. This is the back side of the plywood and it has lots of knots and holes. It is definately not marine plywood.

Perry

danlehosky · 02-21-2012, 10:38 AM

I called JC this morning and they said a grade below marine grade was, used whatever the heck that is supposed to mean. Marine grade plywood is however not a good solution. The only difference is the glue is more impervious to water and there are usually more laminates, ie in 3/4 inch ply there would be 6 laminates instead of four. In the 70's there was a very popular sailboat plan called the Thunderbird you could build in your garage and my brother and I built one. We used regular ply because we couln't afford the marine grade. My brother still has it, but I think its about half fiber glass now.
I bought new and expected to have maintenance issues that would need to be addressed. Anything that floats, travels or is exposed to rain, wind or snow will leak.
Having said that we also as teenagers built surfboards using resin and cloth and I can picture in my head how this could be done for a floor of an AS. I would have to figure it out structually but I have a 17 ft kayak that is laid up with kevlar and it is really strong (meaning I haven't been able to break it yet.) This type of material laid up properly is incredibly strong (and incredibly expensive). I was recently invited to witness a stress test of the new Dreamliner and they damn near bent those wings until they touched. It was difficult to watch, I kept waiting for the SNAP. I would gladly pay more for this type of floorsystem if AS offered it.. If Boeing can give a wing on an airplane the strength and structual integrity to withstand flight, I'm sure AS could do the same. Anyway my head is starting to hurt again thinking about all of this
Did I say we had a BLAST last weekend? Razor clamming was open on Saturday and we got our limit (45) between the 3 of us. Reading these forums is addicting but for me I need to put some perspective into this and remember to also ENJOY, ENJOY and ENJOY some more.

Dan......... Everybody seems to end their posts with a saying so heres mine I got from an Uncle who every time He'd down a shot would say.
"I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy"

perryg114 · 02-21-2012, 10:41 AM

We are throwing out several rolls of Kevlar at work and I am thinking I should keep some.

Perry

Gene · 02-21-2012, 11:15 AM

Perry's plywood looks to be ACX or BCX. The "X" means exterior glue. "A" through "D" are descending grades of the surface. The first letter is the one that shows; the second letter is the other side. "A" would be clear—no knots or splits. "D" has open knots and some big ones filled. The grade will be marked on it somewhere. What is usually seen in the big box stores are ACX and CDX. The "A" side is sanded a bit and can be painted so it can be used on exposed exteriors. Surely other less common grades can be ordered and a company cutting costs will look for them—the mars in a "B" grade top surface may eventually show through in a thin floor such as the OEM vinyl which is slightly less than 1/16". Plywood has increased a lot in price over the past 20 years.

Gene

perryg114 · 02-21-2012, 04:28 PM

Ok here is what I have done so far with drains. It is not pretty but if it works who cares. I want to do this in months instead of years.

Here is one of the drains using the 3/8" SST thinwall tubing.

Here is the drain to the right of the door in the straight section.

Here is the drain in the front right corner.

Here is the drain on the right side of the door. This is put together with little bits of aluminum roof sheething cut to funnel water down the outside of the skin instead of in the area that use to be covered with wood. It is held together with Parbond and Vulkem.

This is a bridge between the straight C-channel and the curved C-channel made from the sheething and Vulkem.

I am going to put another drain between the two battery boxes and seal the section of c-channel with Vulkem where they cut and bent it to make room for the battery boxes. I am also going to isolate these sections from the corner areas. This is mainly to prevent water from getting up under the metal load plates that are already starting to rust. I am going to encapsulate them in Vulkem. I wanted to POR15 them but I don't want to waste a $50 can of paint just to paint the load plates.

danlehosky · 02-21-2012, 05:04 PM

Perry, if you have the room keep the kevlar. It is very expensive and you can use it for lots of projects and as a repair material. I can picture a 6"strip of it applied around the perimeter wood flooring epoxied in with weep holes. You could dimple the areas around where you want the drain tubes to go so the water would flow to those points.

Dan

Jim & Susan · 02-21-2012, 05:44 PM

Here's one you guys ain't gonna believe. The original floor in my 'Stream was made out of redwood. No kiddin'.

Jim

perryg114 · 02-21-2012, 06:13 PM

I could repair the holes in the floor I just posted pictures of. I am not worried about the existing damage. I can repair it any time. It is not structural at this point. I need to put my skins back on the rear before I start doing any floor work on the front. I am hopeing I have all the leaks stopped which comes before fixing the floor. Does Kevlar has a shelf life?

Perry

Quote:

Originally Posted by danlehosky

Perry, if you have the room keep the kevlar. It is very expensive and you can use it for lots of projects and as a repair material. I can picture a 6"strip of it applied around the perimeter wood flooring epoxied in with weep holes. You could dimple the areas around where you want the drain tubes to go so the water would flow to those points.

Dan

danlehosky · 02-21-2012, 07:30 PM

Perry, as an interceptor (body armor) the suggested shelf life is 10 yrs. For your needs it will outlast both of us.

Dan

NevadaGeo · 02-22-2012, 10:47 PM

Perry, keep the kevlar. Just tell us how many times in the next, say month or two you use it on everything.
Perry (that other one out west somewhere)

xrvr · 02-23-2012, 05:08 AM

Gene, The leak by your door may be the awning mount. My dealer found that by taking it off and sealing it properly/ Hopefully the leak is fixed. jim

perryg114 · 02-23-2012, 06:14 AM

My leaks by the door were caused by several things. The door frame was leaking and the window frame next to the door frame was leaking. These were skin to frame leaks. The window seal between the glass and the frame was also leaking. This was fixed by cutting the lip of the old gasket out and putting in a bead of Vulkem. The Z-stringer between the door and the window had some loose rivets that were leaking. I put Parbond around the leaking rivets. The area to the right of the door frame is very prone to leaks because it is a weak area in the shell due to the door being there and also the constant slaming of door which I think is responsible for most of the leaks.

Perry

Gene · 02-23-2012, 08:12 AM

Ji.m, thanks for the tip about the awning mount. Perry, the thought about the door area being vulnerable because of the opening and closing makes a lot of sense.

I haven't done anything between snow, guests, floor removal, etc. It has stayed dry after the snow melted.

Gene

perryg114 · 02-23-2012, 08:37 AM

The awning mounts where leak points on my trailer as well. All of mine used Olympic rivets and none of them were sealed. They were installed after the shell was sealed from the inside so they bypass all the sealing done as the factory.

Perry