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rroessler · 06-24-2002, 06:08 PM

Newly purchased '76 Excella 500 has a broken joint in the copper tubing under the sink (actually under the floor). It appears the tank fill line is the one that came loose. It enters vertically downward into a tee that is just inboard of what I think is the forward drain valve. I don't know how to get to the problem without removing the sink and cabinet, along with range, oven, etc, etc. Hopefully all you experienced people out there will have some ideas on how to fix this without MAJOR work. Any and all suggestions welcomed.

From NW Arky, i.e., Wally-World (Walmart home office country)

83Excella · 06-24-2002, 08:55 PM

It would be easier to drop the water tank, unfortunately I can't tell you how to drop the tank as I've never done it.

John

roessler · 07-08-2002, 01:31 PM

Have repaired the problem first posted, but are finding several copper tubes with splits in them. Have cut out the damaged portion, but the adjacent tubing, sometimes for several inches, has swelled, and can't use standard compression nor flare fittings because the nuts won't go on the tubing. Does anyone know of an alternate method of attaching repair pieces of tubing, hose, ???

The problems apparently are because the previous owner didn't properly winterize. Is there an antifreeze that can safely be used in the water system, such that we aren't poisoned when prepare for use in the spring?

thenewkid64 · 07-08-2002, 04:21 PM

There is a RV anitfreeze that is usally sold in the fall to winterize. You will need to flush the system in the spring but it is safe to put down the drain and is said to be non toxic. It is usally neon pink. You will also want to pour it in the sink traps as well as pouring some in the tanks so your valves do not get frozen in place. Ice damages everything! Also if you can inspect the back of your water heater you may see a set of bypass valves installed. You will need to drain the heater and open the bypass valves prior to pumping the solution thru the system. If no valves then you can use antifreeze but you will need to fill the heater, using many more gallons. If you have a RV service place you use they may offer this as a fall service saving you a bunch of work. Also they will then be responseable for freeze damage.

I bet if you look in the RV section at Wal Mart this fall you will see it packaged in gallon jugs.

davidz71 · 07-08-2002, 07:22 PM

I used appx. 8 gallons of RV antifreeze in my 31" Excella 500. I made sure that all water was drained from the unit the best I could then filled the fresh water tank with 7 gallons of the antifreeze. I ran a little of the stuff into the water heater then turned the bypass on. I then continued to run the stuff through all faucets by use of the water pump. I caught what was coming out of the faucets and ran it back into the fresh water tank until I was sure that all lines had antifreeze in them. Since I have a water hose reel, I pulled it out and poured antifreeze down the hose then used pressure to push it further into the system. My only water leak since purchasing the trailer in April '01 was an elbow in a low area coming from this hose reel. I capped the end of the hose off with one of the male threaded ends. I then poured the last gallon of full strength RV antifreeze down traps to both kitchen sinks, the bathroom sink and the tub to make sure the U traps were protected. I had plans on recycling it for next year but decided to just drain it out onto my grass.

Hope you get your lines fixed.

**Action** · 07-08-2002, 08:48 PM

Since the pipes have been frozen and expanded, there is no repair to the expanded (and leaking) pipes other than pipe replacement. This can be done in sections or you may have to replace the entire system. Also note that all of the water supply lines may be damaged to the point that leaks will develop later with use. Or as pressures in the system get higher with use. (as in hooked up to a unregulated water supply system)

You may have other issues too. Check the water tank, water heater and filter. The waste water system uses much larger diameter pipe and therefore may not have sustained damage.

Good luck.

>>>>>>>>>Action

roessler · 07-09-2002, 06:45 AM

Wondering about the use of something like fuel line hose to repair the damaged section, slipping it over the copper tubing and securing it with hose clamps. Any thoughts on this approach?

Pick · 07-09-2002, 09:30 AM

I have fixed several leaks this way. Make sure you get the right size hose (make sure it's high pressure) that fits very snug. Mine was so snug, I used a heat gun to warm it up so it would slip over the pipe, then some high quality stainless steel clamps. I know some would not approve of this method, but it does work. Pulling new copper through would be a real pain.

**Action** · 07-09-2002, 09:54 AM

Be careful on the type of hose that you select. It should be the type of hose that is meant for drinking water. Or you might get a bad taste in the water.

I used some heater hose on my boat a couple of years ago to repair a water line. After a summers use the water started tasting really bad. I ended up replacing the hose with a clear type that was rated for drinking water use.

Sometimes I get really good at doing the job twice!

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Action

Fatt Ratt · 07-09-2002, 10:53 AM

Hey y'all,
The kind of hose you are talking about is tygon tubing, a clear hose for drinking water made for low pressure. The other hose is called nylabraid hose, it has what apears to be small rope like fibers in the plastic tubing, making it very durable.

I believe that finding, repairing with the tygon tubing, then testing for other leaks in the water system is ok for a short time fix. You can use it right now, then repipe the water system later on.

A pressure regulator for yor water system can be found at Campers World. The tygon tubing can be found at Home Depo or any hardware store. - Ray

**Action** · 07-09-2002, 11:22 AM

The hose I used to make my repairs on my boat was nylabraid type. It had the reinforcement in the clear hose. It worked real well and is still in use after about 3 years. I used the boat over the 4th!

>>>>>>>>Action

uwe · 07-09-2002, 07:16 PM

FYI:
We looked at a ton of new trailers before buying the old Airstream. All of them without exception had some of the clear Nylon hose with the ropes running throughit all over the place. They also used tubing similar to the stuff that comes with your icemaker kit for home, onloy bigger in diameter. I prefer the Copper, but would definitely do the easy fix, now that it is summer and time to enjoy the travels. You can always spend long fall and winter nights getting good with the copper stuff.
Uwe

Ira Iburg · 07-12-2002, 01:19 PM

I replaced the hot water heater in our 1978 Excella 500, rear bath. The original plumbing was a bit sad so I purchased new pipe and connectors from Home Depot, then when I wanted to connect the new pipe to the original Airstream pipe there was no way, the coupling went over the new pipe but no way would it go over the original Airstream pipe. I cut off a small piece of the Airstream pipe and found the thickness of the wall to be double the thickness of the Home Depot pipe and no way a standard sleeve would work, the pipe has never been frozen. Back to Home Depot and purchased some high pressure hose and joined the two together, hose rated for 100 lb.

Inland RV Center, In · 07-12-2002, 03:13 PM

Ira.
All copper tubing has standard exterior dimensions, regardless of wall thickness.
When a standard coupling will not fit the copper tubing in any Airstream ever built, there is but one answer.
It at some point in it's life, froze.
While Airstream is an unusual product, they do not use unusual sizes of anything.

Andy

Jim Clark · 07-12-2002, 07:46 PM

In the refrigeration industry, copper tubing and fittings are referred to by their actual measured outside dimension. (In the plumbing industry they are referred to by "nominal" dimensions)

Sounds if you may have purchased refrigeration tubing. You can use a swageing (SP) tool to expand the tubing then slide the new tubing over the old and sweat it together. I repaired all the freeze breaks in my unit this way.

Go here to really get confused.

http://ths.gardenweb.com/forums/load...011823723.html

Simplyspent · 05-30-2006, 05:13 PM

I am remodeling a 1962 Overlander and was pleased to find everything that was original in working order, until I put water into the system. Why I do not refer to this forum regularly is beyond me... Instead of air pressure testing I put water into the city connection and began to discover leak after leak throughout the copper plumbing. Freezing conditions were the likely culprit and after 5-6 patches with tubing segments and radiator clamps... I thought my probelme was solved. It wasn't. The Water heater was shot from ice expansion damage. The solution? I am replacing all the copper with PEX which is a modern plumbing product using a high pressure compression connected brass components. The tubing, fittings and hand tool for compression cost about $300.00 at Home Depot. PEX is used in modern RV's and residential construction where allowed. Accordign to the PEX website it is a materiel resistant to freezing. I am also replacing the water heater with a new one, after this everything should work well. The only downside to a PEX solution is the price of the proprietary compression ring crimping tool is the price...$139.00~ I guess I can always resell it on eBay!

clancy_boy · 05-30-2006, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Simplyspent

I am remodeling a 1962 Overlander and was pleased to find everything that was original in working order, until I put water into the system. Why I do not refer to this forum regularly is beyond me... Instead of air pressure testing I put water into the city connection and began to discover leak after leak throughout the copper plumbing. Freezing conditions were the likely culprit and after 5-6 patches with tubing segments and radiator clamps... I thought my probelme was solved. It wasn't. The Water heater was shot from ice expansion damage. The solution? I am replacing all the copper with PEX which is a modern plumbing product using a high pressure compression connected brass components. The tubing, fittings and hand tool for compression cost about $300.00 at Home Depot. PEX is used in modern RV's and residential construction where allowed. Accordign to the PEX website it is a materiel resistant to freezing. I am also replacing the water heater with a new one, after this everything should work well. The only downside to a PEX solution is the price of the proprietary compression ring crimping tool is the price...$139.00~ I guess I can always resell it on eBay!

Check into renting the tool at a plumbing supply store or at a tool rental center. Before buying it outright, you can also ask a plumber, his fee may be less than $139.00. Make all the connections and cuts then make the compression fittings in one day.

ticki2 · 05-30-2006, 07:15 PM

You can also use black plastic water line sold at HD or most hardware stores . The 1/2" is ID which will fit over the 1/2" OD copper . Warm the end good with a hair dryer and use a hose clamp.

Simplyspent · 06-04-2006, 10:12 PM

Another day, another milestone with my Overlander. All my efforts just to sell the blasted thing! I replumbed the entire unit in White / red (Cold & Hot although I am told there is no chemical difference) PEX tubing. the project moved far faster than I could have imagined. The best thing I discovered is that my water heater works like a champ and nothing inside leaks! I am impressed at how easy PEX is to use. I did discover that the fresh water holding tank is shot, rusted and crusted beyond repair. (the new owner will need to find a new one, I am done sinking money into this bear!) The project has been fun, someday I will tackle my third and final Airstream, my Father-in-Laws 1959 Overlander.
I ended up buying the crimp tool since nobody local rents them. I figure I can sell the tool on eBay for close to what I paid. I can even throw in 50 or so feet of extra red PEX.

Pick · 06-05-2006, 07:51 AM

I do not recommend the "hose over the copper" method of fixing leaks in copper plumbing on Airstreams. This method will eventually come back and haunt you, when you least expect it. Either replace the copper, or use pex. Nothing is worse than spending the day at Disney, only to come back to the campsite, to find water gushing from the back of the coach with soaked carpeting in the bathroom