Replacing Carpet - Bizarre Discovery - ???

[mdeneen]

I am replacing the carpet in my '87 Argosy. Seemed easy enough. I began ripping up the old carpet and to my horror I discovered that the walls of the bath, closet and fridge cabinet are SITTING ON the carpet? HUH? So, the carpet apparently can not be taken up unless I what? remove the entire interior structure pieces?

I guess I can slice as close to the walls as possible, but I can't say I like the idea of all that sitting on the old carpet. Is this the standard construction technique?
mdeneen

[thenewkid64]

Originally Posted by mdeneen

I guess I can slice as close to the walls as possible, but I can't say I like the idea of all that sitting on the old carpet. Is this the standard construction technique?
mdeneen

This is the current way that Airstreams are built. It is less expensive (man hours vs. carpet cost) to carpet the whole trailer, then install the cabinets/furniture. Most owners that redo the flooring do as you are envisioning to get the old stuff out. The new flooring will normally cover the leftover edge and the mounting of the cabinet, etc. should keep the carpet compressed so it does not become an issue.

[85MH325]

Originally Posted by mdeneen

I am replacing the carpet in my '87 Argosy. Seemed easy enough. I began ripping up the old carpet and to my horror I discovered that the walls of the bath, closet and fridge cabinet are SITTING ON the carpet? HUH? So, the carpet apparently can not be taken up unless I what? remove the entire interior structure pieces?

I guess I can slice as close to the walls as possible, but I can't say I like the idea of all that sitting on the old carpet. Is this the standard construction technique?
mdeneen

In a word... yep. (VERY simplified construction order: They build the frame upside down, flip it over and put the floor on, flip it back over and fill the bottom with insulation, then install the bottom and banana wrap. Then it gets flipped over and the shell installed. The windows and wiring are installed. The interior skin is installed, then the carpet and last, the remainder of the interior on top of the carpet.) There may be a little out of order here, but the bottom line is that the carpet is installed as a single piece throughout before any interior pieces are set in and secured. There may be some exceptions, but very few. I know that my motorhome was not carpeted under the bed; however my 34' Limited trailer is!

Roger

[Condoluminum]

We replaced carpeting in our '88 this year, and oroginal carpeting installed at factory across floor prior to installation of much of cabinetry.. We got old out from under front couch, but elected to do trip against bases of cabinets under kitchen and bath...

It's matter of choice to see how much effort it's worth to lift cabines and reseat, knowing new carpet height + or - different padding (factory used pretty thin foam.) won't likley be the same...

Even installation of hardwood or hardwood-like flooring or linoleum will require some decision about baseboard-type treatment where new floor covering doesn't exactly match height of original flooring.

We had new padding and tack strips at same time, and it worked out very well.. Be wary of thick or really plush pile carpet since slider under couch and cabinet doors and sliders in bedroom won't work well if new carpet + pad much thicker than original...

John McG

[mdeneen]

Wow - great responses. Gotta love this forum! Well, I did some hand and knee work with a really sharp curved carpet knife and I suppose I got it pretty well outta there. I darn sure wasn't going to lift all those walls out, although I bet that's a neat job if you do it that way.

I won't be using thick carpet at all. My preference in these applications is the super high grade industrial short nap (hotel carpet) polypropelene. It simply never wears out, never stains and cleans easy. No faom underneath, just a moisture barrier. I find I "trip" on carpet that is too plush too soft. I like it very firm.

Back to work on the floor!
mdeneen

[Tinsel Loaf]

Use a sharp carpet knife and just cut it out, like we did brfore putting down new plywood and vinyl. Check out the picture.

[mdeneen]

Tinsel - you did a neat job there. I'm still working at it. I'm about 98% there. You also have that nice plywood, whereas I have, what-on-earth-do you-call-that-stuff-with-shaved-particles all glued together? Some type of junk sheathing. What amazed me is that after removing all the flooring (and thank heavens the vinyl was simply laid and not glued!) I see not one SEAM in the floor sheathing. Could this possibly be ONE GIGANTIC 8 x 30 piece of sheathing? Amazing.
mdeneen

[thenewkid64]

Originally Posted by mdeneen

You also have that nice plywood, whereas I have, what-on-earth-do you-call-that-stuff-with-shaved-particles all glued together?

OSB Oriented Strand Board

It is one sheet, since it is an engineered floor they could have it made any size they wanted. Unlike plywood that is a standard 4X8.

[mdeneen]

"OSB" - a single sheet? Amazing. Thanks for that answer. As for Star Trek and Carpet - I'm not really sure. I don't recall seeing shots of the floor!
mdeneen

[rluhr]

Originally Posted by mdeneen

My preference in these applications is the super high grade industrial short nap (hotel carpet) polypropelene. It simply never wears out, never stains and cleans easy.

I'm intrigued. Does this type of carpet clean with a vacuum, a broom, or a mop? Can it withstand children tracking in muddy leaves without staining, or beach sand without deep vacuuming?

Tell more! We're evaluating replacement floor options right now and this could be very helpful.

Also, what sorts of suppliers carry this stuff?

[thenewkid64]

Rich,

I have found remnants at small mom and pop carpet stores that sell into the commercial market. Here in Fl they tile most commercial spaces. In the north they carpet them. There are some really neat patterns available and the stuff wears like iron. We did our 77 sovereign in it, lived in it 3 years, sold it to a family member, they had it for 5 years and used it as a hunting cabin. I saw it just before they sold it and the carpet looked like the day I installed it.

It can be swept off if it is the true commercial product.

[JohnG]

When you lay the new floor if there happens to be a little space that you are unhappy with you can pick out a baseboard that matches and you can either glue it in or attach it by another means.

I do agree with the comment about carpet in a camper. Most campgrounds that I go to have a sandy type ground and you end up with sand all in your camper. I prefer to sweep it out rather then to have to vaccuum a dozen times a day.

I have to repalce the floor coverings in my TT as well when I get to that job. I will be tearing out carpet too, and I have decided to replace with Pergo. I think it's thickness will not require any molding around the bottom of the cabinets etc.

[87MH]

Originally Posted by JohnG

..... and I have decided to replace with Pergo. I think it's thickness will not require any molding around the bottom of the cabinets etc.

John:

You will prpbably have to add trim all of the way around anyway.

The laminated flooring I used in the '87 required a "snap" fit, and I was unable to fit the sections that were "wide" final (end) pieces (I used 12" wide Pergo) to much less than a 1/4" to 1/2" gap between the flooring and the vertical (wall, cabinet, frige, etc.). The minimum gap required for installing the final piece varied with the width of the final cut, and the complexity of the final geometry (there are LOTS of ins and outs in the main cabin of the '87).

I used 3/4" quarter round to finish most of the edgings, and was able to cover almost all of the gaps without adding additional kick board trim.

I guess what I'm saying is that to get a good laminate fit you will more likely to be required to use moulding for the horizontal gaps, rather than the vertical difference of the carpet-laminate flooring thickness.

[mdeneen]

Rluhr--
The commercial carpet I refer to is extremely tight and is "closed loop" unlike plush carpet which is open loop (fuzzy on the ends). Because the pile is only 1/4" high it vacuums and sweeps easily. Naturally sweeping is less effective than vacuum.

Mud and dirt just dries on the surface and comes right off. On a plush carpet, the mud penetrates the fibers as a "stain" - this does not happen with commerical carpet because the fibers are not absorbant, and yet, oddly enough the stuff feels soft to the touch. Think of "Polartec Fleece" for a moment. It is made of PLASTIC and yet it is very soft to the touch. The industrial carpeting is made from a similar polypropelene plastic and thus absorbs nothing.

It also is intended to be applied with no pad. Thus it doesn't "cush" or sink where you walk. It remains dead flat and firm and doesn't develop "tracks".
Don't confuse this with "astroturf" or other plastic outdoor carpeting. Not the same at all.

Retail carpet stores rarely have this on display, but they can all get it. It is not cheap at all. Expect to pay about $25/yd midrange for this stuff. being commerical (used in office buildings) the color schemes tend toward subtle, geometric and not like house carpet. But, for my tastes, it is very elegant.

We did our previous house throughout. After 5 years when we sold it, that carpeting looked brand new, no spots, no wear, no tracks, no fade. New.And, that's with 2 dogs running through the house. The stuff is bulletproof.

I definitely see the benefit of a Pergo or other hard flooring, quick sweep up, but for our tastes, it's a bit cold and noisier with the dogs. The one downside to Pergo-style flooring is that you absolutely CAN NOT allow water to stand on the floor for any length of time. It will "raise" the seams and that is irrepairable. Also, Lam floors like Pergo are floating. When I look at my trailer floor, it does not really look "flat enough" for a floating floor.

mdeneen

[Tinsel Loaf]

Here are a couple pictures covering the floor with smooth ply, than making a template to cut out the vinyl.
The vinyl was cut and laid in one 17 +, foot piece.

[Martha]

Originally Posted by mdeneen

Rluhr--
The commercial carpet I refer to is extremely tight and is "closed loop" unlike plush carpet which is open loop (fuzzy on the ends). Because the pile is only 1/4" high it vacuums and sweeps easily. Naturally sweeping is less effective than vacuum.

Mud and dirt just dries on the surface and comes right off. On a plush carpet, the mud penetrates the fibers as a "stain" - this does not happen with commerical carpet because the fibers are not absorbant, and yet, oddly enough the stuff feels soft to the touch. Think of "Polartec Fleece" for a moment. It is made of PLASTIC and yet it is very soft to the touch. The industrial carpeting is made from a similar polypropelene plastic and thus absorbs nothing.
mdeneen

How is this product different than indoor outdoor carpet which is real cheap?
Mind you, I am a hardwood floor person and am just considering carpet for 68 Overlander and screened in porch...
thanks,
Martha