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Buttercup · 04-21-2009, 02:45 PM

Yes, I must also admit deriving some satisfaction from unloading my frustrations on the fridge.

doorgunner · 04-21-2009, 04:25 PM

[quote=Buttercup;689321]
Well, with our old fridge, once you stopped rolling and got all settled out it would work again. Now, the fridge compartment just keeps getting warmer and warmer.

So you actually have a new problem!!

I'm wondering if the harsh ride may have damaged the spiral baffle located behind the flue tube. Then again I recall you having to use mouse traps in your rig, maybe them thar varmits set up shop in there. got a inspection mirror?

Michael beat the bejuzzz out of my fridge coils here at Vine View Heights last fall, had I known he was going to first drink a can of whoopass I' may have had second thoughts. So for me it appears that beating was preventive maint cause things are still working.

Terry - I also installed a 5" muffin fan just below the flue exit under the supervision of Artstream. I see the same 5 degree drop. Have you sealed off the entire flue except where your fan is mounted?

Funny this thread has appeared as I'm doing a HOT weather check of my systems. 93 F outside, 98 F inside trailer 40.3 F in food area of fridge, freezer way cold.

Buttercup · 06-10-2009, 09:26 PM

Just an update - went on a 4 day trip. Elected to NOT run the fridge on the way down - 6+ hours. Kept food in a cooler on ice for the trip down. Started the fridge once we got there and had zero problems. The nfridge worked perfectly for the whole trip.
I mention this because I called the vendor where we bought our axles and mentioned to him our concern that the higher weight axles (3500 lb verses the stock 2800 lb that came with the trailer) were a contributing factor to our fridge problems. He said that he could see no way that this was an issue. I think I have successfully proved that the fridge works when static conditions exist. The last of the issues that could be a problem - those #3500 axles might be part of the problem.
As a note, that vendor told me that he could see no way the stiffer axles could be an issue. But, all I see leads to this fact..... The fridge works - even without burping or all the manual things I might need to do to just get it to work. Drove home from that trip with the fridge in service. After 6 hours of driving, same old thing - fridsge temperature at 50 degrees. Should have been better.
Also, I tried to get a new set of #2800 axles from this vendor - but he has none in stock. That means that I might be out of luck for International.
Does anybody know if the Henschen axles are THAT worth it? Or should I look at switching to something else - Dexter perhaps????

richinny · 06-11-2009, 08:55 AM

i don't think it's the axles. you seem to indicate similar issues with the old fridge. were the axles done before the fridge was replaced?

can you put an hour meter on the power lead to the igniter? that would tell you how long the igniter fires when you are traveling. i don't know if they make a 'minute meter'. :-)

since so many folks have talked about having their pilots blow out while traveling, i'd focus on that. even without a properly sealed compartment, wind and circulation can be a devil. if anything, working to seal/vent that area would sure be easier than swapping axles again.

Buttercup · 06-12-2009, 02:15 PM

No, the old axles had been replaced before we ever took our first trip - they were done for!
I do have an update. Went on a trip and just left the fridge off until we got to our destination. We kept our food in a cooler with ice. Once we got to our destination I turned on the fridge running it on gas. by morning it was at temperature and we loaded it up. It worked fine the entire time we were parked. We left it on for the 6 hour return trip home and sure enough - the temperature went up 10 degrees by the time we got home.
I have not tried monitoring the igniter and that is an excellent idea. I will look at seing if there is a way to monitor that indirectly in some way. There is just one thing though - once the fridge stops working, like after being on the road, experience has shown me that it will not improve once we hit the road again, it just keeps getting worse and worse. Only thing that fixes it seems to be just shutting it down and letting it all thaw out and then restarting it up.

Excella CM · 06-12-2009, 04:31 PM

Since these units depend upon convection (hot air rising due to being less dense) to operate, it wouldn't be surprising if it were found that stray air currents induced by the motion of the trailer were back-winding the refrigerator and causing it to lose efficiency? You could jerry-rig a chimney fan for a trip and see if that mitigates the problem.

Buttercup · 06-15-2009, 05:16 PM

So I am pulling this all apart to get it all fixed as best as I can before going to International.
The three pictures show what I believe is part of the problem. The three pictures are as follows: all pictures are looking aft with the fridge on the right hand side
floorlevel.jpg shows that the trailer is leaning down towards the fridge. That is the best I can do in my driveway.
freezerlevel.jpg shows the level of the icebox. That is the point that is supposed to be level with respect to the floor according to the installation guides and diagnostic manuals from Dometic that I was able to find. notice that the fridge is leaning towards the left side of the trailer. What this means at this point is that when the trailer is level, as in going down the road, the fridge leans even more to the left (curbeside). Basically, the fridge is REALLY not level.
evaplevel.jpg is the picture taken from the evaporator in the freezer compartment itself. Here is where I believe the problem is greatest. With the fridge leaning towards the left the evaporator is leaning downward and therefore is not draining completely. In other words, if the fridge were properly level along with the trailer, the evaporator would drain downwards (towards the back). I suspect that due to improper drainage, fluid is collecting in the evaporator restricting flow. This reduction in flow is effecting the fridge compartment temperature because there is just not enough ammonium flow to cool it. Not to mention the imbalance of ammonium to hydrogen caused by ammonia being trapped in the evaporator could also reduce it's efficiency.

O.K. Sorry if the pictures are not in the correct order.

doorgunner · 06-15-2009, 06:10 PM

Yet you say the fridge recently worked....
Did you level the floor or the fridge?
Stick a big fat wad of gum over the drain and go for a drive, see what happens.
I think the cold air is being sucked out of the fridge, as much as I want the axles!!

Buttercup · 06-15-2009, 08:02 PM

That is an interesting suggestion

. But the fact remains that once the fridge stops working, it stops until it is turned off and all thawed out, it works again - mostly.
I am struggling because I looked closely at the mounting surfaces at they all seem level with respect to the trailer itself. And I have to believe that the trailer is going down the road level enough - except the fact that the hitch height for the trailer with respect to the hensley and the receiver on the H2 causes the trailer to lean towards the rear. This despite the fact that the Hensley tow bar is the longest that Hensley makes.
The real question is how level is level enough.

In removing the fridge today, I discovered that the fridge was only held in by one bolt on the floor and whatever was in the sides, most of which was not actually grabbing any wood or anything for that matter. The shop we had that installed in, Mountain Family RV in Reno, Nevada has of course gone out of business. The job they did putting both our Fridge and Air Conditioner was so poor that 3 years ago when we had it done, we swore we would never go back. That Fridge was hanging on by a thread, or one bolt for that matter. Not to mention the broken wheel well and various other little things they did (like a big 'ol greezy pay print on out curtains).

Tinsel Loaf · 06-15-2009, 08:04 PM

I just don't think being that much out of plum would cause this problem all the time. There must be another answer for it not working while in travel. I don't have an answer but your problem just bugs me.

**azflycaster** · 06-15-2009, 08:19 PM

Hard to tell from the pictures, but it looks like the wheel well behind the fridge has a good size hole in it. Could you be getting a blast of air through that hole when going down the road?

Mike Leary · 06-15-2009, 08:54 PM

Out of level going down the road is no big deal, level at campsite is also not a big deal. You gotta be WAY OFF, in which case a good night's sleep is impossible. Both Coleman and Dometic state that in their literature. Is it running on 12-volt or propane when traveling?

Buttercup · 06-16-2009, 09:38 AM

No, The hole doesn't penetrate the wheel well, lust between the inside and fiberglass insulation.

Quote:

Originally Posted by azflycaster

Hard to tell from the pictures, but it looks like the wheel well behind the fridge has a good size hole in it. Could you be getting a blast of air through that hole when going down the road?

Mike,

I know! it shouldn't make a difference. But something does. I do not believe that it is the pilot light going out because once it stops working it stops. I also suspect what could be called "mechanical priming" whereby the water in the fridge is being atomized due to vibration caused by those #3500 (verses the stock #2800) axles we have. I was assured that that can not possibly be the problem.

I am calling Dometic today to get the scoop - I will tell you all what the outcome is.

Gkiesel · 06-16-2009, 11:14 AM

I would really doubt that your new axles are causing the problems your seeing. It is more likely an airflow condition over the evaporator while in motion. Are you operating on 12 volt or gas while driving? It sounds like the fridge is getting gas bound while driving. Which i believe is caused by improper airflow over the evaporator. Instead of the airflowing up the chimney pipe as when at rest, it is flowing under the trailer while at speed. This happened to a few years back. I thought the fridge was shot, but it just needed to completly defrost and cool down, and then worked fine. I've heard of people actually having to remove the fridge and turn them upside down to burp them. To this day I don't travel with the propane on. We pack the true perishibles in an ice cooler and use ice packs in the fridge to keep it cool. Also, driving with the flame on is very dangerous. God forbid that thing catches fire you won't even know it until you see flames in the rear view mirror.

doorgunner · 06-16-2009, 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gkiesel

getting gas bound while driving. .

That happens to me from time to time, thank goodness for rest stops.
Smile buttercup, just adding a little humor.

VIKING · 06-16-2009, 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buttercup

I am struggling because I looked closely at the mounting surfaces at they all seem level with respect to the trailer itself. And I have to believe that the trailer is going down the road level enough - except the fact that the hitch height for the trailer with respect to the hensley and the receiver on the H2 causes the trailer to lean towards the rear.

If you have a constant lean towards the rear when traveling you could have a situation where the gas/ fluid isn't flowing through the coils. It sounds like the problem only occurs when traveling, so It makes sense to me to check it out more thoroughly. Is it possible to borrow a tow vehicle with the correct hitch height for your Airstream to tow level, and take it for a ride?
Also, I have a hatch on the bottom of my Safari under the refer, to allow combustion air to enter. It's about 6" by 24", and has a screen on it to keep critters out. It seems to me that it would blow too much air when moving down the highway, or create a suction effect that would pull hot air down from the burner. I don't know if this is typical or not.
It sounds from your description of the problem, that it is not a lack of heat from the burner, as it wouldn't need to rest to recover from that. It sounds more like a flow problem causing a blockage in the coils. That would take time to recover from.
Waddayathink?
Rich

dlb435 · 06-16-2009, 02:12 PM

Absorption chillers can not work when the trailer is in motion. You will end up with the hydrogen gas mixed in with the ammonia coolant. That is why hitting the coils works. The fluid is tapped to the bottom and the cooling cycle can run.
You noted that when you did not run the unit until you got to the camp site, everything worked fine. This is normal. The best way to use the chiller is to let it run for about 24 hours at home before you leave. Load it up with your cold items and turn it off. If the door is kept closed, food will keep cold for up to 48 hours.
DO NOT restart the chiller until the trailer is still and level. I don't think you have any problems at all. You just need to opperate the unit as it was designed to be used.
Check this link for a nice diagram of the system:
Greenline » What is an Absorption Chiller?

wkerfoot · 06-16-2009, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dlb435

Absorption chillers can not work when the trailer is in motion. ...

Then why does Dometic make and sell a three way refrigerator, 12V, 110V and Propane?

Bill

Gene · 06-17-2009, 10:59 AM

My understanding is that they work while moving because the movement keeps the process operating and that's true even when the unit is far from level—going up and down hills, off camber roads. I have also read the newer refrigerators are less sensitive about being out of level than the older ones.

We've not had any problems with ours and 1 1/2 years and 14,000 miles. We leave it on all the time and it maintains a reasonably constant temp of 39˚. When the outside temp goes up to around 90˚, the refrigerator runs at 40-41˚.

On the other hand, a friend got a new one a year or two ago and had a lot of problems and eventually Dometic replaced it. I believe it was one of the 3 way ones and I seem to have read there are more problems with them than the 2 way ones. We have a 2 way.

Gene

Buttercup · 06-17-2009, 11:59 AM

These units ARE designed to be operated down the road. In fact the tech I spoke with yesterday echoed that. And he also confirmed that the problem is likely NOT a problem of combustion, but rather blockage. As of yet he has not heard of a unit ever suffering from mechanical priming due to vibration.
So the final answer is the leveling of the unit. He recommended leveling the unit based on the freezer compartment, as is discussed in the diagnostics manual. That I will have completed shortly.
But there is one other leveling issue - the fore to aft level. When the trailer is hitched to the TV, the trailer does slightly lean towards the rear. Our tow combination is a Hummer H2 with a Hensley and the longest tow bar they make. I have not thought of this until yesterday and now suspect that it is likely to be a contributor. This seems to be a situation I can do little about at this time.
Just a side note, I did go ahead and "burp" the unit per instructions received by a forums members. It took about a half an hour to do it on all sides and top and then gently roll it around to get all the liquid to settle. I will put it back in as soon as I have the space all baffled and sealed.