'74 Argosy 20' Motorhome restoration/rebuild

[bkahler]

While searching for information on rebuilding the rear drum brakes on the Argosy I ran across this website. I found it to be extremely helpful while re-assembling the backing plates.

Drum brake assembly tutorial

Brad

[shepherd57]

Hi Brad

Where did you get your brake parts from and were they expensive.Is Your 20ft on a P30 chassis would my 26 rear end be the same as yours.I checked here last fall and the rear shoes were quite expensive.

The weather is a little warmer today I will try to get those parts together. The widow latches will be different than the ones on your 20 ft. I have the same latch pins that you have. The 77 has the latches in the center of the slider.

John

[bkahler]

Originally Posted by shepherd57

Hi Brad

Where did you get your brake parts from and were they expensive.Is Your 20ft on a P30 chassis would my 26 rear end be the same as yours.I checked here last fall and the rear shoes were quite expensive.

The weather is a little warmer today I will try to get those parts together. The widow latches will be different than the ones on your 20 ft. I have the same latch pins that you have. The 77 has the latches in the center of the slider.

John

John,

As far as I know all of the Argosies where built on the P30 chassis.

I got my brake parts from RockAuto.com for $56 for the set of shoes which covered both sides. On sale from a manufacturers close-out. They are Wagner heavy duty shoes.

I took a quick glance for a 75 chassis and the price varies depending on whether you have 13" x 3-1/2" or 15" x 4" brakes. The close-out price is still available for the 13" shoes, 15" shoes are around $133 to $150.

The rear wheel cylinders I got from Napa (37337 for 13" x 3-1/2" brakes) were $20 for the pair.

I don't mind switching to the later style of latches. All I would have to do is remove the flat latch plate on the back edge of the window and the pin becomes a non-issue.

When you say warmer today do you mean above 0 (degrees F) or above freezing (32-degrees F) ?!

Thanks!

Brad

[shepherd57]

No 21 degrees F

I think you would have to replace the complete window and frame because the latch is completely different. I got everything together and took pics I will send as soon as I get them off the camera.

John

[bkahler]

Originally Posted by shepherd57

No 21 degrees F

To cold for me!

I think you would have to replace the complete window and frame because the latch is completely different. I got everything together and took pics I will send as soon as I get them off the camera.

John

Got the pictures thanks.

From what I have seen comparing our 310 to the Argosy the glass itself is the same, the difference is in the latch mechanisms. I believe the 77 glass can be used in the 74 frame. At the moment my major concern is the fixed pane which as you say the entire frame has to come out so the easiest would be to just swap entire frames.

Now to wait for warmer weather.

Brad

[Keyair]

Great Link Brad!
That link is identical to the C/K series rear drums I think.
Our '73 Blazer just never stopped well and I ended up putting it in Non-Op and storage because it worried me... I bled and bled, and inspected the drums and discs, replaced the master cyl and booster, but never spotted leaks anything wrong.
A closer examination last year, and some storage driving and braking showed me that it would pull to the right but still the stopping was way below acceptable. I quick test with a non contact IR Thermometer showed little heating of the LH rear drum.
I pulled it apart and inspected it carefully and discovered that the PO had miss-assembled the little T pieces(he calls them push-rods) that goes between brake cylinder and the forward brake shoe... when the brakes were applied it was sliding behind the shoe...
I reassembled it correctly, and it now stops on a dime!
The point I am trying to make is that the rear brakes on these somehow dictate how effective the whole system is... and it needs to be right.
I was shocked to realize that a lack of braking on one rear drum degraded the whole braking system to maybe 20%... it was barely possible to lock the wheels on gravel before I fixed the problem.

[wxbuoy]

Key,

Can you put a pick up of what you are talking about? I would like to add that to my "need to check" list. Thanks!

[bkahler]

Steve, you are correct those are CK brakes in pictures. What's interesting is even though they aren't Bendix brakes which is what is on my Argosy, they still look virtually identical to the Bendix brakes. Following the picture sequence it was a breeze to assemble the Bendix brakes.

There is one reason I may have to take them back apart and that is because I may not be able to snake the parking brake cable in through the back plate to where it hooks on the lever. I'm keeping my fingers crossed. I felt it was worth the chance and even if I have to dismantle them and start over, at least this way I've done it once on the work bench and hopefully that will help if I have to redo them.

In searching for information on how to assemble them I ran across a lot of posts form people describing how theirs had been mis-assembled by previous owners and the associated problems that occurred from those mistakes. So you're not alone there!

Brad

[bkahler]

Originally Posted by wxbuoy

Key,

Can you put a pick up of what you are talking about? I would like to add that to my "need to check" list. Thanks!

Dave, you're lucky, you don't have drum brakes on your coach. Airstream switched to disc brakes on the rear I believe when the Classic series came out.

I wish I had disc brakes all around but unfortunately I don't

Brad

[wxbuoy]

Brad,

Thanks! Haven't had a chance to look at anything with the weather here lately! Yuk, it is either raining, sleeting, or just plain miserable!!

[bkahler]

Originally Posted by wxbuoy

Brad,

Thanks! Haven't had a chance to look at anything with the weather here lately! Yuk, it is either raining, sleeting, or just plain miserable!!

You won't get wet if you're under the motorhome checking this stuff out

Fortunately (or unfortunately depending on your perspective) I have enough work inside and out so depending on the weather I can still find something to do.

This weekend we're supposed to have sunshine and temps in the 40s so I'm hoping to get a bunch of outside work done. That's the hope anyway!

Brad

[bkahler]

I made some progress on the rear brakes today. Got the left side backing plate bolted in place and the parking brake connected. Also managed to get the right side backing plate off, sand blasted and painted. Should be ready to assemble sometime this weekend.



After making progress on the brakes I decided it was time to pull the inside a/c shroud to see if I could see where the persistent drip was coming from. What I found was a real mess

Whoever installed the a/c unit just removed a ceiling vent and slapped the a/c unit on the roof. There was no structural support so when they tightened down the three long bolts they just crushed the ceiling and roof together



Worse, there is NO drain tube And there doesn't appear to be one installed. I did find a 1/2" plastic tube hanging down in the left side near the wheel well that I'm assuming is a drain tube that goes to the rear roof vent area.

So, tomorrow I'll be pulling the roof top unit off and see what I can do about adding in a couple of rib sections salvaged from the 345.

As far as the drain tube goes, if there is one at the rear vent area I'll try snaking a section of hose from the a/c pan across the ceiling down to the rear vent area and connect the two together.

Needless to say the day sort of ended on on a down note

Brad

[ViewRVs]

Brad,

My Argosy 20 does have a drain tube. My AC does NOT have a drain pan so I am not using it. I built a frame from 2x2 lumber and shims. I assembled the frame in the cut-out. The AC unit then tightened down around the wood frame and did not compress the two aluminum skins. The only improvement would have been to run the east-west 2x2 all the way to the frame for better support. Right now it sits on the roof and ceiling sheets. Not perfect but effective. No leaks. Of course filling the other 56 rivet holes left open helped that also!

[bkahler]

Fred, what brand/model A/C unit do you have? I just assumed they all used a drain tube. I'm not overly excited about replacing the A/C with a new one at this time but when I do eventually replace it it's nice to know there are models out there that don't need the drain tube.

Assuming I do have a drain tube by the rear vent and since I will need to pull the vent housing in order to get access to the tube this might be the perfect time to replace the old vent with a Fantastic fan

Maybe every cloud does have a silver lining

Brad

[ViewRVs]

I have a Duo-Therm Brisk Air. It may be overkill for such a small unit. I am not aware of a drip pan for an Airstream/Argosy for the Duo Therm model.

Look into the Carrier Air-V. I think they are less expensive.

[bkahler]

Originally Posted by ViewRVs

I have a Duo-Therm Brisk Air. It may be overkill for such a small unit. I am not aware of a drip pan for an Airstream/Argosy for the Duo Therm model.

Look into the Carrier Air-V. I think they are less expensive.

Fred, Carrier apparently is out of the RV air conditioner business. It looks like for about $550 delivered I could get a Duo-Therm Brisk Air 13.5k unit. I wonder if replacing the A/C unit with a new Duo-Therm right now would be a smarter thing to do than buying the Fantastic vent now and keeping the older Coleman unit (which I don't know if it even works). I think one of the things I'll do tomorrow is power up the Coleman unit and see if it actually works. If it does it could be saved as a spare for the 310 since it has two of the Coleman's installed.

Decisions decisions

Brad

[Smartstream]

When I changed my A/C I bought a Carrier low profile. It has been a few years so I have forgotten many of the details. There was somebody here on the forums who had made the swap so I followed his instructions. Basically the old unit I believe was a Coleman, used a base/drip pan the size of the unit with about a 1" vertical lip around the edge. The Carrier didn't use a pan, just a gasket on the roof. The instruction was to cut most of the pan away just leaving enough to fit the new gasket. Climbing on the roof I grabbed my tin snips prepared to trim the pan. I was surprised to find the pan was plastic. Made the trimming very easy.

I also built a couple of wood fillers similar to what Fred did, set the unit on top and held up the inside cover and installed and tightened the four bolts. There was a drain hose that I just attached to the Carrier. It was very simple and using the old pan eliminated trying to fit the flat A/C to the curved roof.

[bkahler]

Originally Posted by Smartstream

When I changed my A/C I bought a Carrier low profile. It has been a few years so I have forgotten many of the details. There was somebody here on the forums who had made the swap so I followed his instructions. Basically the old unit I believe was a Coleman, used a base/drip pan the size of the unit with about a 1" vertical lip around the edge.

That's the same drip pan that was on the 345 and is currently on the 310 and was on the Argosy. This morning I pulled the air conditioner from the roof and found that the drip pan was in horrible condition. It's busted in a variety of places and it looks like along the front and part of one side they used Liquid Nails to hold it in place That was a nightmare to get off.



I'm a little confused as to why they put the foam seal on the bottom side of the pan instead of the top side. The 345 & 310 had the seal on top. The whole installation on the Argosy just seemed to be botched.

I will however give them style points because they did use Duct Tape to help seal it

The Carrier didn't use a pan, just a gasket on the roof. The instruction was to cut most of the pan away just leaving enough to fit the new gasket. Climbing on the roof I grabbed my tin snips prepared to trim the pan. I was surprised to find the pan was plastic. Made the trimming very easy.

I'm not sure what was gained by using part of the drip pan. If the Carrier didn't have a condensate drain connection I don't see the benefit of cutting out part of the old pan

I bought a DuoTherm Brisk Air 13.5k air conditioner and it's my understanding all I should have to do is set the gasket in place and then set the air conditioner down on top and bolt in place from inside. The condensate just runs off the roof. Am I missing something?

I also built a couple of wood fillers similar to what Fred did, set the unit on top and held up the inside cover and installed and tightened the four bolts. There was a drain hose that I just attached to the Carrier. It was very simple and using the old pan eliminated trying to fit the flat A/C to the curved roof.

Like I said above I'm confused as to why you needed the drip pan for the Carrier.

I'm not sure whether I'm going to make a wood frame or use parts of the ribs I salvaged from the 345. I've got a few days to worry about that problem.

Brad

[bkahler]

In case some of you were wondering how I got the air conditioner off the roof by myself



Brad

[ViewRVs]

Originally Posted by bkahler

I bought a DuoTherm Brisk Air 13.5k air conditioner and it's my understanding all I should have to do is set the gasket in place and then set the air conditioner down on top and bolt in place from inside. The condensate just runs off the roof. Am I missing something?

Brad

That's it! That was my solution. It just drips down the side of the coach like rain and the morning dew. Just don't forget the internal framing enhancements!

In some cases, the drain pans get clogged (mold, mildew, bees, etc.) and the condensation runs down the side anyways.