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Old 12-20-2006, 11:05 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wkerfoot
Jim,

It is an email list on Yahoo moderated by Hunter Hampton. The group can be found here: AirstreamList : The original Airstream discussion list... you don't need to own one to join.
That list seems old fashioned compared to AS forums format. I no longer use it. The same questions are asked over and over again as the format of the list is via email. The discussion history isn't organized / assessible / searchable so it is difficult to use compared to AS forums format. IMHO, it was THE list of the times when it first came out but now the AS forums is the place to be to find/post information.
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Old 12-20-2006, 11:29 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rebfa
That list seems old fashioned compared to AS forums format. I no longer use it. The same questions are asked over and over again as the format of the list is via email. The discussion history isn't organized / assessible / searchable so it is difficult to use compared to AS forums format. IMHO, it was THE list of the times when it first came out but now the AS forums is the place to be to find/post information.
It may be old fashioned, but it, along with the VAC list, were my first exposure to other Airstreamers and many people are only on those two lists. I like to keep in contact with all of them.


New friends are silver, but old friends are gold.

Bill
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Old 12-20-2006, 12:07 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rebfa
That list seems old fashioned compared to AS forums format. I no longer use it. The same questions are asked over and over again as the format of the list is via email. The discussion history isn't organized / assessible / searchable so it is difficult to use compared to AS forums format. IMHO, it was THE list of the times when it first came out but now the AS forums is the place to be to find/post information.
rebfa -- I think the list format (Yahoo, etc.) remains because it's easier for some fulltimers and others with limited internet access and connection time to login and download the listmail, then answer offline and go back online to load up their message.

I'm like you though -- I don't like the list format at all and I much prefer the format, management, and community of the ASforums.

- J
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Old 12-20-2006, 01:27 PM   #32
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65GT's response yesterday.

Leo,

I don't think I have ever read a more impassioned positive support for the WBCCI than you wrote yesterday. I couldn't have said it better myself.

Vic Smith
President, Florida Unit 027.
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Old 12-20-2006, 02:26 PM   #33
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It seems that the question is based on the experience in these forums and not out in the real world. I think there is a need to be careful when using 'virtual' rather than actual to worry about WBCCI.

The 4CU is a case in point. From what I can tell, its affiliation with WBCCI is getting ironed out. It needs to show that it is forming from an appropriate motivation and that it is an actual rather than a virtual group.
They are doing this although much of the participation I see at this point is for spite and not for collegiality. That will remain a worry.

That is related to lauding 'forum rallies' - I see no way that a forum rally can be other than a special event. WBCCI depends upon frequent gatherings of Airstream RV enthusiasts out using their rigs. It manages a 20% member participation at its annual conference over the long term. When 'forum rallies' can approach those kinds of numbers, it might elevate the idea to something other than a special interest group.

The 4CU and Constitution threads are solid testimony to what is wrong with these forums. Rational discussion of ideas? Forget it. Courteous discussion? Forget it. - but the phenomena is well known going back to the early days of UseNet and CompuServe.

The fact is that WBCCI is not as it is often portrayed in these forums and by some in this thread. What you see are the anomolies - the kind that hurt everyone. WBCCI does have its fossils, it does have traditions, it does have its share of jerks. - But it also has its vibrant corners and it does have many responsible citizens and lots of plain good folks.

Change is happening where it counts and for reasons that make it effective and long lasting. If you look, you can see the WBCCI Code of Ethics showing up where it makes a difference. Let us hope it will show up more in these discussions, too.

Quote:
To be ever mindful of our responsibility to Wally Byam Caravan Club International, Inc., and through conduct, indicate to the public that membership in this organization is an assurance of our courtesy on the road and good will to all peoples and countries.

To be ever mindful of what we say or print with respect to the effect on others so as to avoid disharmony and ill feelings among club members and to dedicate ourselves to the work of cementing together the members of WBCCI in bonds of good fellowship and mutual understanding.

To conduct ourselves in a manner to inspire others engaged in recreational vehicle travel to a full appreciation of the intent and meaning of this code.

To maintain our camps in an orderly manner and leave them in the same way.
Let's keep the heat down, the tolerance for ideas up, and the personalities off the table. That way we can keep our camps, and our forum discussions, better when they end. WBCCI will grow, fellowship and mutual understanding will be enhanced, and a lot of folks who don't dare treat these forums might just feel it is safe enough to step in and say something.
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Old 12-20-2006, 02:45 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 65GT
If you don't like what's local get a bunch of AS friends together and start a new unit.

Members, and some current non-members, tried to start a new unit and have thusfar been denied by the Officers of Region 11. Some of those involved have completely given up on the idea due to the closed mindedness of the written opinions in the denial letter. quote from dscluchfc

65gt--it sounds good to say just go start a new unit but as you can see this just isn't possible, at least without so much discourageing resistance that many < myself included > feel it just isn't worth it.

Become activly involved in your unit, work up the ranks, throw your hat in the ring for a region office. What I have read is a whole bunch of complaints and no one stepping up to help:::Quote from dsluchfc

Dave --Just how long would you estimate it would take a young, new member to become a regional officer??? I figure if I threw my "hat in the ring" I would be about 137 years old and the first thing on my agenda as a new officer would be to introduce an ammendment allowing wheel chains with Airstream badges to be accepted in the club.---pieman
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Old 12-20-2006, 03:12 PM   #35
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I think the WBCCI will transform to the identity of it's new generation of members.

Boomers like me are not as much for regimentation and rules as their parents. (A baseball cap maybe, but definitely no beret.)

Different values based on their environment. The Depression, World War II, etc.

That said, what will the Boomers do to make WBCCI reflect their values? Feedback, please! And then, what about when the Gen X, Y and Z come along?
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Old 12-20-2006, 06:21 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rickandsandi
Become activly involved in your unit, work up the ranks, throw your hat in the ring for a region office. What I have read is a whole bunch of complaints and no one stepping up to help
The above quote is attributed to me in post #36 by Mike Lewis.

It is in fact rickandsandi's quote from post #20..
Thanks for noting the correction.
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Old 12-20-2006, 07:03 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Lewis
Quote:
Originally Posted by 65GT
If you don't like what's local get a bunch of AS friends together and start a new unit.

Members, and some current non-members, tried to start a new unit and have thusfar been denied by the Officers of Region 11. Some of those involved have completely given up on the idea due to the closed mindedness of the written opinions in the denial letter.
I don't want to open a can of worms not knowing the details but If they have not acted in the best interest of the organization is their a procedure for redress of an individual chapters decision to the national board?

Moreover, if their decision was arbitrary and or capricious their may be grounds for legal intervention.
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Old 12-20-2006, 11:27 PM   #38
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I am sure the 4CU will proceed with or without the WBCCI....
just as I will proceed with or without the WBCCI.

I have played the organizational politics game professionally on a much higher level than WBCCI, and am not in the mood to play it with my recreational time.

There will either be a Unit that I would join that is affiliated with WBCCI, or there won't be a WBCCI affiliated Unit to join....
It really makes no difference to me if 4CU is chartered by WBCCI or not.
I am going camping regardless, and will vote with my feet and checkbook since it is the only vote I have.
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Old 12-21-2006, 08:25 AM   #39
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Being more disposed to being an anarchist than any political affiliation, I was drawn to the 4CU because of its "different strokes for different folks" attitude. It is not important what affiliation the 4CU obtains to me unless the affiliations means that I can play with the unit anynore.
The generation before me seems to need identifiable connections to organizations that have rules. That's nice... it makes them happy.
My daily life has enough rule based bull&*%^ so when I'm on the road I' looking for "no worries".
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Old 12-21-2006, 08:40 AM   #40
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WBCCI will survive! The upcoming leadership is very progressive, and will make a difference. 4CU will likely be approved at the IBT meeting in February.
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Old 12-21-2006, 09:07 AM   #41
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I am an officer in a large Corporation. I have no interest in extending corporate politics into my weekends or vacations. For this reason I do not belong to formal recreational organizations.

This forum provides a community for people with an interest in Airstream. We share information, join locals for lunch, or gather at a Forum rally. All with minimal structure. I call it fun, relaxing, informative...

I believe this is a trend, enabled by the Internet. I participate in other Internet forums relating to my Audi and Porsche cars, and my old Honda motorcycle. This is the future... organizations like WBCCI are the past, and they will slowly fade away.
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Old 01-20-2007, 08:53 AM   #42
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Did the Four Winds blow away the Four Corners Unit?

Quote:
WBCCI will survive! The upcoming leadership is very progressive, and will make a difference. 4CU will likely be approved at the IBT meeting in February.
According to the agenda published on the WBCCI web site, the 4CU was up for approval at the IBT. I didn't see anything about the motor home study committee.

I see that the IBT approved the Four Winds motor home for WBCCI membership but I haven't seen anything yet about the Four Corners Unit.
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