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Old 07-04-2018, 11:58 AM   #43
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Tow Ratings

It's also valuable to know the SAEJ2807 towing tests that are used to set towing "limits".
Some may fit your criteria for "safety". Other drivers more are comfortable with knowing what is acceptable to them in terms of those tests
http://www.trucktrend.com/how-to/tow...-the-standard/
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Old 07-04-2018, 12:13 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by upnorththree View Post
I'm not one for throwing barbs so just accept this sincerely.

I was a GM guy for over 45 years. I bought this RAM 1500 Diesel and I don't know if I'll ever return to GM.

My 2015 Laramie EcoDiesel's numbers are very close to your 150. It has four corner air suspension bags. It is all steel. It has every bell and whistle known to man kind including a button that drops the vehicle to curb level height for easier entry and exit.

Once I posted my BEST (and probably ever) MPG was 30 with full payload but NOT towing anything. I thought that was world's best until another streamer posted getting 32 MPG.

Which leads me to this question. With our tow numbers being nearly identical, all steel vs. all aluminum, and my 30 MPG vs. your 23.7, why isn't Ford giving you 40 MPG (give or take)?

Again, I'm being sincere, not picking.

(Retired and never worked for any auto or auto-related firms.)
At 500 miles, his transmission is barely trained and the engine is nowhere near broken in. There's also no way of knowing (without a LOT more information) if your best-ever MPG on one trip is at all comparable to the driving he's been doing those 500 miles.
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Old 07-04-2018, 12:45 PM   #45
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I like the f250. We have the f150 I like the 6.2 w 8,500# tow. You can add airbags to improve loaded ride and a stability. We also have a f250 and f dually. But this the powerful f150 can be a good fit for 31 foot.
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Old 07-04-2018, 05:17 PM   #46
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I'm really not looking tobargie with anybody on here, mostly looking for advice, but if payload is just a "marketing number" wouldn't it already be inflated? And yes, mist things are engineered with a safety margin built in, usually about 10% or so. Just seems very odd that people would intentionally overload their TV.
I think your are right that overloading ’anything’ is not only odd but usually unsafe and can anger the manufacturers warrantee department and can bring joy to lawyers far and wide.

I’m glad to see that you are not only finding some ‘facts’ here, but also finding some ‘opinions’ too. Just note the difference.

All of the big three truck makes and many other vehicle can do a good job of towing as long as weight limits are followed. I think that truck frames are better suited to towing than unibody designs. I’m sure that some will disagree.

My personal choice is a Chevy 2500HD with Duramas Diesel towing a 25 ft airstream with a Reese Dual Cam Sway Control hitch. Maybe a little overkill, but I like it.

Your choice of the F150 will do a good job within the specified limits, and probably well beyond. Under good conditions, overloads just shorten the life of equipment: Under adverse conditions, it will test your abilities, your pain tolerance and your own lawyers talent.

Welcome to the forum and happy trailering.

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Old 07-04-2018, 06:47 PM   #47
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The new 150 diesel has a towing capacity of just under 12 K, payload of around 2500. Torque is about 450 ft lbs, I had hoped it would be higher. Unfortunately it does not have the 36 gallon tank available, only 26. It will prob get arouy 15 mpg pulling a 7500 lb trailer. I'll be curious if aftermarket people can swap out the 36 gallon tank.

I've been kicking around the idea of getting one. Currently pulling a 27 Globetrotter, 7500 lbs with a Porsche Cayenne. Works well and we average about 18 if we keep it under 70. Having the truck bed would be nice.
Where exactly do you get the 2500 payload number from? According to the door sticker on my 150ndiesel my payload is 1146..
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Old 07-04-2018, 06:55 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by upnorththree View Post
I'm not one for throwing barbs so just accept this sincerely.

I was a GM guy for over 45 years. I bought this RAM 1500 Diesel and I don't know if I'll ever return to GM.

My 2015 Laramie EcoDiesel's numbers are very close to your 150. It has four corner air suspension bags. It is all steel. It has every bell and whistle known to man kind including a button that drops the vehicle to curb level height for easier entry and exit.

Once I posted my BEST (and probably ever) MPG was 30 with full payload but NOT towing anything. I thought that was world's best until another streamer posted getting 32 MPG.

Which leads me to this question. With our tow numbers being nearly identical, all steel vs. all aluminum, and my 30 MPG vs. your 23.7, why isn't Ford giving you 40 MPG (give or take)?

Again, I'm being sincere, not picking.

(Retired and never worked for any auto or auto-related firms.)
I would start by saying I'm still breaking it in, varying speed all the time, not driv8ng for fuel economy, etc. At 800 miles up to 24.0 mpg, also just got the tonneau cover on so that should help a bit too. Next question, my 150 is 4x4, is the Dodge? Then of course city vs highway driving, just so many variables to consider when doing a 1 on 1 comparison like this. I would love 40 mpg, but I'm still impressed with the 24 though, and like the 600 mile range it's calling for on a full tank. Obviously that will change while towing though
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Old 07-04-2018, 10:36 PM   #49
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Payload ratings for the new Ford F150 diesel ranges 1150 to 1450 depending on options. The original specs in Jan 2018 called for 2020 payload, but Ford now reports lower payload numbers. These payload numbers are considerably less than standard F150 models.

The F150 diesel, appears to be mainly marketing in the high end Lariat, Platinum and King Ranch models. I like the new 10 speed transmission and 25+ MPG highway ratings.
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Old 07-04-2018, 11:00 PM   #50
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This from CNET review on F150 diesel King Ranch model 4x4.

A*2018 Ford F-150*King Ranch 4x4 SuperCrew Diesel is equipped with a 157-inch wheelbase and 3.55 rear axle ratio. This specific truck model is estimated to return 25 mpg highway, tow 11,400 pounds and carry 1,268 pounds of payload.

The 3.0-liter engine makes 250 horsepower and 440 pound-feet of torque, mated to a 10-speed automatic transmission.
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Old 07-05-2018, 06:06 AM   #51
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Ford's early release data. I'm surprised at that 1146 number. Bear in mind that probably doesn't include rated tongue wt. So actual allowable WT is closer to 2k.
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Old 07-05-2018, 06:12 AM   #52
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That's interesting, I'm curious why they derated it. I know they went to a smaller fuel tank so they could run there mpg tests with less WT, I wonder if the payload is the same deal. When most people look at lighter pick-ups one of the first things they look for us mpg.
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Old 07-05-2018, 09:09 AM   #53
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[QUOTE=Abraham;2123948]I think your are right that overloading ’anything’ is not only odd but usually unsafe and can anger the manufacturers warrantee department and can bring joy to lawyers far and wide.


Somehow I find it odd on these forum discussions about TV's that most everyone talks about 'just meeting' the capacity needs or using a "device" to allow them tow a heavy trailer with a lighter truck.
When I bought my 31' SS, GVW of 7800 I wanted a TV that would allow me take the family of wife and two dogs along in max comfort. So I bought a 2008 Jeep Grand Cherokee with every conceivable option known to Mercedes including their 3.0 V6 Diesel engine. The MOST advanced all wheel drive system at the time, Quadratrac, also. Then I replaced the springs with stiffer, new Bilstein shocks, 1 1/2" sway bars front and rear, massive drilled and slotted brake rotors with metallic pads, Michelin 18" LTX M/S tires, various mods to the engine including a chip for towing.
Then I pulled said trailer from northern NM to central TX, over 800 miles including all types of roads. Arrived safely and promptly sold the Jeep.
WHY??? Because, Yes, it had the power up the ying-yang, and Yes it could stop the trailer in most conditions, but Everything was "just enough" and no more. The final broken straw came while coming down a steep curvy section of IH10 at 50 mph and decelerating. Came around a corner and saw the road blocked due to accident. Cliff on right hand side and solid rock on left hand side. Jammed on emergency stop and held on for dear life stopping with just inches to spare. Marginal at best although all "SPECS" seemed to be showing this be a good TV. Which is what I see with all this talk about a F150 towing a 28-30' trailer. Marginal. And everyone is talking about payload like it matters when you have to have WDH just to safely drive the darn thing.
I replaced the Jeep with a Dodge 3500. Now I often forget there is a vehicle attached. Margin?? In favor of the TV by a factor of 3 or more. Emergency stop going downhill now? No sweat.
And why is all this true? Because the Truck controls the trailer without gimmicks. The truck has a 6,000 lb payload and a 13,000 lb towing capacity.
So 90% of what you AS guys worry about in a TV is of no concern to someone towing with a vehicle that controls the trailer. Oh, and BTW, this truck has an older 6 cylinder diesel engine that provides towing mpg in the low 20's all day long without a sweat.
Bottom line----Your TV should always weigh substantially more than your trailer for true full time safety. If not then should have all the modern gimmicks to keep somewhat safe.
I also recognize that summer vacation trailer drivers cannot afford to have a TV that they only use for towing their trailer. But for the rest of you who talk all day long about how to get a marginal TV to work, I say get a larger truck.
All said in good spirit as we are all trying to accomplish the same goal of having a good time with our trailers.
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Old 07-05-2018, 09:24 AM   #54
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Originally Posted by xisme2 View Post
Ford's early release data. I'm surprised at that 1146 number. Bear in mind that probably doesn't include rated tongue wt. So actual allowable WT is closer to 2k.
I was under the impression, that rated payload was inclusive of: tongue weight + cargo + passingers. So when the Ford Sticker shows rated payload capacity....includes TW.
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Old 07-05-2018, 10:41 AM   #55
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That's correct. The payload is calculated as the vehicle's gross vehicle weight (the total weight the truck can carry including the truck's weight) minus the curb weight (the weight of the truck empty). Any weight you put on or in the truck counts against the payload including the weight put on the truck from the trailer. Yes the payload of the new diesel f150 is disappointing but not unexpected when you consider the extra weight of the diesel engine, weight of accessories typically added in upper trim lines, and the typical payloads of previous gas f150s even with the aluminum bodies-- these seem to range 1500-1900 lbs.--Frank
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Old 07-05-2018, 10:57 PM   #56
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[QUOTE=labans;2124186]
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Originally Posted by Abraham View Post
Your TV should always weigh substantially more than your trailer for true full time safety. If not then should have all the modern gimmicks to keep somewhat safe.
Based on your comment, a 2018 F-350 (weight of about 7000 lbs) would only be "somewhat safe" towing a Forest River Artic Wolf 305ML6 (UVW 8800) or Forest River Cedar Creek 33IK (UVW 10,900)? Interestingly, that seems to be one of the preferred TV's for this size 5vr. Based on your comment, most all 5vrs probably need to be towed by something much larger than a 1 ton PU. I guess the "gimmicks" on the trucks are really good...
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