Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 05-28-2015, 03:23 PM   #1
3 Rivet Member
 
Ponyfvr's Avatar
 
2015 25' International
Scottsdale , Arizona
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 122
Question CAT Scales and weight distribution

I have a 2015 Toyota Tundra with a Crewmax cab, TRD 4x4 package, LTD package and a 5.7 L V-8. I also have a 2015 25' AS International.

I weighted the truck and trailer this morning at a CAT scale, the trailer tanks were pretty empty and the trailer had clothes food etc. The truck had a full tank of gas and a YETI cooler and some gear in the truck bed. I have a Husky Centerline Hitch.

Here are the weights:

Steer Axle 3100 lb
Drive Axle 4300 lb
Trailer Weight 5580 Lb
Gross Weight 13,000 Lb

Not sure what all this means???????? Am I OK?
__________________

__________________
Bob

2017 Ford F-250 Diesel
2015 25' International
WBCCI # 5462 4CU
Ponyfvr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2015, 03:33 PM   #2
Rivet Master
 
HowieE's Avatar
 
1991 34' Excella
Princeton , New Jersey
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 6,811
Images: 12
Not sure what your question is but to be effect from an analysis stand point we need the truck axle weights without the trailer.

Are you using a WD hitch?

From a towing standpoint it would be nice to know what the rear axle ration is.
__________________

__________________
WBCCI 12156 AIR 3144 WACHUNG TAC NJ6
2004 Excursion 4x4
1991 34 ft. Excella +220,000 miles, new laminated flooring, new upholstery, new 3200 lbs axles

HowieE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2015, 03:39 PM   #3
3 Rivet Member
 
Ponyfvr's Avatar
 
2015 25' International
Scottsdale , Arizona
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 122
Quote:
Originally Posted by HowieE View Post
Not sure what your question is but to be effect from an analysis stand point we need the truck axle weights without the trailer.

Are you using a WD hitch?

From a towing standpoint it would be nice to know what the rear axle ration is.
Thanks I don't know the axle weights, I will weigh the truck without the trailer. I am using a Husky Centerline WD hitch. I will check on the axle ratio.

Thanks
__________________
Bob

2017 Ford F-250 Diesel
2015 25' International
WBCCI # 5462 4CU
Ponyfvr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2015, 03:43 PM   #4
2 Rivet Member
 
Portland , Oregon
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 69
Look at the sticker on the driver's door frame that contains max ratings for each axle and GVWR. I have a 2014 DC TRD and my max ratings are:

Front: 4000
Rear: 4150
GVWR: 7100

So, based on these numbers, you are heavy by 150 lbs on the rear axle and 300 lbs overall. Based on my numbers, your front axle looks light; mine is around 3400 lbs unloaded and with WD applied when hooked to the trailer.

Check your WD setup to insure you are returning the front axle back to its original weight. Once you do this, you will probably be fine. If you have more to add to the truck, like people, pets, etc, you will need to reload your trailer, moving some weight behind the axles.
__________________
2015 Nash 24M
2014 Tundra DC Limited TRD (Sold)
2016 Ram 3500 CTD SRW CC
Blue Ox SwayPro
Still looking at Airstreams....
MacPDX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2015, 03:49 PM   #5
2 Rivet Member
 
Portland , Oregon
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 69
All Tundras with the 5.7 have a 4.3 rear differential ratio.
__________________
2015 Nash 24M
2014 Tundra DC Limited TRD (Sold)
2016 Ram 3500 CTD SRW CC
Blue Ox SwayPro
Still looking at Airstreams....
MacPDX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2015, 04:26 PM   #6
Rivet Master
 
2016 30' Classic
Erie , Colorado
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,245
Images: 1
Bob I'm attaching a spreadsheet that I built. See this post on how to get do the weighing. http://www.airforums.com/forums/f464...ml#post1111379

Basically you will have a minimum of 3 times over the scales. Once with TV/TT hooked up and WD turned on, once with TV/TT hooked up but WD function turned off/disconnected and once with just the truck. And you will have the front TV wheels on the front scale, rear axle on the middle scale and the trailer axle on the third scale.

Typically CAT will charge $10 for the first one and $2 for any additional at the same scale location and within 24 hours. When my local CAT scale isn't busy I can drive on, do the first weigh. Then go pay for that one. Tell them I am going to do a couple of more without leaving the scales. Pull back on, take some tension off of the jacks on the ProPride, weigh, repeat until I have the jacks at the bottom where everything is loose.

Drive off, drop the TT and weigh the truck.

Fill in the proper fields in the spreadsheet and you can compare the results based on your various adjustments. Your owner's manual should also give an indication on what they consider a good towing setup. GMC says measure to the top of the front wheel well without the trailer then add back in 1/2 of the distance when you hook up (front end rises without WD). That works pretty well.

Good luck.

CAT Calc Sierra 2500 Classic 5-2-15.xlsx
Attached Files
File Type: xlsx CAT Scale Calc.xlsx (39.0 KB, 111 views)
__________________
Gary
2015 Classic
2015 GMC Sierra 2500HD Duramax
ProPride
NVPN
ghaynes755 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2015, 05:22 PM   #7
3 Rivet Member
 
Ponyfvr's Avatar
 
2015 25' International
Scottsdale , Arizona
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 122
Quote:
Originally Posted by ghaynes755 View Post
Bob I'm attaching a spreadsheet that I built. See this post on how to get do the weighing. http://www.airforums.com/forums/f464...ml#post1111379

Basically you will have a minimum of 3 times over the scales. Once with TV/TT hooked up and WD turned on, once with TV/TT hooked up but WD function turned off/disconnected and once with just the truck. And you will have the front TV wheels on the front scale, rear axle on the middle scale and the trailer axle on the third scale.

Typically CAT will charge $10 for the first one and $2 for any additional at the same scale location and within 24 hours. When my local CAT scale isn't busy I can drive on, do the first weigh. Then go pay for that one. Tell them I am going to do a couple of more without leaving the scales. Pull back on, take some tension off of the jacks on the ProPride, weigh, repeat until I have the jacks at the bottom where everything is loose.

Drive off, drop the TT and weigh the truck.

Fill in the proper fields in the spreadsheet and you can compare the results based on your various adjustments. Your owner's manual should also give an indication on what they consider a good towing setup. GMC says measure to the top of the front wheel well without the trailer then add back in 1/2 of the distance when you hook up (front end rises without WD). That works pretty well.

Good luck.

Attachment 239481
Wow this is great thank you very much. I will go back to the scales

Thanks again
__________________
Bob

2017 Ford F-250 Diesel
2015 25' International
WBCCI # 5462 4CU
Ponyfvr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2015, 05:28 PM   #8
3 Rivet Member
 
Ponyfvr's Avatar
 
2015 25' International
Scottsdale , Arizona
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 122
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacPDX View Post
Look at the sticker on the driver's door frame that contains max ratings for each axle and GVWR. I have a 2014 DC TRD and my max ratings are:

Front: 4000
Rear: 4150
GVWR: 7100

So, based on these numbers, you are heavy by 150 lbs on the rear axle and 300 lbs overall. Based on my numbers, your front axle looks light; mine is around 3400 lbs unloaded and with WD applied when hooked to the trailer.

Check your WD setup to insure you are returning the front axle back to its original weight. Once you do this, you will probably be fine. If you have more to add to the truck, like people, pets, etc, you will need to reload your trailer, moving some weight behind the axles.

I checked the sticker and my GAWR is the same Front 4000 and rear 4150 my GVWR is 7200. WE are on the road so I will try and find a scale and unhook the trailer and get a weight for the truck only.

Thanks for your help
__________________
Bob

2017 Ford F-250 Diesel
2015 25' International
WBCCI # 5462 4CU
Ponyfvr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2015, 06:25 PM   #9
Rivet Master
 
HowieE's Avatar
 
1991 34' Excella
Princeton , New Jersey
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 6,811
Images: 12
The column numbers are MAX. load by manufactures design. Not to be used in this case. You will need actual empty scale axle weights.

Another important consideration when setting up is the fact that an Airstream MUST ride parallel to the ground. This means the ground to frame measurement has to be as close as possible front and rear of the trailer. Riding tongue high will result in additional tongue weight from the trailer. Riding tongue low will result in less tongue weight from the trailer.
__________________
WBCCI 12156 AIR 3144 WACHUNG TAC NJ6
2004 Excursion 4x4
1991 34 ft. Excella +220,000 miles, new laminated flooring, new upholstery, new 3200 lbs axles

HowieE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2015, 06:38 PM   #10
Vintage Kin
 
slowmover's Avatar
 
Fort Worth , Texas
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 7,582
Images: 1
Do all three weights at the same time. Full fresh water, propane and truck fuel. Cross the scale with WD tensioned, second pass untensioned, and then drop trailer and do truck solo for third pass. No changes with passengers etc. Be in the truck when weight taken.

The numbers from those three are the basis for any changes.
__________________
1990 35' Silver Streak Sterling; 9k GVWR.
2004 DODGE Cummins 305/555; 6-manual; 9k GVWR.
Hensley Arrow. 9-cpm solo, 15-cpm towing
Sold: Silver Streak Model 3411
slowmover is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2015, 12:42 PM   #11
Rivet Master
 
m.hony's Avatar
 
2013 30' Classic
Greenwood , Mississippi
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 11,828
Your numbers mean to me that your rig is 1,400# lighter than my rig. I guess 5' more of trailer weighs about 1,400#. My Tundra CrewMax and 30' Classic are 14,400# combined. Full tank of gas, me, my wife, and cat on board, firewood and bicycles in the truck bed, groceries and clothes for 10 days camping.
__________________
2013 Classic 30 Limited
2007 Silver Toyota Tundra Crew Max Limited 5.7 iForce
2006 Vivid Black Harley-Davidson Road King Classic
1999 Black Nissan Pathfinder LE
TAC #MS-10
WBCCI #1811, Region 6, Unit 56
Airforums #70955
m.hony is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2015, 05:14 PM   #12
3 Rivet Member
 
Ponyfvr's Avatar
 
2015 25' International
Scottsdale , Arizona
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 122
Thumbs up

I adjusted the WD and it added 80# to the steer axle (3100 to 3180) and took 100 # from the rear axle (4320 to 4220) the trailer axle went from 5660 to 5580 and the total gross weight went from 13000 to 13060, we have some water in the tanks that might explain the extra weight. After the WD adjustment the truck seemed to be more level and it also handled better. I will check the level of the AS when we get back home.

Thank you everyone for your suggestions they were very helpful.
__________________
Bob

2017 Ford F-250 Diesel
2015 25' International
WBCCI # 5462 4CU
Ponyfvr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2015, 05:32 PM   #13
4 Rivet Member
 
GammaDog's Avatar
 
2014 25' FB Eddie Bauer
Vero Beach , Florida
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 353
Images: 26
I have almost the same rig... 2014 tundra crewmax, 5.7, limited 4x4 (but not TRD), 25' 2014 Eddie Bauer. I recently did all three passes as described above at a CAT scale. Without looking up the particulars on your truck and trailer it looks to me like you might want more WD dialed in.

I had full fuel, full fresh, a passenger, generators and bikes, etc. I was as close to ready for a long trip as I could simulate short of loading the fridge with food. Here are my weights:

With WD bars on:
Truck front axle: 3560
Truck rear axle: 3800
Trailer: 6020

With weight bars in the truck bed:
Truck front axle: 3200
Truck rear axle: 4340
Trailer: 5840

Truck alone (with hitch removed also)
Truck front axle: 3580
Truck rear axle: 3040

My year and config has a GCWR (total of truck and trailer) of 14,800. Yours should be similar if not identical. Your 13,000 or my 13,380 are both well under that.

My GVWR (weight on the trucks front and rear axles added together) is 7200. I'm 160 lbs over that. You may be 200 over. Frankly, I'm not too worried about that. I will lighten cargo, take a half tank of fresh water or leave a kid behind and be fine.

My front axle is rated to 4000 and rear at 4150. I'm fine with the WD bars on since I'm moving weight to the front of truck and to the trailer's axles but you can see I overload the rear axle without the WD bars in place. If your truck has the same ratings, you are over on the rear, too. I'm thinking your front is lighter with the trailer on than without. Toyota (at least for the 2014 model year) recommends compensating the tundra with sufficient WD support to bring the front wheel well back to the same height with the trailer as it was without. You can measure that without going back to the scales to see if you are close.

My trailer is fine either way. You can see that my equalizer hitch as set up pushes 180 lbs of trailer weight back to the trailer rather than the truck. It also moves 360 lbs from the truck's rear axle to the front.

The tongue weight is also good with the hitch on. It's 740 lbs. However, at this much WD dialed in, I've put the tongue weigh at 10.9% of the trailer weight. I'm not included to go lower (more WD) since I don't want to go under 10% for trailer handling reasons.

Not sure if any of that helps, but it's a recent set of tests on a very similar rig to yours.

I'm open to feedback from the real experts since I'm still a nube and this was my first set of measurements of my tuck and trailer.
__________________
GammaDog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2015, 05:55 PM   #14
Rivet Master
 
HowieE's Avatar
 
1991 34' Excella
Princeton , New Jersey
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 6,811
Images: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ponyfvr View Post
I adjusted the WD and it added 80# to the steer axle (3100 to 3180) and took 100 # from the rear axle (4320 to 4220) the trailer axle went from 5660 to 5580 and the total gross weight went from 13000 to 13060, we have some water in the tanks that might explain the extra weight. After the WD adjustment the truck seemed to be more level and it also handled better. I will check the level of the AS when we get back home.

Thank you everyone for your suggestions they were very helpful.
You can not adjust the WD hitch without adjusting the trailer level at the same time. They are interactive. The truck level is not a goal to work towards. The truck orientation is a function of the more important WD hitch and trailer adjustments.

Your numbers are in the right direction. You might consider this trick. Place a piece of painters tape on the front fender of the TV. Measure and mark a height on the tape. After all adjustments remeasure and mark. The second measurement wants to be at or slightly above to the original mark. It does not want to be below the original mark. What this is doing is getting the front axle geometry back to original. Large difference in this will cause por steering control.
__________________

__________________
WBCCI 12156 AIR 3144 WACHUNG TAC NJ6
2004 Excursion 4x4
1991 34 ft. Excella +220,000 miles, new laminated flooring, new upholstery, new 3200 lbs axles

HowieE is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Calculating Tongue Weight at the CAT scales? SteveSueMac Hitches, Couplers & Balls 39 03-23-2017 06:44 AM
visited CAT scales - the numbers are in... 2airishuman Towing, Tow Vehicles & Hitches 143 08-23-2015 03:55 PM
Took a trip to the CAT scales phbarnhart Towing, Tow Vehicles & Hitches 48 07-26-2015 07:50 PM
results of CAT Scales and WD hitch adjustments funkill Hitches, Couplers & Balls 10 07-11-2009 07:35 PM


Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by




Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:46 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.