2012 Ram 2500/ProPride Brake Issues

[SteveH]

Just another update here....after I was told they would call me back last Wednesday (the dealer service dept), Chrysler CS called, and told me they would call me back with more info on Friday. They did not call. So, Monday morning I got on the phone calling everyone I had numbers for, and some that would not call me back like the dealer General Manager, and after playing asseatusgargantuous for most of the morning, the dealer shows up at my house yesterday with a shop '12 Ram truck and their shop trailer for me to test drive.

Their truck/trailer did not have the delay in the braking, so we hooked their truck to my trailer (they were still trying to lay the blame on me), and took it for a test drive. It did not have the delay in the braking.

They left with my truck taking it back to the dealer, hopefully to fix it. They told me they were going to change out the controller and load test the grounds. Hopefully.....

[ROBERT CROSS]

Originally Posted by SteveH

Just another update here....after I was told they would call me back last Wednesday (the dealer service dept), Chrysler CS called, and told me they would call me back with more info on Friday. They did not call. So, Monday morning I got on the phone calling everyone I had numbers for, and some that would not call me back like the dealer General Manager, and after playing asseatusgargantuous for most of the morning, the dealer shows up at my house yesterday with a shop '12 Ram truck and their shop trailer for me to test drive.

Their truck/trailer did not have the delay in the braking, so we hooked their truck to my trailer (they were still trying to lay the blame on me), and took it for a test drive. It did not have the delay in the braking.

They left with my truck taking it back to the dealer, hopefully to fix it. They told me they were going to change out the controller and load test the grounds. Hopefully.....

Well it looks like they did come over with a new controller....attached to another TV, good thinking on their part.

Best of luck with getting it resolved.

Bob

[Wazbro]

Well sounds like the good news is that it is a problem with your truck, not you trailer or all Ram trucks.

Now hopefully they can fix it.

[ROBERT CROSS]

I thought they were a much better TV when they were an oxymoron.

Bob

[SteveH]

Yea, I know LOTS of jokes about the Dodge, or Ram trucks, but most are not "politically correct", so I won't repeat them in public print.

I can testify, however, that the Cummins engine IS "kickass".

At this point (starting to get really tired of it, and I suspect that's what they are banking on) I just hope they get it fixed. It's already cost me the use and cost of the ProPride hitch.

[SteveH]

One more update....got the truck back last Saturday, and between other appointments and rain, didn't get to test tow the trailer until yesterday afternoon.

Verdict: While it might be ever so slightly better, it is not right. There is still very noticeable delay between truck and trailer brakes. This is on the "proper" setting of "heavy electric".

It is interesting to note that almost all of the delay is gone if I set the brakes on "heavy electric over hydraulic", and I have reported this to the dealer service manager and asked if this will do any harm.

He told me he would put the question to the engineering department, and get back to me.

Again, I wait for a call........

[SteveSueMac]

Frustrating - but maybe that's the answer?? Good luck. Did you give up on the PP because of this?

[SteveH]

Originally Posted by SteveSueMac

Frustrating - but maybe that's the answer?? Good luck. Did you give up on the PP because of this?

Yes, because every time I would hit the brakes quickly, not even a panic stop, the hitch would loose centering adjustment and I'd get a terrific "bump". Over time kind of made me concerned about even putting on the brakes.

Then when I asked Sean what would happen if I welded it, his response was I might break something. So, did not want that concern hanging over my head.

[dkottum]

Steve, I hope they figure this out for you. We pulled our Airstream/ProPride about 800 miles the last few days, many stops, with our 2012 Ram 1500/factory controller and never had a bump. It's most probably the same controller as yours, the delay would be universal if intended.

[SteveSueMac]

Originally Posted by SteveH

Yes, because every time I would hit the brakes quickly, not even a panic stop, the hitch would loose centering adjustment and I'd get a terrific "bump". Over time kind of made me concerned about even putting on the brakes.

Then when I asked Sean what would happen if I welded it, his response was I might break something. So, did not want that concern hanging over my head.

I hear that. I knew I wanted the PP but was PETRIFIED of all the Hensley Bump stories I read about. When I knew it boiled down to brake controller and that the integrated controller in my truck (Chevy) would work with my trailer's brakes, I felt much more at ease. I don't blame you for making a different decision in this case. I really hope Dodge can figure this out. Gotta say, if it works on the "wrong" setting, I wonder if its a wiring or software issue? Especially as other Dodges don't have this problem.

Best of luck!!

[SteveH]

Yea, there is more involved than just the brake controller, per the dealer's technician. He told me there is an accelerometer and some kind of incline sensor that have inputs, but are not part of the actual brake controller. I asked him if there were any adjustments on those, and he told me no.

I strongly believe the problem is in my Ram truck as I never had an issue like this with the same trailer, and ProPride hitch towing with the '08 GMC Duramax truck. And, actually had one sever panic stop event that Sean is using on his website, and nothing happed other than the rig stopping straight as an arrow. Additionally, my buddy was following us with another Airstream/PP combo towing with an earlier model Dodge 2500, he also had to panic stop to keep from hitting me, and he had no problem.

[SteveH]

And STILL waiting for the phone call..........

The only thing I can say at this time is if you are in Texas, and want to buy a Chrysler product, buy it from somewhere other than Bluebonnet Motors in New Braunfels, TX.

[PharmGeek]

ugh...bummer...I hope my PP that will very soon be installed on my trailer will not have this issue with my 2010 RAM......

[SteveH]

Finally got the call from the dealer's Service Manager yesterday afternoon. He said he had talked with a factory rep, and the rep in turn had talked with the factory Engineering Department, and was told that using the brake controller in "Heavy Electric Over Hydraulic" mode with electric only brakes would not cause any problem.

So, basically they waited long enough, and stalled long enough that I am tired of fooling with them. The brakes work OK in the "HEOH" mode, and if you have a Dodge/Ram truck with the factory controller, I suggest you try setting it in that mode.

[crispyboy]

Your brake controller seems to be a lemon.....
I towed the AS last weekend with a 2012 ctd and the controller was set on 4.5 with the HAHA hitch. Worked flawlessly.....
I'm sorry to hear they won't help you.

[SteveSueMac]

That's an interesting point. Why can't the dealer swap out the controller??

[SteveH]

Originally Posted by SteveSueMac

That's an interesting point. Why can't the dealer swap out the controller??

They said they did change it.

[SteveSueMac]

Originally Posted by SteveH

They said they did change it.

Something's rotten in Demmark....

[RBolton]

After reading through these posts, I have some thoughts.

It would not take a very sophisticated piece of equipment to check if there is brake output at the trailer connector simultaneous to pedal application. A jumper wire and a volt meter should do it. Then compare the findings to another similar truck. Note: rear brake lights are not controlled by or through the integrated brake module .

There is a flash update to the controller that addresses sensitivity. From Chrysler TechConnect:

" Updated ITBM software is available on wiTECH for customers who regularly tow a light, or unloaded,trailer. For customers that need a less aggressive braking for low values of gain, to avoid the increased stopping sensitivity; too much braking. This update will also provide a more aggressive calibration for high values of gain."

This flash may or may not apply to your truck. Dealer can tell if you are at the current software level through wiTech (Chrysler diagnostic tool) by looking at the flash files for the ITBM. If available for your truck it may or may not address the problem.

Calling a manufacturers' customer service for this type of an issue is generally futile. The customer service personnel has no technical knowledge and is there solely to facilitate the repair scheduling and reimbursement issues with the dealer. You call customer service, they in turn call the dealer. The dealer provides a response and customer service calls you back. An appointment is made and then customer service stays on top of it to the point that they usually make the vehicle owner and the service adviser at the dealership angry.

The dealer technician has limited ability to diagnose this type of problem. First he has to be certain there is a problem. Then he has to be certain the problem is with the truck and not the trailer, the set up, or connections. Everything from the trailer connector back is probably out of his realm. These new vehicles have sophisticated self diagnostics and if a diagnostic trouble code does not exist then there are no diagnostic flow charts to follow. The technician has access to Chrysler's technical advisers and they can provide guidance online or via telephone. The dealer is right in that they cannot put you in touch with the technical advisers and it is almost unheard of that one will contact the owner to provide technical advise. The dealer can request that a tech adviser come to the dealership to provide assistance - so can the vehicle owner. You would have to be willing to bring the truck and trailer to the dealership, I'm sure.

Don't be so sure that the barking dog gets the bone. You can catch more flies with honey than with vinegar. Threats of lawsuits generally make a dealership want to distance themselves from the one doing the threatening. If I didn't work on it then it's not my fault if its broken. If you are not happy with the way the dealership is handling your problem, then try another dealership. Ultimately it will be you in the $120K pile up and ultimately it is up to you to get the problem corrected or stay off the highway.

Steve, have you tried your truck hooked to another comparable trailer? I think that would be more telling than hooking another truck to your trailer. I would also recommend that you ask a qualified technician at a trailer facility to double check your settings and your trailer's braking system.

Just a thought - does your truck have BAS Brake Assist System? From the owners manual. "The BAS detects an emergency braking situation by sensing the rate and amount of brake application and then applies optimum pressure to the brakes. The system applies optimum pressure to the brakes in emergency braking conditions. This can help reduce braking distances. The BAS complements the ABS. Applying the brakes very quickly results in the best BAS assistance." Could this system take the vehicle braking and the trailer braking out of sync in an emergency braking situation? Might be a good question for the technical advisers or engineers.

Good luck with getting your problem solved.

[SteveH]

Originally Posted by RBolton

After reading through these posts, I have some thoughts.

It would not take a very sophisticated piece of equipment to check if there is brake output at the trailer connector simultaneous to pedal application. A jumper wire and a volt meter should do it. Then compare the findings to another similar truck. Note: rear brake lights are not controlled by or through the integrated brake module .

There is a flash update to the controller that addresses sensitivity. From Chrysler TechConnect:

" Updated ITBM software is available on wiTECH for customers who regularly tow a light, or unloaded,trailer. For customers that need a less aggressive braking for low values of gain, to avoid the increased stopping sensitivity; too much braking. This update will also provide a more aggressive calibration for high values of gain."

This flash may or may not apply to your truck. Dealer can tell if you are at the current software level through wiTech (Chrysler diagnostic tool) by looking at the flash files for the ITBM. If available for your truck it may or may not address the problem.

Calling a manufacturers' customer service for this type of an issue is generally futile. The customer service personnel has no technical knowledge and is there solely to facilitate the repair scheduling and reimbursement issues with the dealer. You call customer service, they in turn call the dealer. The dealer provides a response and customer service calls you back. An appointment is made and then customer service stays on top of it to the point that they usually make the vehicle owner and the service adviser at the dealership angry.

The dealer technician has limited ability to diagnose this type of problem. First he has to be certain there is a problem. Then he has to be certain the problem is with the truck and not the trailer, the set up, or connections. Everything from the trailer connector back is probably out of his realm. These new vehicles have sophisticated self diagnostics and if a diagnostic trouble code does not exist then there are no diagnostic flow charts to follow. The technician has access to Chrysler's technical advisers and they can provide guidance online or via telephone. The dealer is right in that they cannot put you in touch with the technical advisers and it is almost unheard of that one will contact the owner to provide technical advise. The dealer can request that a tech adviser come to the dealership to provide assistance - so can the vehicle owner. You would have to be willing to bring the truck and trailer to the dealership, I'm sure.

Don't be so sure that the barking dog gets the bone. You can catch more flies with honey than with vinegar. Threats of lawsuits generally make a dealership want to distance themselves from the one doing the threatening. If I didn't work on it then it's not my fault if its broken. If you are not happy with the way the dealership is handling your problem, then try another dealership. Ultimately it will be you in the $120K pile up and ultimately it is up to you to get the problem corrected or stay off the highway.

Steve, have you tried your truck hooked to another comparable trailer? I think that would be more telling than hooking another truck to your trailer. I would also recommend that you ask a qualified technician at a trailer facility to double check your settings and your trailer's braking system.

Just a thought - does your truck have BAS Brake Assist System? From the owners manual. "The BAS detects an emergency braking situation by sensing the rate and amount of brake application and then applies optimum pressure to the brakes. The system applies optimum pressure to the brakes in emergency braking conditions. This can help reduce braking distances. The BAS complements the ABS. Applying the brakes very quickly results in the best BAS assistance." Could this system take the vehicle braking and the trailer braking out of sync in an emergency braking situation? Might be a good question for the technical advisers or engineers.

Good luck with getting your problem solved.

I was told by the dealer that the updated software would make my problem worse, rather than help.

I have towed another trailer with the truck, but it is a 17' Casita, and while it is hardly noticeable (3000 lb trailer behind a 7000 truck), the delay is there. My previous tow vehicle, which did have a factory brake controller (a 2008 GMC 2500) did not have this problem with the same trailer.

I've checked the "User's Guide" that came with my truck, and there is nothing in the index about BAS, or brake assist system.

You are right about the dealer, and Chrysler Customer Service. The Dealer at least will try to help, but CCS just wants to close the "file".