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Safari Tim · 06-19-2003, 11:27 AM

I don't know if this is polically correct to talk about or not but it is something that always interests me.

I purchased my '71 Safari with the intenstion of fixing it up and using it. If we decided not to use it we could sell it and get our investment back.

I also think it would be good for those thinking of doing this to get a real idea on the costs of repairing or restoring a vintage airstream for use.

I spent $2100 on the purchase of mine and it was a basket case.

So far not including my labor I have another $4900 into it.

New A/C, fridge, water heater, new plumbing supply lines, upholstry, drapes and shades, new floor tiles, OPD valves, charging system, new windows, new cabinet doors, new locks, new tires, etc....

I have around $7000 total invested so far and it is still not done.

Next is new shocks and a home polish job.

What is your investment so far?

Pick · 06-19-2003, 11:58 AM

I paid $4K for mine, and I think I have about another $2500 into it. So figure $7K with incidentals. This does not take into consideration almost 100 hours of labor. But I enjoy working on it as much as using it.

If I had bought an SOB, for around $25-35K, like we were contemplating, I would have lost that just by driving it off the lot. So, I figure I got the Airstream for nothing.

Well, not quite, but I am satisfied with what I have, for what I have invested. This is reinforced, every time we look at or inside an SOB. I just can't get into SOB's and their "house trailer" like look.

joe hall · 06-19-2003, 12:23 PM

last RV, but the orginal purchase price was just a start. I paid $8500 for an '86 31' Soverign that was almost in mint condition. It had been sitting in one place for 15 years and only had about 2,000 actual road miles on it. It was purchased new at the factory, driven down to Melbourne, Florida, over a two month trip, and then used as a winter getaway for years. The tires needed replacing due to dry rot. I had the wheel bearings re-greased and a few minor odds and ends taken care of, and then pulled it home to South Georgia. Of course, since then, minor things have become more apparant. I replaced the ceiling vent and fan in the bathroom for about $100.00, and the main door lock for $154.00. We pitched the original blinds and bought new ones, plus some new throw rugs and other junk to make it more personal. I believe we have about $10,500 in it now. On the other hand, we just love the snug and homey feel of it. It is sound as a dollar. We had been looking to purchase a new Holiday Rambler to the tune of about $35,000. While the one we selected was beautiful, it felt more like a hotel room. We feel like we made a heck of a purchase for the money and have been using it as often as time will allow. Regardless of how our personal finances flourish as we grow older, I am not sure I will ever replace the trailer unless, God forbid, something happen we don't expect.

Joe

j54mark · 06-19-2003, 06:56 PM

Just off the top of my head, so far I have:

New cabinets everywhere but the bath. New plumbing throughout, including all shutoff valves and new Moen faucets in shower, bathroom, and galley. New sinks. New cooktop. Microwave. Fantastic Vent (fan). New upholstery. Pergo-type floor. OPD valves. Gas regulator. New furnace. Circuit board for hot water heater. New tires. New curtains front to back (got the new ones in the bedroom, finally. The front room are still on hangers). New Aquajet ES variable speed demand water pump (I'll let you know how it works after the trip next week).

Invested? Not a penny. Its all expense.

Mark

85MH325 · 06-20-2003, 06:52 AM

I don't wanna talk about it... I'd get all morose, maudlin and moody...<sniff>!!!

Actually for this last one, I spent the most I've ever spent on an RV, $24k and it just about killed me to do it. Other than the motorhome, I've always made it a point never to spend more than $100 per foot for a trailer that didn't need serious repairs and until now, I'd always been successful with that formula ( I'm a serious cheapskate...) This is the both the newest and nicest we've had tho (although the 325 was VERY nice), and other than $50 in cleaning supplies and 40 hours labor (maybe a slight exaggeration) in cleaning we haven't spent anything on it, yet... It even came with new tires for a change!

I'll have to replace the stereo before we take it out again, but that's relatively minor. As it's ten years old, and was lived in part time during that time, the fabric portion of the upholstery shows some wear so we're going to try to have those pieces replaced with Airstream fabric we bought for another project at the International in Sioux Falls in 2001.

The carpet and drapes are faded and will probably need to be replaced next summer. We'll live with them this year.

I expect that this will be the last trailer I buy, and although retirement is still about 15 years off, if I can take care of this one the way it should be, it should last us until we decide we don't want to tow any more.

Roger

joe hall · 06-20-2003, 07:43 AM

I bought the trailer thinking I could pull it with our 5.4L Expedition. I knew my relative-new Ford 150 Triton V8 would not handle the job. Of course, once I had made the deal I relaized I couldn't (or, perhaps, shouldn't) attempt to pull the trailer with the Expedition. I end up trading the pick-up for a new GMC 8.1L Vortec 4X4 pick-up - an expense I wasn't particularly ready for at the time. I literally and figuratively got my cart before the horse. Regardless, it is a great combination and I'm happy regardless of being poorer.

Joe

JeffandSuzanne · 06-20-2003, 10:32 AM

SINCE 1995, SUZANNE AND I HAD LOOKED WITHOUT SUCCESS AT EVERY SOB TRAILER MADE THAT WOULD FIT OUR BUDGET AND WEIGHT REQUIREMENTS. THEN, IN THE SPRING OF 2001, WE SAW AIRSTREAM; AND THE REST, AS THEY SAY, IS HISTORY. WE COULDN'T PART WITH THE MUCH NEGOTIATED PRICE OF $45,000 FOR A NEW 2000 30ft. EXCELLA 1000, SO WE WENT ONLINE AND FOUND OUR 1998 "MARY ROSE" FOR A NEGOTIATED PRICE OF $36,500; WHICH INCLUDED A HENSLEY HITCH, QUEEN SIZE SELECT COMFORT BED, COFFEE MAKER, CAN OPENER, CHOCKS, LEVEL BUBBLE, HOSES, ETC., ETC....WELL, YOU GET THE PICTURE. THE PREVIOUS OWNERS HAD KEPT EVERY RECIEPT FOR EVERY PURCHASE AND REPAIR JOB EVER PAID FOR. WHEN WE GOT SERIOUS ABOUT THE DEAL, THEY PARKED THE TRAILER AT AN RV PARK CLOSE TO THEIR HOME, AND INVITED US TO SPEND A DAY & A NIGHT IN THE TRAILER BY OURSELVES. NEEDLESS TO SAY, WE GOT TO GO OVER EVERY INCH OF HER, AND WE WERE GLAD TO CLOSE THE DEAL!

KY Girl · 06-20-2003, 06:56 PM

what is an SOB? I know as soon as you tell me what the acronym stands for I'll smack myself in the head and say "D'OH!"

Cherie (who obviously doesn't know the A/S lingo yet)

P.S.: Friendly note to Jeff & Suzanne: You probably aren't aware, but using all capital letters in a post is considered a no-no on computer forums. It means you are shouting, and is difficult to read. No problem, just wanted to let you know in case you weren't aware.

53flyingcloud · 06-20-2003, 08:05 PM

Kentucky Girl

SOB= some other brand...
ciao

KY Girl · 06-20-2003, 08:09 PM

D'OH!!!

53flyingcloud · 06-20-2003, 08:18 PM

I hope you didn't hit yourself toooo hard..
lol
ciao

williamhenshall · 06-21-2003, 01:54 AM

Heya,

I learned a HUGE lesson myself about vlaue of what you put in and what you can expect to get out...

We bought a very good condition low mileage 1990 345LE 2 years ago and then totally rebuilt or renovated most everything, put about $100k in to her in total. She was literally immaculate. A real head turner when ever we took her anywhere, including Airstream rallies. The apple of our eye.

I then was able to sell my company (network technology for the entertainment industry) and could take most of the next year off not working and also rent out our house in San Francisco for the period...so we looked at trying to live full time in the 345LE with our 2 big cats and ALL our stuff - full time is very different than a cool as hell weekend pad - and found we could not really do it and stay happily married

The wife's shoe collection for instance...oh and all my computer and camera gear and my guitars.

So we eventually sold the 345LE after advertising it for 3 months and took a total loss of over $50k. Someone got a very good deal. Check my other posts on this on the forums. We could not sell it at all even at $65k.

Then we bought a Prevost 40' coach motorhome conversion. A very different kind of beast. A few hundred grand. More like a house than an RV! 52,000lbs 500hp diesel pusher with the potential for 1 million miles on the same chassis/engine...

It dwarfs the Airstream and has all the room we need. It also will not depreciate in the same way. 20 year old ones still go for $150-175k. They are valued by the market at a more realistic return on a total investment and improvement.

I was very dissapointed about the Airstream loss and lost alot of faith in the whole Airstream community and the machines themselves. It seems that there is no significant additional market value attributed to the beautiful restored Airstreams - unlike other classic vehicles such as rebuilt Chevelles or Mustangs or Jaguars or Harleys - that do hold most of their value when sold to other collectors.

We still own a 58 Traveler 18 ft trailer so we are still part of the Airstream world, but have taken a big hit on our Airstream enthusiasm. Shame.

85MH325 · 06-21-2003, 06:05 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by williamhenshall
Heya,

I learned a HUGE lesson myself about vlaue of what you put in and what you can expect to get out...

I was very dissapointed about the Airstream loss and lost alot of faith in the whole Airstream community and the machines themselves. It seems that there is no significant additional market value attributed to the beautiful restored Airstreams - unlike other classic vehicles such as rebuilt Chevelles or Mustangs or Jaguars or Harleys - that do hold most of their value when sold to other collectors.

We still own a 58 Traveler 18 ft trailer so we are still part of the Airstream world, but have taken a big hit on our Airstream enthusiasm. Shame.

I think it's unfair of you to blame the "Airstream community" for your dollar loss. Airstreams are not an investment, they are an expense. They may not depreciate as quickly as other commodities, but they depreciate all the same. The general concept is the same as putting $250k into a house in a neighborhood of $100k houses. You just can't expect to get your money back when you do that. That kind of expenditure has to be recognized for its' enjoyment value, not viewed as an investment.

I think we can all empathize with you with the hit you took. Unfortunately what makes your situation so uncomfortable was the size of your loss and the period of time. That's a lot of money spent, not only without return, but to lose. However, the original owners of my 34' lost over $40k in ten years on my trailer when they sold it to me. I could never afford a new one. It's no different than the average used car, only on a larger scale.

I hope you enjoy your new coach. Please don't be upset with all of us. We're really pretty nice folks (well, everyone here but me, of course!

Roger

Ultradog · 06-21-2003, 06:46 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by j54mark
Just off the top of my head, so far I have:

Invested? Not a penny. Its all expense.

Mark

Good one Mark,
LOL
Reminds of a saying we used to use:
"Most of my money I spent on drinking and wild women.
The rest I just wasted".

Safari Tim · 06-21-2003, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by williamhenshall
Heya,

I learned a HUGE lesson myself about vlaue of what you put in and what you can expect to get out...

That is one of the reasons I started this thread, which seems to have gotten off track btw

You always must becareful of the value of return on something if that is what you care about.

That is one thing that I think about with my trailer. You see people trying to sell vintage airstreams for $10K + all the time after they put in custom wood work and new everything and shined it all up. But how many of them really sell?

I keep track so I don't have to wonder. If I sold mine today I would probably get what I have put in. If I keep putting more into it and get it much of $7k then I won't.

That is realistic.

But I would like to steer this back to what my original question was. How much did you pay and what have you put into it?

Chas · 06-21-2003, 12:20 PM

Sorry William but Roger hit the nail on the head,

Just lick your wounds and consider it one of the many lessons of life. Did you really think you would be able to get your total investment returned?? My story now. I had a Mercedes 450SL a few years back, paid 5k for it, dropped nearly 8k into it and countless hours of labor and ended up selling it for 8k for a total loss of 5k, plus my sweat and tears. Do I regret it? No. I enjoyed that car, drove it across the US and have memories that will last a lifetime. I bet when it is all said and done you will lose far more on your new diesel pusher.

Chas

williamhenshall · 06-21-2003, 12:24 PM

Heh, I don't blame anyone but me for my personal business decision to invest all that cash in our 345LE. We thought we were going to keep it for many years, and hugely enjoyed doing it up.

But I do not blame the Airstream community per se! We have met some of the kindest folk we know through this...

When a life changing opportunity came along, to change our work drollness and make a completely new path we talked alot about what to do, and in the end I calculated the loss on the 345LE into our overall bigger picture.

In case anyone is interested, here's what made it palatable to us in the end.

The guy I bought the Prevost from had invested about 75k over his asking price, and I was able to get it at another 25k below that - making his compete loss around 100k. He was an inexperienced (and wealthy) RV owner and had bought the big coach on a bit of a whim and his wife didn''t like it. She just wanted him to get rid of it and buy a lake house instead. So his loss and our gain. So we were effectively up about $50k at the end of the transaction.

Funny how life works everything out eh?

Best wishes to everyone from Las Vegas, where we are on our honeymoon!

Will Henshall

trumpwer · 06-21-2003, 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Safari Tim

How much did you pay and what have you put into it?

We bought ours for $3000, we consider it a steal. Has new michelins, ect. We have put in $1000 making it comfortable, $150 in minor repairs of thing that just wear out. We put another $1000 into our tow vehicle to prevent any nasty suprises. But these figures are all off the top of my head. We enjoy working on her, and we are always picking up little things for her. Our RV hobby envolves more than traveling and camping, we browse Ebay, read RV magazines, come up with ideas to try, watch RV Today, and, yes, even read this forum for ideas. It kind of extends our recreation beyond the trips. Can you put an "investment value" to a family hobby? Sometimes returns cant be quantified in $, as hard as our society tries to convince us that that is the only valid way. I will get off my soap box now, see what happens when you mix your meds.

Diana Langley · 06-22-2003, 07:16 AM

I paid $4,500 for my trailer and then shelled out another $9,000 to have the interior professionally redone....new carpentry, fridge, upholstery, ect. I'm now paying $3,000 to have it polished. It is now a brand new 40 year old trailer.
$16,500 is just about what an entry level SOB costs new.

I don't look at it as an investment. I have something that is exactly what I wanted, is solid and good quality, and a head-turner to boot.

There's a part of me that feels a responsibility about owning an American icon and keeping it is good shape.

This may sound silly, but when I'm in my trailer alone, sometimes I get the feeling she's very happy to have another chance to look good and ready for more adventures.
(OK, maybe it's too early in the morning and I haven't had enough coffee!)

I've been trying to upload before, during and after photos for weeks and still haven't been able to. If I ever stop getting "error" messages, I'll let you know.

Pick · 06-22-2003, 08:20 AM

Sort of off topic, but if you buy a house, mortgage it, spend money on improvements, pay property taxes, etc.? Is it an "investment"? I think not. It is more of an expense.

For example it you purchased a home for $100K, financed it for 15 years, at 7% you would pay back around $162K. Then factor in say, $2K property taxes for 15 years, ( I know some areas are much higher) add another $30K, your up to $192K. Of course there are many more variables, such as repairs, unforseen tax increases, mortgage refinancing, appreciation. But in the end it is more or less a wash, depending on how high your property taxes are.