Research by WBCCI Number?

[dbj216]

Hello Joe: I recently purchased this 75 Overlander. I'm told it was once owned by an Airstream enthusiasts and active WBCCI club member. This person did some nice restoration on the interior of this trailer. I understand there may be some photos of the work done. I would like to contact, meet and greet that WBCCI member and see if I can acquire the photos as part of this trailer's history. I do not know if this is possible.

The red numbers are 8607.

Thanks,

David

[66Overlander]

Originally Posted by Tom Nugler

I'm hoping someone can fill in the gaps with the ghost numbers on my '72 Tradewind. We bought the trailer in Wisconsin in 2009. The party we brought the trailer from claimed he had owned it for several years. Looking at a 30 year gap to fill here.
The earlier number, 19749 is still somewhat visible. I ran across a gentleman at one of the Forum Rallys that had an older membership book. From what we could determine the trailer was possibly owned by a couple from one of the Virginias This makes sense as the trailer has a ghost label from a dealer in eastern Ohio. Unfortunately the piece of scrap paper the info was written on was lost.
The second number, 25851, is the bigger mystery. Possibly issued sometime in 1971, I can only speculate as to when the trailer was bought by the second owner.
To further confuse matters, in a folder of papers the PO left in the trailer is a Vintage Advantage Magazine dated March 2007 from VAC Member Don Elliot of Marion Indiana. This seems at odds with the PO's statement of several years of ownership.
Thats all I've been able to come up with.
Hopefully it helps narrow the search.

Thanks in advance,
Tom.

Hi Tom,
In contrast, one of my most complicated analyses for you. The WBCCI #19749 was first assigned in 1967, before your 1972 Tradewind was built. #25851 was first assigned in very late 1971, which suggests at least some chance that it was on the Tradewind first, with 19749 later. The depth of the ghosting may only indicate that the number 15851 may have been on the trailer longer than 19749. And a number may have been on the trailer much longer than the members were in the club. Numbers are supposed to be removed when a member does not renew their membership, but often the number remain on the Airstream for years and decades after the membership ends. In any case, I will document how both numbers have been assigned in WBCCI membership Directories over the years and then we can try to interpret the results (which came first, etc.):

#19749:
1968-82: Marshall D. & Alta Lee Spangler, Princeton, WV, caravan 57 - Eastern Mexico Winter 1968.
1983: Victor T & Lois M Visher, Ravenna, OH, no caravans.
1984-current: Unassigned, but only spot checked a few after 1990.

#25851:
1972-73: P B & Dot Cambre, Lafayette, LA, no caravans.
1974-75: Unassigned.
1976-80: Frederick & Pat Love, Williamstown, WV, no caravans.
1981-current: Unassigned, but only spot checked a few after 1990.

BTW, Don Elliot's WBCCI number in 2007 was 6189, not either of the numbers on the Tradewind. Perhaps he just gave an old VAC Vintage Advantage magazine to the then current owner of the Tradewind to read and encourage them to join the club.

So what can we guess from the above information?

I will guess that the Spanglers and Loves owned the 1972 Tradwind at some point in time, and possibly the Vishers, too, since all lived in West Virginia and eastern Ohio, but probably not the Cambres from Louisiana.

Given the overlapping membership years of the Spanglers and Loves it is hard to guess which may have owned the Tradwind first, and the Spanglers must have changed Airstreams at least once during their membership period. Because of the lack of an unassigned year between the Spanglers and Vishers for #19749, it seems likely that the Vishers bough their Airstream from the Spanglers (whether the 1972 Tradewind or something else).

Some possible scenarios (others exist):

Loves (#25851) First:
Loves buy the 1972 Tradewind between late 1971 and 1975 and then join WBCCI in 1975, thus first appearing in the 1976 Membership Directory. In 1980 or so, they sell that Tradewind to the Spanglers and the Spanglers sell it to the Vishers in 1982.

Spanglers (#19749) first:
Spanglers joined the club in late 1967 with a 1968 or earlier Airstream. Around 1972 (or later) they upgrade to the 1972 Tradewind. About 1975, they sell the Tradewind to the Loves. The Vishers never own the Tradewind.

Who knows what is correct? Good luck with the mystery!

[66Overlander]

Originally Posted by johnganis

Hi Joe when you get a chance could you please check the history of the WBCCI numbers for my 1967 30 ft. Sovereign? They are 11593. The trailer is from Michigan and I think it might have had 2 owners before me, but Im sre the numbers would have been put on by the original owners.
Thanks!
John

Hi John,
I'll keep my research rolling tonight. #11593 was first assigned in 1964, which might make it a little harder to guess when that number was applied to a 1967 30' Sovereign. Here is how #11593 has been assigned according to WBCCI Membership Directories:
1965-72: Charles J. & Loretta Mattas, Algonac, MI, caravan 46 Mexico Winter 1966.
1973-74: Unassigned.
1975-78: Miss Margaret Biggs, Marshalls Creek, PA, no caravans.
1979-83: Unassigned.
1984-90: Thomas & Esther Cooper, Sedalia, MO, no caravans.
1991+: Unassigned, but only spot checked a few directories.

With you thinking the trailer is from Michigan, it would seem likely that the Mattas' upgraded to your 1967 Sovereign, AFTER the 1966 Mexico Caravan that would have likely started in January 1966, before 1967 production began.

Given the unassigned years before the Miss Biggs and the Coopers were assigned #11593, those feel more like random reassigns, rather than someone that might have purchased the 1967 Sovereign from the Mattas'.

All of these are guesses, but are the best I can do. Enjoy your Sovereign!

[66Overlander]

Originally Posted by dbj216

Hello Joe: I recently purchased this 75 Overlander. I'm told it was once owned by an Airstream enthusiasts and active WBCCI club member. This person did some nice restoration on the interior of this trailer. I understand there may be some photos of the work done. I would like to contact, meet and greet that WBCCI member and see if I can acquire the photos as part of this trailer's history. I do not know if this is possible.

The red numbers are 8607.

Thanks,

David

Hi David,
Yours will catch me up in this thread, so I am done tonight after this one even if someone posts a new question.

#8607 was first assigned in 1963, but we obviously need to check from 1975 onward. According to WBCCI Membership Directories, #8607 was assigned as follows:
1964-1979: Ralph & Evelyn Carter, Plymouth, MI in 1964, Palmetto, FL in 1979, caravans 52 Mexico Winter 1967 & N5 Louisville, KY Post International Rally Caravan 1975.
1980-82: Unassigned.
1983-90: Cecil & Katherine Hubley, Rockville, MD 1983, Germantown, MD 1990, no caravans.
1991-2004: Unassigned.
2005-12: A couple from Lake Charles, LA, no caravans.
2013-16: A couple for DeQuincey, LA, no caravans.
2017: Unassigned.

I don't publish the names of recent members in this public forum, but if you want contact information for the two couples from Louisiana (who likely owned the same Airstream because of their proximity and no unassigned years in between), use the link to send me an email and I will email you the details.

I'll let you guess which couple(s) are most likely to have owned your 1975 Overlander, but it definitely looks above average for the age!!! I'll bet you are probably asked it is brand new.

[dbj216]

Thank you kindly Joe: I'm going to make haste and sign up for WBCCI and claim 8607 if possible. I should have joined years ago.

David

[woodpecker]

Joe
Thank You Very Much !

Have talked to a Beall family member today. Possibly getting some pictures from some of these caravans including the Alaska and Europe trip. In which we were told each lasted several Months. Apparently this was their only Airstream. Will inquire on obtaining this # and more info from Beall family. Family member said " When I see an Airstream going down the road i always think about Paw Paws"


Thanks Again
Al

[Blue Pearl]

Thank you Joe for all you do in finding the History of those Big Red Numbers. I know it takes some time and those you find their history can feel a connect to those former owners who also love the Aluminum and the Club.
And to all the Forum members who Join the Airstream Club to keep the Heritage alive be sure to put Air forums and Joe's name as who you heard about the club from.

Again Thank you Joe for all you do for the club.

See you down the road,
Teresa

[Tom Nugler]

Originally Posted by 66Overlander

Hi Tom,...... I will document how both numbers have been assigned in WBCCI membership Directories over the years and then we can try to interpret the results (which came first, etc.).......

Joe, Thanks for the in depth investigation.
Up close it was easy to see the lower number was applied first.
I think I'll defer to your first scenareo.
More research to do this winter.

Thanks again,
Tom

[solinp]

New owner of an AS Overlander and was wondering who had the number 19207. Do they include what year of airstream this is and when the number was issued ? Thanks for your help.

Pete

[66Overlander]

Originally Posted by solinp

New owner of an AS Overlander and was wondering who had the number 19207. Do they include what year of airstream this is and when the number was issued ? Thanks for your help.

Pete

Hi Pete, There is no coding to WBCCI membership numbers, other than numbers below 1000 have been reserved for special usages since about 1970 (club officers, etc.). Membership numbers started at #1 in the mid 1950s and counted upward. The club started reissuing unassigned numbers in the late 1950s, but new numbers were still required as the club grew. Numbers got up to the low 32000's in the 1970s when membership peaked. Members can request any unused number above 1000.

Can I ask if 19207 is the number on your 1957 Overlander? If so, it was applied years later, as that number was not first assigned by the club in 1967.

[solinp]

Joe,
The ghost number 19207 is on our 57 Overlander. Thanks for your help.

Pete

[TCwheels]

Originally Posted by Blue Pearl

Thank you Joe for all you do in finding the History of those Big Red Numbers. I know it takes some time and those you find their history can feel a connect to those former owners who also love the Aluminum and the Club.
And to all the Forum members who Join the Airstream Club to keep the Heritage alive be sure to put Air forums and Joe's name as who you heard about the club from.

Again Thank you Joe for all you do for the club.

See you down the road,
Teresa

Agreed, lots of thanks to Joe for his help! I definitely joined to keep the heritage alive!

[katieaeiouy]

Hello! We just purchased a 1971 International Ambassador from a long time owner (although not the original owner, I don't think!). We have some ghost numbers on there and after doing a search, I don't see them on this thread, but wondering if we could revive them! I emailed WBCCI membership as well.

The number is 8123. Any info would be great! Thanks.

[66Heathen]

Originally Posted by overlander63

Currently #4503 is assigned to the Keith's in Missouri.

Do you anything on 5312?

[dougsmiley]

I just bought 12383.

Any information?

Probably only 1 registration based on the history ive been told.

[Jewel65]

I recently purchased a very tired 1963 Safari with a stripped interior. It is getting a total rebuild, but I am curious about it's history. I am a current WBCCI member and have a couple of new directories and one old 1980 directory. The number on our Safari 12659 is in the 1980 directory from a couple who lived in Oregon (exact information is not in front of me at the moment of typing this). However, I was wondering how far back I can get history on my trailer. I would love know if it had the same owners from 1963 to 1980 and if it was in any caravans. We purchased it from a local couple who bought it in Arkansas where it sat in the woods as a deer camp for who knows how long. Any info would be great. Pic attached.

Thanks!

[66Overlander]

Originally Posted by Jewel65

I recently purchased a very tired 1963 Safari with a stripped interior. It is getting a total rebuild, but I am curious about it's history. I am a current WBCCI member and have a couple of new directories and one old 1980 directory. The number on our Safari 12659 is in the 1980 directory from a couple who lived in Oregon (exact information is not in front of me at the moment of typing this). However, I was wondering how far back I can get history on my trailer. I would love know if it had the same owners from 1963 to 1980 and if it was in any caravans. We purchased it from a local couple who bought it in Arkansas where it sat in the woods as a deer camp for who knows how long. Any info would be great. Pic attached.

Thanks!

Hi Jewel,
I am not going to do a full lookup yet, because I can tell that WBCCI #12659 was not the first number on your 1963 Safari. The 12659 could not have been applied until 1965 or later.

I believe I can see the two center digits of a likely 4 digit number that was previously on your Airstream. The center two digits look like a "70" to me and assuming that the original number was first applied some time between late 1962 and early 1964, I will speculate that the lead digit might be a 6, 7, 8, or 9, but I can't see it in the photo. If you are able to determine the original full 4-digit number, that would likely correspond to the first owner of your 1963 Safari. Let me know.

[66Overlander]

Originally Posted by solinp

Joe,
The ghost number 19207 is on our 57 Overlander. Thanks for your help.

Pete

Sorry for the slow reply. I've been very busy lately. #19207 was first assigned in 1967 thus first appearing in the 1968 WBCCI Membership Directory. Given that this is years after your 1957 Overlander was built, we cannot just assume that is when the number was applied to your Airstream. In any case, here is how #19207 has been assigned over the years:

1968-69: George & Beatrice Steckhahn, Menomenee Falls, WI, no caravans.
1970: Unassigned.
1971-76: Anthony & Mary Korenak, Brookfield, WI, no caravans.
1977: Michael G. & Beatrice Colwell, Menomonee Falls, WI, no caravans.
1978-Current: Unassigned (only spot checked a few directories after 1985)

So what can we guess from this? My guess is that all three couples in Wisconsin owned the same Airstream because of the close proximity of the cities they lived in. It must have been your 1957 Overlander.

I do wonder if Beatrice Colwell was Beatrice Streckhahn. If the Streckhahns dropped out of the club for 1970 because George passed away, I suppose Beatrice could have remarried re-bought the Overlander, and rejoined the club. Of course, this is only speculation. I have absolutely no proof. It just seems too much of a coincidence that two different women with the same first name in the same city would be assigned the same WBCCI number just a few years apart. It is possible, just seems unlikely.

Enjoy your Overlander!

[66Overlander]

Originally Posted by katieaeiouy

Hello! We just purchased a 1971 International Ambassador from a long time owner (although not the original owner, I don't think!). We have some ghost numbers on there and after doing a search, I don't see them on this thread, but wondering if we could revive them! I emailed WBCCI membership as well.

The number is 8123. Any info would be great! Thanks.

WBCCI #8123 was first assigned in 1963, well before your 1971 Ambassador was built. Here is how that number has been assigned since 1971:
1971: Unassigned.
1972-2014: Booker & Enid Everett, Downey, CA, caravans 145 - Yukon to Alaska 1983, 155 - Best of Mexico Winter 1985 , and a few WBCCI Region and Unit Caravans.

It would seem that the Everetts most likely bought the Ambassador new in 1971 and immediately joined WBCCI, thus first appearing in the 1972 Directory. We have no way of telling how long they owned it or if they took it on any of their caravans. Maybe they kept it the full time they were in the club or maybe they upgraded to another Airstream one or more times during their decades in the club.

I hope you have heard back from WBCCI Membership. I am sure they would be happy to assign you #8123 if it is not currently assigned to someone else. Enjoy your Ambassador!

[66Overlander]

Originally Posted by 66Heathen

Do you anything on 5312?

Originally Posted by dougsmiley

I just bought 12383.

Any information?

Probably only 1 registration based on the history ive been told.

Hi, You are both new here, so I'll repeat what I have said a few times before. Researching old WBCCI numbers in decades of paper Membership Directories takes time. The task is made easier of I know the year of the Airstream the old "big red numbers" are on, because that can limit the number of Membership Directories that have to be searched. Thus, I only provide this service to those that post information about the Airstream as well as the WBCCI number they are inquiring about. Provide that information and I'll be happy to look up the number when I get some free time (no promise that it will be a quick turn around as I am very busy with other things). I hope this makes sense.