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Old 02-22-2016, 12:54 PM   #15
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The trial judge also invoked what he accepted as an applicable metaphoric analogy, "that one can buy a 'pig in a poke'," and if you do and "you don't look in the bag, you get the pig that is there and that's all. Nothing additional. Neither does it give you an action in fraud if you decide later that you don't like the pig." Of course, the trial judge may be correct about southern lore, but he errs in applying the frontier allegory as the law of this state. It is another way of describing the long-since discredited common-law doctrine of "caveat emptor " which our high tribunal rejected as early as 1911 in Prescott.
And speaking of pigs, the supreme court of this state that same year handed down Hobbs v. Smith, in which it upheld a judgment on a verdict awarding the buyers of some hogs in a poke, as it were, both compensatory and punitive damages for the fraud and deceit practiced by the seller who had represented that the swine were "in sound health and condition" and that he wanted to sell and deliver them to the plaintiffs at their stockyards in Dover, Oklahoma. Without looking in the "poke," the plaintiffs bought 40 porkers sight unseen in reliance upon the representation of the defendant. Thereafter, the plaintiffs received and paid for 27 of the hogs. Not long after that the plaintiffs noticed the animals appeared to be sick. The plaintiffs had them checked and were informed that the defendant's hogs had cholera. The evidence disclosed that many of them had died of cholera a few days before delivery, and that the defendant knew his hogs were diseased when he sold them to the plaintiffs. The plaintiffs were permitted to recover not only for the loss of the hogs they bought but for some of the plaintiffs' healthy hogs that became infected and died, and for incidental damages arising from infecting other hogs of the plaintiffs, including their care, disposition of dead animals, and renovation of the plaintiffs' premises. The defense, incidentally, was that (1) the hogs were not sick at delivery; and (2) the plaintiffs were experienced dealers in hogs and were able to examine and ascertain whether they were diseased or not before accepting them.
We hold that the clear weight of the evidence is that the defendants were victims of constructive fraud as a result of substantial misrepresentations made by the plaintiffs about the extent of the land they owned and were selling, that the defendants relied on such misrepresentations to their detriment and consequently they are entitled to equitable relief.
Doerr v. Henry, 806 P.2d 669 (Okla.App. Div. 4, 1990).
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Old 02-22-2016, 01:13 PM   #16
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Hate to say it but we have several members who lost their rigs to roll overs and none of them were using under-powered vehicles. Some times experience or lack-there-of is the real issue. Some times it is just circumstance like high winds or other drivers...we don't know very much about this accident,
JCW
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Old 02-22-2016, 03:12 PM   #17
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So I guess you don't have to be respnsible for yourself, you can get a lawyer for that.
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Old 02-22-2016, 03:21 PM   #18
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I drove a WWII 1/4 ton Jeep with a 80 gal water tank and pump for putting out grass fires that had recurve leaf springs.
Not sure it was designed that way, but they never broke.
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Old 02-22-2016, 03:37 PM   #19
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Sadly, many ONLY learn by Experience...

Good or bad ones! See 'em everywhere as I've grown (even seen him in the mirror too!). Bet if he now reads the contract, there's most likely a clause discussing ARBITRATION. So, attorneys can advise him to a point. Yes, there aren't total facts for us to glean, as has been said about this in the forum: You can learn a lot of insight - Good people WILLING to teach; however, you're ultimately in charge of fact checking. Sorry for those that think sales people are your friends at ANY point in the sale. In fact, most stores state: If it's not agreed to IN WRITING, and signed by the sales manager, verbal "puffery" means nothing to the deal.
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Old 02-22-2016, 04:36 PM   #20
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If you read the whole story, it may have been a small trailer, and the owner should be held responsible instead of blaming someone else.....
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Old 02-22-2016, 04:54 PM   #21
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Filing a lawsuit is not the same thing as actually winning or forcing a good settlement.
Hope I am still pulling when 80.
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Old 02-22-2016, 04:56 PM   #22
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How many times have I heard from an Airstream salesman as he glances at my truck......"oh yeah that will pull it".

Last time I heard that was when looking at a 28 foot International. We drove up in a 1500 RAM Hemi. Sure it'll pull it up the grade, it's coming down when it gets a bit dodgy with the minimal weight distribution system that most dealers install, quickly to get you out the door.

Bottom line. Most people don't do the proper research before buying. That's the beauty of AirForums. There is a lot of good advice here.
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Old 02-23-2016, 12:11 AM   #23
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So I guess you don't have to be respnsible for yourself, you can get a lawyer for that.

Well, lawyers are responsible....

Right?

Jay and Lisa

Right?
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Old 02-23-2016, 01:09 AM   #24
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So, how does the RV community fix the problem of an 83 year old first time RVer totaling a rig? We can say it's the salesman's fault, but most experienced folks could get down the road without turning a similar rig into scrap metal. They might drive slower. They might install a force projection hitch. They might buy a bigger tow vehicle after scaring themselves on the way home from the dealer. But they very likely would not have had the outcome these people had. So I think the root cause here is a lack of towing and RV experience. The only way I can think of to resolve the problem is a special towing license and I really don't like that thought. Any one got a better idea? Pat
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Old 02-23-2016, 06:34 AM   #25
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Referring to post 23. Watched any lawyer ads on tv in fl lately?
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Old 02-23-2016, 07:53 AM   #26
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Lawsuit: salesman's statement of trailer suitability

Quote:
Originally Posted by bono View Post
As a foreigner, I guess I will never understand how somebody can sue a salesman for selling something. As OP mentioned, do your homework and be responsible for what you are doing. Use common sense.

As an American I don't understand it either.

It seems the notion that people are not responsible for their own stupidity but somehow others are responsible for others stupidity has prevailed.


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Old 02-23-2016, 08:36 AM   #27
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Lawsuit: salesman's statement of trailer suitability

The funny thing is, had the salesman said "don't you think you might be a little old to start towing a trailer" the dealership could have been sued for elder discrimination.

The fear of being sued by an out of control legal system has caused Americans to walk ridiculous convoluted paths in trying to avoid the reaper.

Such is the fall of nations.


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Old 02-23-2016, 10:21 AM   #28
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Not everyone has the same amoiunts of common sense, thus just one of the reasons we have laws that, e.g. protect the "lambs" among us, e.g. those borderline, or clearly, mentally challenged = ~10% of the entire population, per bell curve. And experience/learning affect each of us differently too as we deploy "normal" reasoning abilities to make decisions.

This news article's situation really is exactly why we have judges, juries, and the legal system we have chosen. We (news-hounds in AF w/ spare time ) get to read the brief news article but we don't know any of the rest of the relevant facts. The judge & jury will consider the actual case's individual and provable circumstances/facts. Mere onlookers (us) just get to weigh-in with some of the reasonable/likely possibilities, but any of these possibilities might be the actual case (or, it can easily be that there is actually some other, unconsidered possibility). So....

Scenario 1: Seller is not at all responsible, i.e. Buyer is 100% responsible, because seller ascertained that the buyer is demonstrably "smart enough" and/or "experienced enough" to understand and accept the trade-offs of this TV-TT combination,

Scenario 2: Seller is partially responsible (jury usually apportions how much) due to e.g. seller recognized that the buyer had an impairment in the "smart a/o experienced enough" areas so seller should have delayed, or even declined, the sale pending correction of the concerns,

Scenario 3: Seller completely responsible, perhaps even criminally so, when there is demonstrable seller wanton/reckless disregard/gross negligence (or worse: malice, which is hard to prove, but not impossible).

IMO, even with its flaws, I'm glad we have this legal system where each case will be decided on its individual merits and law (i.e. not decided by the merely gruntled or disgruntled onlookers).
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