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-   -   Honda 2000 rough idle after storage....???? (https://www.airforums.com/forums/f448/honda-2000-rough-idle-after-storage-15707.html)

crazylev 03-06-2005 05:08 PM

Honda 2000 rough idle after storage....????
 
Greetings.

A fine day in Chicago, and it seemed to be a good oportunity to fire up the Honda 2000 for a while to run some gas through the generator after sitting dormant for the winter.

In the fall, before storing, I filled the tank with fresh Prem. Unleaded gas, a few ounces of Stabil. According to the instructions on the sta-bil, you use 1 oz for every 2 1/2 gallons of fuel, or for longer term storage you can double that. I also drained the oil, and replaced with new.

The tank on the Honda is only about a gallon, so I threw in a little more than one ounce. maybe two.

Three months later...now.

The Honda started up after about six tugs, I let it warm up, choke on, Eco-throttle OFF.

After a couple of minutes warm up, I turned the choke off, and the generator started, but it is idling roughly. The only way to describe it is that it sounds like it is going to stall, but then picks up speed again, and repeats this.

If I turned the choke to 3/4 on, it seems to idle smoother, but then when I switch on the eco-throttle, it does the same thing.

My gut tells me I should dump the gas in the tank, open the carberator drain screw for a minute. Then refill with a fresh tank of gas.

Do you think I could have added to much Sta-bil to the gas? Anyone care to enlighten me? Did I totally screw up my 2000?

We've really only used the generator on a couple of occasions.

Thanks, and happy spring, sort of.

Jonathan

thenewkid64 03-06-2005 05:30 PM

Did you run the gen-set for 20 min or so after adding the stabil? Or drain the carb and fill it with the additive laced fuel?

If you did nit, then the un-stabil gas could have gummed up the carb...........

3Ms75Argosy 03-06-2005 05:57 PM

Mine did this too
 
Mine did the idle boogy thing too after it sat for awhile. My solution was to turn the ECO button off, and let it run with the choke off for about 30minutes. It idled fine after this. I too use Sta-bul, but make sure I run it after I add the additive to avoid the carb gumup problem. I now run it up at least once month for awhile, and I haven't had any further problems.

It took awhile, but I was able to run it off the choke eventually (I turned it off when it started to stumble with the choke on).
I really think gas goes bad after awhile, I tend to add a bit extra of sta-bul vs. what they recommend. I don't think it hurts anything.
Marc

crazylev 03-06-2005 06:08 PM

Hi.

And thanks for your answers. My gen. would run OK if I had the choke ON to about 3/4's.

It idles rough with the choke off. So if I just let the gen run with the choke off, and eco throttle off, running rough, that it would eventually run smoothly, say after about 1/2 hour?

And yes, I did run the honda with the infused gas in the fall.

thanks again.

Jonathan

bjond 03-06-2005 07:13 PM

Honda generator
 
I have a 1000 that does this after not being used for a few months. Stabil or running it dry doesn't help. I have to take the carb apart and clean the jet every time. I think its because the jet hole is so small just a little gum from the gas closes it up.

Condoluminum 03-06-2005 07:53 PM

Bad gas is tough on Honda's
 
We had really bad experience with new Eu2000 in December... Bought unit and filled with gas from storage can filled in early 2004 with gas and Sta-bil per recommendations, and that had been sloshed a little before filling to re-mix any gum or settling...

Net result was broken valve stem and retainer after 30 minutes of running, attributed to "gummy gas" and sticking valve... I'm not so sure Honda's and Sta-bil are good match... Similar issues with clogging jet on Yamaha 600w generator, and need to remove and clean jet after sitting for a while..

I'd do the "Remove gas, drain carb, and start with fresh shiny new gas" routine... Hopefully you can find way to dispose of old gas better than our urban Calif model, where entire can must be surrendered to folks in white bunny suits at toxic waste dump days... Helps drive sales of new gas cans...


John McG

Pick 03-06-2005 08:56 PM

Because of all of the above posts and other reasons, I have ordered a kit to convert my EU2000 to propane. Kit is supposed to ship this week, it was ordered 3 weeks ago. When it comes I will do a thread on the conversion process.

59toaster 03-06-2005 10:13 PM

Very typical Honda and stale gas problem. Honda Mower does the same. Have to drop the float bowl on it evey spring and clean out the jet. Funny thing is my Briggs on the lawn tractor never gives me a issue. this was the first year I ever bothered with Stabil.

3Ms75Argosy 03-06-2005 11:45 PM

You want a fast idle
 
Sorry if I wasn't clear. I ran the gen with the choke full ON until it stopped running smooth. That was my indicator to turn the choke off, and continue running the gen. (all of this with the eco throttle off). The idea is to run the motor fast, which I assume puts heat in the carb and burns off the gum. Honestly, I got a MILD fast/slow idle for about 20 minutes if I tried the ECO switch (slow idle). After 30", I turned it off, let it sit for ten minutes, restarted it, and I put it on Eco - it hicupped once, and started just idling like a top. You might also want to put some Techroline or simular gumout product in to clean it out.

I also just put good regular grade gas in (never Arco - which has a high ethanol content). I don't use super.

I find it hard to believe that one should / would have to clean out the carb each time it sits. My boat sits all winter (with sta-bul) and it never has a problem starting.
Marc

Foiled Again 03-07-2005 04:23 AM

Have a Honda EU 11000
 
I've also owned 4 Honda Motorcycles and one Lawnmower. Fact: choke is manual and you always have to use it to start the motor. In cold weather open the choke all the way, start the engine, let it run a few minutes, then cut back to 3/4 or 1/2. In warm weather you can cut back to 1/2 choke almost immediately. As engine warms the motor will start to sound a little rough. That's the point where you disengage the choke completely. I've never used sta-bill or anything else and have left a motorcycle sitting for several months.

It is best to start and run them once every two weeks or so. Also they really like Amsoil or Mobil 1 synthetic oil. Check your oil changing instructions on the generators, they need frequent oil changes.

Tin Lizzie

crazylev 03-07-2005 10:05 AM

Thank you all for your insights.

I think the first thing I will do is run the generator for an hour, letting it warm up, in hopes of clearing what ever it is out. Though, through another reliable source whos initials are RKM....says I might have to do some generator cardiology....

As far as removing the old gas, my plan was to put the gas that I take out of the Honda, and pour it into an almost full toyota gas tank. I will not just throw this down the drain for ecological reasons.

I assume that the shear volume of the gas that's in the toyota will dilute the gas in question enough so that I can use it that way.

The learning never ends....

Jonathan

dscluchfc 03-07-2005 10:32 AM

What about pouring some Barryman's B-12 in the tank to clean the jet?
That stuff will disolve gummy deposits won't it?

dmac 03-07-2005 10:46 AM

The very small motor in the EU2000i has a carb with a very small jet. It does not take much gum to partially block the fuel flow enough to cause this problem. It runs better with the choke on because the reduced air flow matches the reduced fuel flow. Pour the old gas into your car, refill with fresh gas, and add some Techron (the $6/bottle stuff, not the $2/bottle stuff that has a very low percentage of Techron). Run it a while and it will be fine.

crazylev 03-07-2005 12:28 PM

Thanks again.

Update:

I drained the tank on the Honda, ran the gen until no gas.

Bought a bottle of the Chevron Techron, and a fresh one gallon premium gasoline. I mixed 1-2 oz. in with the gas, poured it in the Honda gas tank. About six pulls, the Honda started, I let it warm up with the choke at about 1/2 for a few minutes, and then turned the choke off.

Success!!! The generator runs like it use to. As I write this, I have the generator running, eco-throttle OFF, and will run it for 1/2 hour.

A ?: how much of the gas laced with Techron should I run through the Honda? I bought a gallon of gas, and put about half of that in the Honda.

Or is my "clogged jet" all fixed, and ready to just add un-altered gas?

Thanks friends.

Jonathan

dmac 03-07-2005 05:21 PM

You can leave the Techron in there for a while, but I would not store it for months. Run the generator for a couple hours, pour the remaining gas into your car, then refill the generator with fresh gas. The real Techron works wonders doesn't it?

Mike Lewis 03-07-2005 06:48 PM

Paula could you explain-"they really like Amsoil & Mobile 1" ????----Pieman

Foiled Again 03-07-2005 07:56 PM

Synthetic Oil
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Lewis
Paula could you explain-"they really like Amsoil & Mobile 1" ????----Pieman

Instead of regular 10W-40. The synthetic oils will allow a small engine to start better in extreme cold because they remain viscous when straight petroleum products start to turn to a gel. Because they have better film strength the engine turns easier during startup and there is less piston wear while the engine is starting to heat up. Once the engine is fully hot the film strength again prevents metal to metal friction, and can actually help keep remove "shellac" deposits piston rings left by conventional oils - a common cause of low compression. If you've used regular oil and are switching to synthetic, common wisdom is to leave most of your regular oil in the engine, top it off with the synthetic - then run the engine heavily for a day or two. Then you do an oil change, including a new filter and go all synthetic.

Generally smaller engines turn higher RPM's so wear is accelerated. A really small generator may take only one quart of oil, so why not spring for the good stuff?

Synthetics also don't have to be changed nearly as often. (And I'm a almost religious about changing every 3000 miles with conventional oil.) They don't break down at high heat the way regular oil does, so they don't get dirty and they keep their lubricating properties. Simplest test to see the difference between a synthetic and a conventional oil; try to hold your dipstick by the oily end between your thumb and forefinger with regular oil on it, then repeat with a synthetic.

Tin Lizzie

davidz71 03-07-2005 10:09 PM

There is a good discussion going on Airstreamlist.com concerning properties of synthetic oil. Oliver Fillipi (sp) made some really good explanations of the good properties of synthetic. I know we have gone over the merits of synthetic vs. dino oil on the forum before but he made some worthwhile comments. The thread is "Oil change suggestions".

Paula,
I run nothing but synthetics in my 2500hd. I use Amsoil in the rear diff., engine, Allison transmission and will change the transfer case after this next hunting season. Matter of fact, the Amsoil Torque-Drive syn. fluid dropped the transmission temperature at least 50 degrees over what came in the Allison from the factory.

Mike Lewis 03-08-2005 09:10 AM

Paula---I hate it when I have to explain a JOKE. I was being FACETIOUS as if your generator was saying "oh here comes Paula with dinner . I hope we're having Amsoil tonight".-------Pieman

crazylev 03-08-2005 09:54 AM

Techron cocktails anyone????

Jonathan

grizzy 03-08-2005 01:47 PM

Living in the desert heat can be a real problem with any small engines -- gas evaporates/gums up in the bowl very qwickly. I used to run the tank and bowl dry on everything unless I used it weekly. No I simply take the aircleaner off before running, spray some carb cleaner in, and start -- this has made a big difference in engines I run only occasionally like my EU2000s

dmac 03-26-2005 08:30 PM

Today I started my Honda EU2000i for the first time since last fall... and like others have reported it would only run properly with 3/4 choke. I followed my own advice from an earlier post and dumped the old gas into my car and refilled the generator with fresh gas and Techron. I ran it for an hour and it still ran rough with less than 3/4 choke.

Then I cleaned the carb using the following simple procedure...

- Remove the red side cover using a coin
- Remove the black air filter cover using a coin
- Remove the lower portion of the air filter to reveal a screw, remove the screw
- Remove the two nuts holding the air cleaner assembly to the carb
- Remove the air cleaner assembly
- Spray carb cleaner into the two visible openings on the intake side of the carb
- Remove the black fuel line that connects to the right side of the carb
- Pull the carb straight out
- Spray carb cleaner into the small idle opening in the carb throat on the engine side of the carb (the brass idle needle protrudes slightly)
- Remove the bolt holding the float bowl to the carb, remove the float bowl
- Spray carb cleaner into the main jet
- Reassemble

It now runs perfectly!

Janets Husband 03-26-2005 08:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dmac
Today I started my Honda EU2000i for the first time since last fall... and like others have reported it would only run properly with 3/4 choke. I followed my own advice from an earlier post and dumped the old gas into my car and refilled the generator with fresh gas and Techron. I ran it for an hour and it still ran rough with less than 3/4 choke.
It now runs perfectly!

I find that if I use a fuel stabilizer like "Stable" or "PRI-D" I don't get problems like that. They both stop fuel from gumming up the works in storage.
I also run my EU2000 at least once a month for an hour each time. Keeps the rust away from the cylenders.

canny_banjo_man 03-27-2005 01:38 AM

Blow Out...
 
Hi Guys....
I KN it aint the same, but 4 wot it's worth...My Engine lawn mower sounded like the same symptons, I let it run a while, then I poured a lttl RED X & INJECTION Cleaner in2 the tank, it realy kicked out the gummed up goo in the bore & freed the piston too, now She runs sweet as a nut, & a lot more responsive 2...well U gotta try the simplest first, + I cleaned the Air filter & New plug & changed the OIL...Come on Grass, GROW, Hee Hee...with ALL this rain We havin now, it'll B 2 feet tall...LOL...Chris.....

crazylev 02-20-2006 02:13 PM

I thought I'd follow up to this thread: Last fall, I drained the gas from the tank, and emptied the carb of gas using the drain screw thing. I also changed the oil. I then pulled on the starter cord until I could feel resistance and then stored.

Last week, after a four month hybernation, I filled the 2000 with premium gas, tugged on the starter a half dozen times or so, and it started up without any of the problems that were brought up on the first post of this thread.

So I guess the way to store these for a long period is to make sure that the generator is dry...no gas.

We will be using the 2000 in a few weeks for a trip to Mammoth Cave, KY. Been there in the Eurovan on the Green river campground. This time we will stay at the Headquarters CG. A very cool place.

I'm just hoping that by the time we get back in the Chicago-area toward the end of March, I won't have to re-winterize. You never know though.

Jonathan

silverback 02-26-2006 04:43 PM

a little vibration but not what I'd describe as rough idle after storing
 
I'm of course guilty of letting mine sit in the garage (for several months...) with a gas/Stabil mix in the tank. After reading this thread I got motivated (worried) and bought fresh 89 octane gas, Techron and carb cleaner. I mixed the new fuel with Techron and added it to what was in the tank and sprayed a couple good doses of carb cleaner down the throat and let it sit for a few minutes. Put it on full choke and gave a few pulls. Nothing. Hmmm it is close to 80 today. Turned off the choke and bingo it started first pull. I did notice it vibrated more in eco-throttle mode but nothing I would describe as rough. Less vibration with eco-throttle off. I guess I never noticed it before and I don't think this is what Jonathan/crazylev is describing. I changed the oil and ran it again for 15 to 20 minutes with the same results. Is the vibration normal (from my youth I recall single cylinder engines like BSA thumpers being pretty bouncy)? I have setup a calendar reminder to give it a least a monthly maintenance run.
Ken

GlenCoombe 02-26-2006 07:09 PM

I'm begining to feel happy I've opted for my Generac 40G QuitePac. For the $1400 delivered price it's been about bullet proof. Just this afternoon I installed a new remote switch with hour meter that I ordered last week after my AS dealer just couldn't or wouldn't get around to ordering.
I use Mobile 1 synthetic oil and change my oil every two weeks when I'm on the road.... or every 100 hours.
My old rolling showroom is for sale and I'm going to take this generator that was on it originally and put it back on and then order a replacement of the same model.
BTW my Honda powered Husquavarna mower is getting ready to start it's third season and I've never had a moments concern re fuel/carb issues. I put it away late in the fall with a full tank...no sta-bul.. and then start it up in the early spring.
Keep your tank full at all times... run your motor often............ use synth. oil and keep on keep'in on.:cool:

crazylev 02-26-2006 07:59 PM

Hi Ken.

After storage the first year and upon starting up the first time of the season, my 2000 exhibited the same behaviour as yours: ran just OK with eco throttle OFF, but as soon as I turned the Eco on, it would start shaking and shimmieying like a lap dancer on crack. Well maybe not that bad. Besides, I wouldn't really know what a lap dancer on crack....again I digress.

I poured out all the "old" gas that was mixed with Stabil and put in new Premium (91?) gas with techron. Started up up, and this time very little if any shake, rattle or roll.

Also during the normal camping season, I also make it a point to start up and run the 2000 for 15 minutes or so to run some gas through the carb.

Cheers.

Jonathan

silverback 02-26-2006 10:07 PM

Thanks Jonathan. Sounds like I have to give the Honda a little more love next weekend. Maybe a full Monty on the carb. I guess my techron and carb cleaner investment were worth it. I really hate the idea of just dumping the gas. Anybody have a recommended/preferred hand sipon?
-Ken

crazylev 02-27-2006 09:55 AM

Hi Ken.

I just lift the Honda and pour the contents into a clean container. I then put the gas from the Honda into our Toyota and use it that way. I make sure the receiving vehicle has at least a half a tank of "normal" gas to dilute the Honda gas. I then run the Toyota to about empty and then fill it up.

Jonathan

crosscountry 08-02-2011 03:00 PM

EU2000i Rough Idle Problem
 
I also experienced similar issues with the Honda EU2000i. I made the mistake of running my generator dry at the end of the season, but did not drain the bowl. When I refueled the generator the following season, it started fine, but, as soon as it was loaded, it bogged down. I cleaned the carburator bowl and drain valve of the yellow residue left behind from evaporation of the old gas using Gumout. I also unscrewed the orfice from the stem and found it partially blocked. It was also cleaned by soaking. On re-assembly, the generator would now rev under load and deliver full output.

However, when switching the ECO throttle on, the governor would oscillate, as was described by others in this thread. Running at high speed for 1/2 hour did not clear this problem. I then tried using 93 octane with the Techron (1 oz per gallon) as was suggested in another post. After running the generator with a heavy load for another 1/2 hour, the unit idled normally with eco throttle on! Thanks for the recommendation...it works.

Niner 12-07-2011 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dmac (Post 145924)
Today I started my Honda EU2000i for the first time since last fall... and like others have reported it would only run properly with 3/4 choke. I followed my own advice from an earlier post and dumped the old gas into my car and refilled the generator with fresh gas and Techron. I ran it for an hour and it still ran rough with less than 3/4 choke.

Then I cleaned the carb using the following simple procedure...

- Remove the red side cover using a coin
- Remove the black air filter cover using a coin
- Remove the lower portion of the air filter to reveal a screw, remove the screw
- Remove the two nuts holding the air cleaner assembly to the carb
- Remove the air cleaner assembly
- Spray carb cleaner into the two visible openings on the intake side of the carb
- Remove the black fuel line that connects to the right side of the carb
- Pull the carb straight out
- Spray carb cleaner into the small idle opening in the carb throat on the engine side of the carb (the brass idle needle protrudes slightly)
- Remove the bolt holding the float bowl to the carb, remove the float bowl
- Spray carb cleaner into the main jet
- Reassemble

It now runs perfectly!

Just bought a used EU1000i and it wouldn't run even with the choke off. So, I warmed it up, changed the oil, installed 8 fl oz ( one cup) worth of Mobil 1 full Syn 10w-30, cleaned the air filter, and then followed up with some Chevron premium and an ounce of the Techron. Ran it for an hour, still not better, would change speed constantly in economy mode, still would not run at all without the choke being on, and hard to start, to boot, when cold.

So I followed your procedure.
Tools:
8mm socket, 10mm socket, 1/4" drive ratchet, needle nosed pliers for main fuel line clamp and removal/install Gum Out carb cleaner, and went to town. The carb cleaner didn't get the job done, even with a 15min soak with the float bowl off on the, and prodigious coaxing in the main jet with Gum Out, so I went to the next step.

I have a little air compressor with a rubber conical tipped nozzle with a trigger to control flow, that I used, along with blocking the hole on the side of the main jet with my finger, near the fuel bowl cutoff floats, that I directed a 100 psi blast at. 2 blasts with that, then followed by a last Gum Out solvent blast, and I put every thing back together.

The EU1000i now runs like a sewing machine again.
So if fresh fuel with Techron doesn't solve the problem, and Gum Out doesn't solve the problem, with a good soaking, take the next step and use a compressor with a rubber tip with about 40 to 50 psi air pressure, to blow the jet and orfices out to get them clean again.

Good luck! And thanks for the tips here!


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