Just purchased 1950 Flying Cloud

[Aerowood]

Alodine is a chromic acid and should be treated as such. It is safe to use if you follow standard chemical handling procedures such as gogles or sheild and rubber gloves and a chemical apron if you choose. I've never heard of getting the chemicals at a drug store but I've never tried either. We have dip tanks here at work that I use. As to a tube spar wing and early Airstream construction you are right but you are (we) really showing your age to have seen this type of wing construstion before.

[NorCal Bambi]

Aerowood, I've flown in a Waco biplane. However it was old even to my standards. As for as I'm concerned, if it leaves the ground, it's cool.
Don

[FC7039]

Aero,

I am relying on your expertise here. I just received alodine and alumiprep via Fed Ex from http://www.aircraftspruce.com. Alumiprep’s data sheet say to not use on high copper bearing aluminum. I thought that copper was the main alloy for 2024. I hope that this is not considered high bearing.

On a side note. I am using a magnifying glass to read the data sheet. Another odd/interesting item. These items can't be sent via US mail because they are considered hazardous so I had to use Fed Ex. Here is what intrigues me. The shipping was only $9 and some. Why is everyone else’s Fed Ex shipping much higher? I think most stick it to the impatient. Just my thought.

[Aerowood]

The alumiprep will work fine on the 2024, I do it daily. Just make sure that if it is full strength that you dilute with water. If the aluminum starts turning a dark gray the alumiprep is to strong or been allowed to soak to long. Just spray it on and wash it off, that's all longer it takes, if the aluminum is clean to start with. Gentle washing with a scotch bright works well for more corroded or dirty metal. To apply the alodine the aluminum just needs to show color to be the right amount. Do not touch the metal with your bare hands until after her primer is applied. Long emerson times with either chemical does more harm then good. The process is very fast. Have fun and work safe.

Kip

[FC7039]

I welded on some supports for some stabilizing jacks and made recessed "cans" for them in the belly skin. The front is not as deep so the jack in not completely recessed. The back is totally as I made the belly deeper to accomdate tanks.

A side note. My welding class was my son giving me about 15 minutes of instruction. His welding experience was shop class at in high school a few years ago. I bought a welder on Craigs List and all my experience is on the trailer. Who knows, the welds may not hold, they certainly do not look good, but they do pass the 3 lbs. sledge test. And, no one will be able to see them unless they have the trailer apart as I do. Keep it our little secret.









I am making progress on the items in the belly such as places for tanks and such. A few more minor things and it is time for a floor and then the side and end skins. This I am amprehensive about as there was not any original floor except for some small rotted pieces under the channel. I am thinking I am going to cut the floor a little big, set the shell down and make final measurements, lift the shell off again and cut the floor to its final shape.

When lifting the 3/4 plywood that I have been using as a temp floor, it is heavy. I looked it up and it can weight up to 75+ pound a sheet. This will easily add 200+ pounds to the weight. I know that there was already plywood there, but I added weight to the frame and am adding water tanks and who know what else. Is there a light weight alternative to plywood? One though I had that builds on my thoughts of using 1/2 aluminum channel running the lenght of the frame is to sandwich the channel between two sheets of luan. I know luan is not marine but I think I can seal it up. I can also add insulation between the plys. I think this would be a stronger floor and lighter by as much as half. Any thoughts?

Also a picture of my "panel lifter".

[byamcaravanner]

Originally Posted by FC7039

I welded on some supports for some stabilizing jacks and made recessed "cans" for them in the belly skin.

Looks great! where did you get those jacks you used? Is the extension removed for stowing or does it pivot into the recess? Is that a circular recessed area for a spare tire that I see in on of the pictures?

[Silverhobby]

Steve, looks to me like the stabilizer jacks are from Atwood, part # 82301. Priced at $23.95 retail. They have a stabilizing load capacity of 1000 pounds and a lifting capacity of 650 pounds.

[InsideOut]

Originally Posted by FC7039

When lifting the 3/4 plywood that I have been using as a temp floor, it is heavy. I looked it up and it can weight up to 75+ pound a sheet. This will easily add 200+ pounds to the weight. I know that there was already plywood there, but I added weight to the frame and am adding water tanks and who know what else. Is there a light weight alternative to plywood? One though I had that builds on my thoughts of using 1/2 aluminum channel running the lenght of the frame is to sandwich the channel between two sheets of luan. I know luan is not marine but I think I can seal it up. I can also add insulation between the plys. I think this would be a stronger floor and lighter by as much as half. Any thoughts?

The 5/8-3/4" plywood is an integral part of the structure of the trailer, it holds the frame & shell together. I think to replace it with something less would be a problem...aluminum channels sandwiched between two sheets of luan is nowhere near as rigid or sturdy as the plywood would be. And you would probably put your foot through the 1/8" thick luan in no time, especially if it breaks down any with road travel &/or vibrating load. I'd suggest sticking with the plywood...and either watching your other added weight or strengthening the frame accordingly - especially with a pipe frame which is more flexible.

Some of folks have explored the more costly option of a composite floor - I think foam or honeycomb-type products, but I don't recall if anybody has actually followed through on it to be able to say how it worked. Also, some olde Argosy's have aluminum floors...but I don't think they have held up well over time. Might want to do a search.

Shari

[FC7039]

Originally Posted by byamcaravanner

Looks great! where did you get those jacks you used? Is the extension removed for stowing or does it pivot into the recess? Is that a circular recessed area for a spare tire that I see in on of the pictures?

I bought the jacks from a local RV dealer. They are the type typically found on pop-up trailers. Probably the same as Silverhobby describes. They use a bar to jack them. You realy only need to jack one notch. Their intent is to prevent rocking, not lift. They pivot up and are spring loaded to self store. I though about scissor jacks but they are very large when stored. I don't recall the exact size but I think around 28 inches long anf 6 inches tall. These store in a 14x4 inch area.

It is a round recessed area for a spare tire. You can see the framing in a previous post.

[byamcaravanner]

Originally Posted by Silverhobby

Steve, looks to me like the stabilizer jacks are from Atwood, part # 82301. Priced at $23.95 retail. They have a stabilizing load capacity of 1000 pounds and a lifting capacity of 650 pounds.

Thanks Kevin! That's the info I needed.

Originally Posted by FC7039

They use a bar to jack them. You really only need to jack one notch. Their intent is to prevent rocking, not lift. They pivot up and are spring loaded to self store. I though about scissor jacks but they are very large when stored. I don't recall the exact size but I think around 28 inches long and 6 inches tall. These store in a 14x4 inch area.

Gene,
Thanks for the technical installation info. These look like a nice mid-way alternative between an expensive hydraulic system and the old screw jacks. Considering the current stage of my resto they would be easy to add.

[byamcaravanner]

Originally Posted by FC7039

Is there a light weight alternative to plywood?

Gene,

Here is a product that is suitable and weighs about half that of plywood. It's got a urethane foam core and two fiberglass skins and is designed for the RV and Boating industries. It runs about $240 for a 3/4x4'x8' sheet. A member here, 65Streamer has looked into this and may have more information to offer if you are interested.

[FC7039]

I am considering this tankless hot water heater.

atmor.net

My question is does it use too much electricity? Would I be limited to use only when hooked up to shore power?

[FC7039]

I made some progress. I have been stuck on a way to get the shell over the frame for measuring for the final cut of the floor.

My drive is very short and with the added steel to the frame and the weight of the plywood, I can no longer move the trailer by hand. I did not think it wise to try to manuver the trailer back under the shell with it jacked way up. I would need to back it under, lower the shell, measure, raise the shell, pull it out, and repeat for the final setting. I am just not that lucky and would probably knock the shell off a pier and have it all come crashing down. See previous post of the shell floating.

My first attempt was to build a frame of steel that would span the trailer and the shell and hoist the shell over the trailer and back. I never realized just how flexible steel is. I tried to use 2 inch channel. Bought some welded some, bought some more to stiffen it, welded some more. With my sons help we tried to move it and it still flexed so much it twisted and crashed. Thank God it did not hit the shell or myseld or son. Anyone want to buy some steel channel?

Staring the the pile of wasted money I came up with the idea to use a couple pieces of channel as rails. I bought 4 castors and rolled the shell over the frame and back. Worked alright.

You can see the castors on the rail. Porgress in moving the shell. The shell on the castors on the floor. Excess floor that will be trimmed and a look into the shell as it sits on the floor.

[FC7039]

I have moved the body back on the floor. I used the same method as before when I did a fit test of the floor (castors on a 2 steel channel rail). I have cut the floor to what I hope is the final shape. I also liberated the hidden panel. I suspect the trailer was damaged along the bottom. Who ever repaired it just cut out the damage and placed a sheet of aluminum on top. You can see where the original lights were. Removing the side panel also let me slide the body over the floor with the wheel wells in place.

I have with much trial and error, more of the latter, formed a front belly pan. I tried to cut and bend and persuade with only so much luck. I was under the gun to get something done as my neighbor is getting a new fence and I needed to move the body away from her fence, and dang, I just need to make progress. Well the belly is not as good as I would have hoped but I will have to live with it. People should not be looking under there anyways.










My little trick for sizing pictures is to right click on them and choose 'send to' 'mail recipient', then choose to make the pictures smaller. When the mail page pops up, save the picture and cancel the mail.

[FC7039]

Looking at the date of the previous post, all I can say is, (pardon) damn time flies.

I have it all back together. Insulated. Basic wiring done (wires to stratigic places)

Ceiling going back in. Or. Trailer ingesting itself. Can you find the UTEE homage?




The insulation is based on others doings. It is "instert big word here" foam board. I scored it every couple inches on the non foil side so that it would conform the the skin. I cut wiring runs with conduit. I then put in a layer of bubble foil.

[NorCal Bambi]

The 1950 Flying Cloud is so so Cool.
Pardon my showing my age, Don

[FC7039]

I have finally gotten the title transfered, 3/12 years after I bought it. I shoud have done this first thing before I started demo. It has taken me that long to get it road worthy and able to pass inspection.

I needed a "green sheet" a.k.a out of state VIN verification. No auto inspection place would do it, though by license of the state they are supposed to be able. I found McClain's in McKinney would do the VIN verification but they also wanted to inspect it. This mostly comprised a walk around, and verification the lights worked and I had insurance on the tow vehicle. In Texas if the weight is over 4500 then you need brakes and an annual inspection.

I also needed to get a weight. The trailer, which has nothing on the inside (except walls), weighed 1860 lbs. My Toyota Tundra double cab (2005) weighed 4940.

I also registered my license plate. This was a tip from a fellow forum user from eBay. I refinished the plate with a little help from some Bondo to fill in the what was rusted away.

[Silverfoxrae]

She looks INCREDIBLE!!! Wow!

[Lance M]

Very beautiful cloud. Nice job on the frame. Any progress lately?

[FC7039]

Originally Posted by Top

Very beautiful cloud. Nice job on the frame. Any progress lately?

I have made progess but not a lot. I do not have any pictures.