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Old 08-02-2018, 12:29 PM   #1
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White Bear Township , Minnesota
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Question about bed size and models

I know this has probably been asked a million times and I have scoured around the forums and read numerous posts but I wanted to get my story out there since everyone’s is different.

First off, I’m new to the forum, so hi!! My husband and I have been looking into getting an AS for some time now. We currently have a TAXA Tigermoth which we took on a two week road trip/honeymoon out southwest in May and had so much fun, but decided we needed something with a bed already made up, bigger kitchen, and inside bath. We don’t currently have a tow vehicle but are in the works to purchase one next year and my husband is all on the requirements for that.

We initially started looking at a Bambi 16 but decided we didn’t want to upgrade later on so were looking at the Bambi 22. However, after looking at AS at the showroom the other day, my husband said he felt the galley seemed a bit crowded in the 22 (we looked at one that was recently purchased so there was a bunch of stuff in the way). We then peeked in at a few FC and he really felt the FC 20 FB felt very inviting. I loved the bathroom set up and the galley set up. However...the bed size may be an issue.

It is just my husband, me, and our 22# beagle mix. He does sleep with us in our queen size bed at home. In our TAXA Tigermoth, we slept on a full size sleeping pad. The bed dimensions for the FC 20 are I believe 48x76? That is narrower than a full by about 6 inches.

Does anyone else find this size bed difficult or feeling cramped when sleeping with your significant other and possibly a small dog?

I brought up the suggestion of a FC 23 + but my husband is very adamant about not wanting a dual axel. He wants to stick with a single axel.

I honestly think I would be happy with the Sport Bambi 22 FB but I don’t know if he would be happy with it. I know he would be happy with the layout of the FC 20 but I wouldn’t be happy with the bed size if it feels too cramped.

We are planning on going back to the dealership tomorrow with our dog to lay in the bed for a bit to see how it feels, so maybe that will help gain us some perspective on the situation. But I guess I’m asking for other’s perspective as well.

I do apologize for the lengthy question, I wanted to make sure I had the information laid out. Thanks so much in advance for taking the time to read and I look forward to spending time in our AS with whichever model we end up getting!!

Happy travels everyone!!
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Old 08-02-2018, 01:07 PM   #2
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2019 25' Flying Cloud
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Bed size

Go to an Airstream dealer that has the models your interested in. Spend time in them. Lots of time. Lay on the bed, check out the kitchen, ect. The Flying cloud 20 is a really nice layout and it is the largest Bambi model. (it is 8 ft. wide and the 22FB is a narrow body at 7 1/2 ft. wide.) Great kitchen in the FC20. We have a 2017 23D and it has the corner bed that is 48 wide. We find it plenty comfortable. Just the 2 of us, no dog. One of our buying must haves was a double axle. Why the insistence on only single axle?
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Old 08-02-2018, 02:51 PM   #3
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The 22 sport bed is wider than the FC20. That's the starting point.

But let's back up to the "Hubby does not want a dual axle trailer". Reasons to take that position include - higher toll fees, more brakes and tires to maintain, and eliminating the interply shear issue. Reasons to reject that position include better directional stability, more load capacity, safety in the event of a flat, and easier tire changing. The cost increase is a valid concern and should not be ignored. The dual wheel well also takes up internal space.

I would not own a single axle trailer. We travel too many miles to make do with a single axle rig. That does not mean it can't be done. Just understand the trade off. Lots of single axle coaches making smiles every year.

However, if you want a queen = FC23FB. The platform is easily extended for a full length queen mattress. There is a tight galley aisle, but it supports two closets, two drawers, a microwave, a reasonable frig, an oven, 3 burner stove, double sink and a pull out pantry. That is a lot of capability gain for the cost of a tight aisle.

So, as recommended - go to the dealer and try them all out. The 22 Sport has a lot going for it. You may find them difficult to find as they are quite popular. It's a great solution for a smaller tow vehicle. The FC20 is a fantastic trailer as well. It has a significant owner group that regularly posts on the forum.

Questions in addition to axles that should be considered. Tongue weight - real with gear, not dry. Tankage size and where it is located. Distance from ball to axle center of effort as a % of overall length. Ground clearance of breakable components. Air conditioning noise - direct vs ducted - can be very critical to your decision if you travel in hot seasons or areas that stay hot off season.

Please, spend the necessary time to fully understand your RV needs. A selection that provides full satisfaction makes for less cost and much more fun from your adventure. Know yourself and establish truthfully how each of you feels about all the issues.

Good luck on your investigation. Pat
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Old 08-02-2018, 02:55 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PKI View Post
But let's back up to the "Hubby does not want a dual axle trailer". Reasons to take that position include - higher toll fees, more brakes and tires to maintain, and eliminating the interply shear issue. Reasons to reject that position include better directional stability, more load capacity, safety in the event of a flat, and easier tire changing. The cost increase is a valid concern and should not be ignored. The dual wheel well also takes up internal space.

I would not own a single axle trailer. We travel too many miles to make do with a single axle rig. That does not mean it can't be done. Just understand the trade off. Lots of single axle coaches making smiles every year.
I agree with this. In my mind, there is a safety factor with a dual axle trailer that cannot be discounted.

Quote:
Does anyone else find this size bed difficult or feeling cramped when sleeping with your significant other and possibly a small dog?
We often pile two adults, a kid (7), and a 35 lb Boykin Spaniel into the slightly smaller than queen sized bed of a 25' FB. Tight? Yes. Warm on cold nights? Yes again.
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Old 08-02-2018, 03:02 PM   #5
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Shulls - you too can have that full residential size queen in your 25FB. A little plywood, a stiffener at the foot and upgraded lift struts gets you full length and no curve. But toasty on a cold night is nothing to discount. Pat
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Old 08-02-2018, 03:39 PM   #6
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Thanks!!!

Thank you all for your replies! I’m so sorry I’m new to this forum stuff that I haven’t figured out how to reply individually yet. Like I mentioned earlier, we will be going back to the dealership on Saturday with our puppers and I am definitely going to be having my husband read through every one of your responses to take into consideration! Thank you all so much! We aren’t going to be buying for a few years, so I know we have some time here to figure this out, but I wanted to get some insight from people who own AS at least. Thanks again!!!
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Old 08-02-2018, 03:59 PM   #7
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Hi

One other reason for "I want a single axle" can be "it's easier to back up". Based on what I have towed, longer trailers are actually easier to back up than shorter ones. One axle vs two makes very little difference when attached to a tow vehicle. Most AS trailer are heavy enough on the tongue that moving them on a dolly is problematic. (at least on anything other than smooth / flat concrete).

Bob
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Old 08-02-2018, 05:23 PM   #8
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"I brought up the suggestion of a FC 23 + but my husband is very adamant about not wanting a dual axel. He wants to stick with a single axel."


This has a lot of us curious. It's almost always the other way around. Care to have him enlighten us?



BTW, the Single Axles are great trailers, as are the Doubles. Seems you're looking at the really important stuff in terms of your needs.
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Old 08-02-2018, 05:47 PM   #9
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The bed in the 22 sport is very comfortable to sleep in.

The bathroom in the 22 sport is very easy to use and well-sized.

The 22 sport is not large enough for sleeping 4 people based on our experience.

But the limiting factor with ALL of the smaller trailers vs the longer ones is the water capacity.

You see, with the 22 you can camp 2 adults for 2 days and be very carful with your dish washing and showing and be OK. With more people than that you will need to use a portable to off-load the gray water every day.

With a 25 you have almost double the tank size, so no worries at all with 2 adults for the weekend or longer.

But as to the beds, the bed in the 22 is a great bed.
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Old 08-02-2018, 05:51 PM   #10
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Your visit to the dealer should let you ask more specific questions IMO. In each size/model, be sure to close the doors and windows, and picture being stuck inside in miserable weather for a couple of days and nights, with all the bodies both human and canine. You might want to bring some bedspreads for the dogs to lounge on, so the sales person does not object IMO.



After the full-scale testing above, you will have a very good sense of what you want, and anything smaller than 23' may not work out, again IMO.

Good luck,

Peter

PS -- To reply to a post, hit the Quote button below.
PS2 -- The new search function in the blue box above works great, and is powered by Google to search only here. For instance "trailer sizes compare" yields:

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PS3 -- Be sure to keep track of the various tank sizes in each model [fresh water, grey water waste, and black water waste]. The smaller Airstreams run out of water, and fill up with waste very quickly.
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Old 08-02-2018, 06:11 PM   #11
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Everyone is different. With just me and dog and cat, we manage to take up all of the short queen 60x75" mattress. I never counted axles, but I did count the larger bathroom, 39 gallon tanks, two AC units and great kitchen in the FC 26. If you're just weekenders, the Bambi's might be adequate.
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Old 08-02-2018, 06:48 PM   #12
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White Bear Township , Minnesota
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Ice Man View Post
"I brought up the suggestion of a FC 23 + but my husband is very adamant about not wanting a dual axel. He wants to stick with a single axel."

This has a lot of us curious. It's almost always the other way around. Care to have him enlighten us?

BTW, the Single Axles are great trailers, as are the Doubles. Seems you're looking at the really important stuff in terms of your needs.
So I asked my husband to explain to me why he insists on staying with a single axel and he says he doesn’t want to get a full sized truck. Our plan is to pay off my Outback by next tax season, get a truck by next fall (our tow vehicle which will be his main drive vehicle), he will sell his VW Golf, we will only have one car payment then, and then get the AS by spring of 2020.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Piggy Bank View Post
The bed in the 22 sport is very comfortable to sleep in.

The bathroom in the 22 sport is very easy to use and well-sized.

The 22 sport is not large enough for sleeping 4 people based on our experience.

But the limiting factor with ALL of the smaller trailers vs the longer ones is the water capacity.

You see, with the 22 you can camp 2 adults for 2 days and be very carful with your dish washing and showing and be OK. With more people than that you will need to use a portable to off-load the gray water every day.

With a 25 you have almost double the tank size, so no worries at all with 2 adults for the weekend or longer.

But as to the beds, the bed in the 22 is a great bed.
Your response was very helpful, thank you! Maybe my husband can get past the narrowness between the galley and the dinette.


Quote:
Originally Posted by OTRA15 View Post
Your visit to the dealer should let you ask more specific questions IMO. In each size/model, be sure to close the doors and windows, and picture being stuck inside in miserable weather for a couple of days and nights, with all the bodies both human and canine. You might want to bring some bedspreads for the dogs to lounge on, so the sales person does not object IMO.



After the full-scale testing above, you will have a very good sense of what you want, and anything smaller than 23' may not work out, again IMO.

Good luck,

Peter

PS -- To reply to a post, hit the Quote button below.
PS2 -- The new search function in the blue box above works great, and is powered by Google to search only here. For instance "trailer sizes compare" yields:

https://www.google.com/search?q=trai...=airforums.com

PS3 -- Be sure to keep track of the various tank sizes in each model [fresh water, grey water waste, and black water waste]. The smaller Airstreams run out of water, and fill up with waste very quickly.
Thanks for that help on how to reply to a post!
And I’ll definitely do some searching as suggested.

We’ll be sure to bring a small blanket with us on Saturday if they object to us having our pup on the beds at all.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Acheron2010 View Post
Everyone is different. With just me and dog and cat, we manage to take up all of the short queen 60x75" mattress. I never counted axles, but I did count the larger bathroom, 39 gallon tanks, two AC units and great kitchen in the FC 26. If you're just weekenders, the Bambi's might be adequate.
Right now we would just be weekenders but we are actually thinking about taking a year off in about 4-5 years to travel the U.S.
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Old 08-03-2018, 06:36 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by PKI View Post
Shulls - you too can have that full residential size queen in your 25FB. A little plywood, a stiffener at the foot and upgraded lift struts gets you full length and no curve. But toasty on a cold night is nothing to discount. Pat
Hush your mouth!

My wife and I share this account and I need no projects (I have enough already!!) Haha.
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Old 08-03-2018, 07:32 AM   #14
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My wife and I have a 20 FC and travel with our 80 lb. boxer. We picked the 20 ft. for some of the reasons you stated. It's just us and the dog; we spent nearly all our time outside the trailer doing things so size and amenities were not as important; I already have a tow vehicle that works and didn't want to get a larger vehicle; fits perfect in our driveway; fits in many small campgrounds that larger trailers wont.

We have a king size bed at home and were both concerned about the size of the bed, but for us it has not been an issue. I sleep better in that bed than at home even though my wife has to climb over me to use the bathroom at night. At bedtime we turn the dinette into a bed, throw on a sheet and blanket on it and that's where the dog sleeps until about 6 AM when he jumps over the dinette backrest into our bed. Then he rolls around and makes a general nuisance of himself until one of us gets up to feed him!
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Old 08-03-2018, 09:24 AM   #15
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Single axle/and bed size

Our first AS Was the Bambi 22 foot. It is a wonderful floor plan. We had it for one year & two months and realize that we really needed 25 FB twin. We ended up 25FBT International serenity and couldn’t be happier. We have two medium size dogs. Plenty of room. And after much discussion with other Airstreamers we realize the twins was the best set up for us. You have the freedom to get up early while the other is sleeping in without disturbing them. Also on a rainy day the dogs have plenty of area to play and run a bit. Generous dressing area also. It really feels like you’re in a 27 or 28 foot . It is a double axle but we are able to pull it comfortably with our 2014 Dodge Durango Citadel with a Hemi and we are getting great mileage. Our last trip which consisted of 33 days we got about 14 miles to the gallon. Also the Dodge Durango Citadel is so Comfortable. It also is great to maneuver and we have stayed in National parks. I am also able to drive and park it with ease. Congratulations on making the decision to purchase An Airstream . We were able to sell our 22ft Bambi To our friends who are not retired and still have children in high school. They are loving it.
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Old 08-03-2018, 09:34 AM   #16
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23 fb

Ultimate Airstream can change a 23 FB into a 23 FBT as Airstream does not offer this floor plan. We viewed one at the Salem International rally 2018 and it was fabulous. They are located in Oregon. Which has some of the most beautiful beaches in the world.to visit .
Ultimate Airstream can offer you and Airstream to continue your travel while they’re doing your renovation. If you’re able to get a super price on a gently used 23 FB do consider it . Take a look at their website and give Ian a call he will send you photos of this conversion. We had work done on our trailer and it is beautiful can highly recommend them.
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Old 08-03-2018, 11:13 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Meadowlark52 View Post
he says he doesn’t want to get a full sized truck. Our plan is to pay off my Outback by next tax season, get a truck by next fall (our tow vehicle which will be his main drive vehicle), -- snip --
Suggest to your husband that he might do additional research on tow vehicles. Not wanting to use a full size truck is good thing as there are many alternatives. Just encourage him to get a vehicle with a low center of gravity, the best suspension, the most precise steering and great brakes. It all makes a difference.

Look at the experience of Jeep Grand Cherokee and Durango hemi tow vehicle users, the experience of folks who tow with a VW, the experience of folks who like their Hondas, and the folks who will not have anything but a Toyota. Specifically investigate the experience of folks who purchase and use a vehicle that will tow well, but is the primary daily driver and functions well to commute, get groceries and take the wife to dinner.

There is a lot to learn, but it sounds like you have the time to research. That is a gift. Lots of folks go to a dealer, sign for a coach, use it a year and find they made a mistake. If they are lucky, they only lose the money it takes to trade. However, for some of us the dream is lost. We are unhappy and end up walking away to another adventure.

So, good on you folks for doing the research and starting early. Hope to see your smiles down the road some day. Pat
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Old 08-03-2018, 11:20 AM   #18
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Hello, We are new to the forum, too. My husband and I researched for YEARS before buying. We just purchased a 2012 23FB and have not yet picked it up. (We have to travel coast to coast to pick it up). We plan to pull it with our 2016 GMC Canyon with tow package. We looked for years and started with wanting a Basecamp... then Sport, but my husband didn't want a wet bath OR a single axle! We gradually moved up and settled on this floor plan. The front bed model reduces tongue weight and it was well within our tow vehicle's capabilities. We installed a brake controller, bought a tire pressure monitor and plan to change out the wheels/tires before our long trip home. It already has an anti-sway tow system and electric hitch. It is a process... BUT we are getting there! So excited (Remember that feeling?!) The forums have been SO valuable to us! Any advice for newbies is appreciated. I think it is great you and your husband and starting the process now as it takes a while!! As for a larger tow vehicle... not always necessary with Airstreams. Your husband may be surprised when he sees the recommended tongue weights.
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Old 08-03-2018, 12:02 PM   #19
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Like many others, my sweetie and I spent months researching "the right" Airstream for us, even though both of us had had RVs in prior marriages. During that process, I lucked onto an AS salesman in AZ who had spent most of his professional life in one capacity or another with AS and had owned several of them; he was now effectively semi-retired as an AS salesman. During our conversations, I ultimately asked him, "What in your opinion is the right, long-lasting AS model for a couple?" His reply: "If you want a queen bed, a 27; if you want twins, a 25." The 27 for a queen because it's the shortest AS having a full, walk-around bed that's easier to make and that each person can enter and exit without crawling over the other. The 25 for twins because the 25 (and 27 twins) has better storage than the 27 queen. My sweetie wanted a queen bed. We bought the 27 queen, have put over 35K miles on it in three seasons, and it remains "the right" AS for us (and our Great Dane).

I note that you are in MN, with somewhat the same weather as we have in the NW (ie, Seattle). Were we in CA, the SW, or SE, I presume that there would be good weather during the great majority of our time with our AS, so being "outdoors" would be easy. Not so in the NW, with cooler temperatures and a substantial chance of pretty constant rain, at least from Oct/Nov through March/April. That's one reason I'd go for a slightly larger AS, to give each party some separate inside space when you get holed up in the trailer for any length of time.

My best to you whatever you choose.
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Old 08-03-2018, 12:27 PM   #20
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Towing Mirrors

Quote:
Originally Posted by VDR928 View Post
Hello, We are new to the forum, too. My husband and I researched for YEARS before buying. We just purchased a 2012 23FB and have not yet picked it up. (We have to travel coast to coast to pick it up). We plan to pull it with our 2016 GMC Canyon with tow package. We looked for years and started with wanting a Basecamp... then Sport, but my husband didn't want a wet bath OR a single axle! We gradually moved up and settled on this floor plan. The front bed model reduces tongue weight and it was well within our tow vehicle's capabilities. We installed a brake controller, bought a tire pressure monitor and plan to change out the wheels/tires before our long trip home. It already has an anti-sway tow system and electric hitch. It is a process... BUT we are getting there! So excited (Remember that feeling?!) The forums have been SO valuable to us! Any advice for newbies is appreciated. I think it is great you and your husband and starting the process now as it takes a while!! As for a larger tow vehicle... not always necessary with Airstreams. Your husband may be surprised when he sees the recommended tongue weights.
Look up "Clearview Towing Mirrors for Colorado/Canyon" You will need them to tow a 8ft wide trailer behind your Canyon. I hope you have the Diesel as the Gasser will have its hands full with a 23FB behind it. The mirrors are expensive but very, very high quality. Just installed a set on friends new Colorado.
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