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Old 06-17-2018, 07:10 PM   #1
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2017 30' Classic
Carlisle , Pennsylvania
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Yet Another Alde Related Mystery

Hi

Ok first a bit of background:

If you hook up your Alde equipped AS to a campground with very high water pressure, the regulator on the trailer lets it through. The next thing that happens is you get a big puddle under the trailer. There is a pressure relief valve on the Alde that pops when the water system pressure gets to a certain point.

If you look at how the fresh water pump does it's thing, it has a pressure sensor. When the sensor says "low pressure" the pump kicks in. It apparently is a fairly basic spring loaded / microswitch sort of gizmo. They have been around forever and ever. They have a weakness - shake them a lot and they trigger.

So if ... err ... you were to pull out of the campground with the pump still on ... it will trigger at each bump in the road. No problem you say, it'll just trigger the obnoxious / overly sensitive pressure relief valve. You'll *finally* get something good out of the darn thing. Turns out ... nope, the water comes out of the faucet in the sink in the bathroom. If you have the sink stopper down, it fills the bowl. Once the .... errr ... 28 gallons of water ... exceeds the capacity of the bowl, it sloshes here and there in the trailer.

Anybody need a *bunch* of very soggy toilet paper?

Any ideas on why the faucet and not the valve? Yes, one possibility is that 25 gallons went out the valve and 3 gallons went out the faucet. I'm hoping that was the case. If not there's a lot of water still somewhere in the trailer ....

So much fun !!!!

Bob
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Old 06-17-2018, 07:29 PM   #2
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Sounds like a great system!
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Old 06-17-2018, 07:42 PM   #3
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I don't have an Alde but in my 2012, I have been warned to remember to shut the pump off when traveling because sometimes a bump in the road can open a faucet and water will start pumping. How that happened to your toilet is a mystery to me. Good luck!!
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Old 06-17-2018, 08:05 PM   #4
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Good evening Uncle Bob. Well, dang. Sounds like an terribly wet mess and a bugger to clean up. While I think I understand the water pump and the pressure relief valve and how it works I am not understanding how this is related specifically to Alde. Could this have happened to any RV with or without the Alde? So no other RV have a relief valve? No, I am not being facetious. Honestly looking to learn more. Hopefully the missing water was left in a trail on the ground behind you.
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Old 06-18-2018, 04:22 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kendrick.l.j View Post
Good evening Uncle Bob. Well, dang. Sounds like an terribly wet mess and a bugger to clean up. While I think I understand the water pump and the pressure relief valve and how it works I am not understanding how this is related specifically to Alde. Could this have happened to any RV with or without the Alde? So no other RV have a relief valve? No, I am not being facetious. Honestly looking to learn more. Hopefully the missing water was left in a trail on the ground behind you.

Based on experience from a LONG time ago, it can and does happen to other RVs without the Alde system. Leave the pump on as Bob noted and it will pump, and eventually pump itself dry on a long days ride.
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Old 06-18-2018, 07:18 AM   #6
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Hi

Most RV's do not have a relief valve. At least the one's I've seen don't have one. The one in the Classic is there only because Alde wanted it to be there. At least that's my understanding. There may be other hot water systems with similar requirements and I simply have not run into them.

The thing I still don't get is why the faucet in the bathroom was the thing that was dumping water. It may be that the same bumping and shaking was enough to let it open a bit. Very weird.

Hopefully the local drug store will get things worked out to re-fill our prescriptions later today. ( Note to self - investigate WATERPROOF pill containers ....). The rest of it is simply a mess to dry up. The little shelves in the "medicine cabinet" in the bath didn't take well to the water. That's just a good excuse to replace them. I never did like the way they worked ....

Oddly enough ... that wasn't the low point of the day yesterday. A combination of my Psycho GPS, really weird "EZPass Express" lane rules and a *very* alert VA state trooper were involved in the more expensive part of the day .... ( in case anybody else goes around Washington, the "express lane" is not for trailers, you can look it up on the web site ... the signs are not as useful as they could be ...).

Camping is so much fun!!!

Bob
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Old 06-18-2018, 10:12 AM   #7
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Well that’s the joys of camping ⛺️ I guess
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Old 06-18-2018, 10:17 AM   #8
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Hi

Well, once we make it over to a couple of vineyards I suspect it all will become just "part of the story", more laughs than anything else. Let's see, first one opens in 45 minutes and it's a 29 minute drive .... .... then there's seafood to shop for.....

Bob
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Old 06-18-2018, 10:17 AM   #9
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Hi Uncle Bob:

I had the same issue and it's the on-board regulator. Call up AS support in OH and they will send you a new one to install (very easy and I'm a fresh sprout when it comes to anything RV). Took care of the problem instantly. There will always be a few drips now and then given the pressure build up, but that's the purpose of the relief valve anyway.

Quote:
Originally Posted by uncle_bob View Post
Hi

Ok first a bit of background:

If you hook up your Alde equipped AS to a campground with very high water pressure, the regulator on the trailer lets it through. The next thing that happens is you get a big puddle under the trailer. There is a pressure relief valve on the Alde that pops when the water system pressure gets to a certain point.

If you look at how the fresh water pump does it's thing, it has a pressure sensor. When the sensor says "low pressure" the pump kicks in. It apparently is a fairly basic spring loaded / microswitch sort of gizmo. They have been around forever and ever. They have a weakness - shake them a lot and they trigger.

So if ... err ... you were to pull out of the campground with the pump still on ... it will trigger at each bump in the road. No problem you say, it'll just trigger the obnoxious / overly sensitive pressure relief valve. You'll *finally* get something good out of the darn thing. Turns out ... nope, the water comes out of the faucet in the sink in the bathroom. If you have the sink stopper down, it fills the bowl. Once the .... errr ... 28 gallons of water ... exceeds the capacity of the bowl, it sloshes here and there in the trailer.

Anybody need a *bunch* of very soggy toilet paper?

Any ideas on why the faucet and not the valve? Yes, one possibility is that 25 gallons went out the valve and 3 gallons went out the faucet. I'm hoping that was the case. If not there's a lot of water still somewhere in the trailer ....

So much fun !!!!

Bob
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Old 06-18-2018, 10:51 AM   #10
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celina , Tennessee
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alde relief valve

Hi all

Had a similar problem with pressure popping the alde relief valve.
Was at Jackson Center when this happened and come to find out the the Alde valve has a pressure of I think they said 50-55 psi anything over that pops it open. The regulator valve on the airstream was a 65 psi valve. So things did not match up.
The water pressure at the camp site was 65 + psi.
They came out to the camper and replaced the whole water hook up area for the fresh water hook up and installed one that had the 50-55 psi regulator on it.

Problem solved for that issue.

This was in a 2017 classic

Hope this helps some.

SJW
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Old 06-18-2018, 10:58 AM   #11
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I fail to see where this is an Alde problem.

Unless the person that left the pump on and the sink facet open was named "Alde".
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Old 06-18-2018, 02:08 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Overstreet View Post
I fail to see where this is an Alde problem.

Unless the person that left the pump on and the sink facet open was named "Alde".
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Old 06-18-2018, 02:20 PM   #13
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Bob, when I lift the water pressure relief valve to empty the boiler the water goes out under the coach, at least that’s how mine works. If I forget to turn the city water off before I dump the boiler, then city water comes out much quicker, more forcefully and continuously....which is how it finally reminds me that I lift the city water on. If I have the water pump on and open the valve, water will again, fall on the ground. I don’t understand how the water (water pressure relief valve tripped) ended up in your bathroom sink. Is there another valve that I don’t know about?

Somewhere around Dec of 2016, I remembered reading that the Alde should only have have PSI at 50-55. I always have my own PSI regulator that I place on the spigot when hooked up, set at 50. I figure since I am rather jaded that the AS installed “anything “ will actually work 100% of the time I could help things out by making sure the pressure is at 50 BEFORE the water can ge to the internal regulator. BUT ....since you were moving when this happened, my external regulator would be useless.

If the bathroom faucet handle is in the lowered (off) position, how does the tripped valve allow the water to come out there? Water pump on or off, how did move the faucet handle? Again, I am not trying to be confrontational...I don’t understand how the Alde can be culprit. I thought I understood the Alde system fairly well but I am missing something . I would have thought that even hitting a bad bump and giggling the valve to open ..the water would have drained out in the usual spot, under the AS.
I know I am asking some really ignorant questions but I’m still relatively new to RVING ..I want to avoid this experience if possible.
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Old 06-18-2018, 02:35 PM   #14
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Hi

What I would expect to happen: The Alde valve trips and the water goes out the bottom of the trailer.

What did happen: The faucet on the bathroom sink opened up and it dumped ( at least some of ) the water.

The mystery is that the Alde valve did *not* protect the sink faucet from dumping the water. It's all one big loop. Extra pressure *should* exit the relief valve and *not* the sink faucet .... very weird ....

Bob
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Old 06-18-2018, 03:44 PM   #15
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Pressure is unpredictable in water systems. The weak link is where the leak starts. I had a slight overpressure in my house--the water heater is tankless, so sometimes shutting off the hot water leads to a pressure spike.

The problem showed itself by leaking under a toilet upstairs where the tank connects to the SS flex line from the wall. So, new SS flex line because the seal was what leaked. The next pressure spike, another toilet leaked--same issue. SO they ALL got replaced with better SS lines as a precaution. I'm waiting for the next leak.....of course.
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Old 06-18-2018, 05:02 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveSueMac View Post
I don't have an Alde but in my 2012, I have been warned to remember to shut the pump off when traveling because sometimes a bump in the road can open a faucet and water will start pumping. How that happened to your toilet is a mystery to me. Good luck!!
Yup, that happened to us once. Fortunately the drain was not in the sink so the only consequence was that we arrived with an empty freshwater tank and a full grey tank. On our current trailer I installed the pump switch in a very visible location and to make it even more obvious it has an LED to indicate that it's on.
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Old 06-18-2018, 05:38 PM   #17
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Hi

I *wish* I could say that it's tough to tell if the pump is on. Unfortunately is is quite easy to spot *if* you bother to notice it. Now, with a bit of access to the firmware on the Firefly system, I suspect I could use the same "brake lockout" that nukes the awning to turn off the pump. Seems like a very rational way to do things .....

Bob
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Old 06-18-2018, 08:47 PM   #18
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Ok, thank you for reminding us to double check to make sure the water pump is Off when traveling. I can only imagine how frustrating cleaning all that was plus all the medication had to be replaced. What a mess.
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Old 06-20-2018, 05:36 AM   #19
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We never leave pump on while in transit so never had this problem but, we took a pit stop on a bumpy route up north. When we turned the pump on the kitchen faucet was open due to the rough road so we now put a bungee cord around it to keep it closed. I can see that happening to the bathroom faucet as well.
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Old 06-21-2018, 06:34 AM   #20
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Hi

I accept that the faucet could vibrate open. If it did, the tank would have run dry and the faucet would have been open when we got back in the trailer. That's not what happened .... There is a bit of travel on the faucet before it opens. It was "all the way down", so not even close to opening.


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