If your making your own portable panel and connecting it to a battery bank then you will need to add blocking diodes. If purchasing a pre-made purpose built panel like the Zamp it is not necessary since they have the protection built in and can be connected directly to the battery.
However, if using a product like the Zamp and factory (or aftermarket) solar I don't think that connecting it directly is the best idea. The 2 controllers will not be set the same and these products were never designed to work in conjunction to another charging system.
Personally I would bypass any built in controller in the portable and connect them directly in parallel to the other solar array (actually I wouldn't ever buy a pre-made one for this reason and just make my own). For this to happen you need to ensure that the panels are similar if not you will have a whole new list of issues. If you cannot match the panels then you are better to install a new charge controller like the one already installed and then you can be sure that the 2 will live happily together.
You can mix and match, but it gets so complicated it's really not worth the hassle and you really need to know what you are doing. And by the questions here I would say that you should stay away from this approach.
So, here's another question about a 30' Classic that we won't get until next month. As you all know, the 2019 Classics come stand with the 240 watt solar system. Question is this, should I have additional panels installed by the dealer before I pick it up? Hopefully the wife and I will be doing some boondocking next spring and I was wondering if the factory solar could benefit from additional panels or would I be wasting money.
To the OP’s question, I do agree with others that going solar can get complicated quickly. Since you are going to want a portable inverter-style generator anyway if you boondock and use much power (solar doesn’t always cut it) I’d start there. Your new Airstream comes with a propane fitting that you could even use to fuel it if so like. There are many posts on this forum about what kind of generator people like.
The amount of solar you have is very personal and dependent on where you camp and your wallet. We’ve found that FOR US to able to use electricity without thinking about it too much and seldom having to turn on the generator the magic number was 500w of solar on the roof and 300ah of lithium battery. Another 200ah of battery would be nice but we’d be giving up more storage and another $2k. Otherwise solar is a fine supplement for generator use when boondocking (for us) but only that. Your mileage may vary. We use an induction cooktop, microwave, hair drier, television, etc.
I would never have the factory dealer install that kind of solar. If you’re “that kind of guy” you can do it yourself with enough research (that’s what I did) or have someone like Lewster (active on this forum) do it for you. Most dealers lack the expertise to do it right.
2023 27' Globetrotter
Pleasant Garden
, North Carolina
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 299
Thanks for the education guys, I didn't realize how clueless I was when it came to solar. I think for me, I need to learn how to get by with what's coming on the Classic and supplement that with a generator.
The way I’m going about this is to not get too bogged down in the equipment but to be pretty clear about what I’d like to accomplish. For us, we would like to camp as often as possible in non-generator loops at national parks and occasionally boondock. I have a generator that I can use when appropriate and don’t really want to spend the money yet on a system that will let me run everything I run at home off a solar setup in the Airstream.
So I am approaching this in two stages. On my new Airstream I am starting with factory solar but am adding two panels and a Victorian charging controller and battery monitor. This will give me a 320W system that on a good day will charge the batteries that come with factory solar (on the GT27, Lifeline AGM 24s) a little faster and smarter (if that makes sense) than stock, and will more importantly, allow me to monitor my solar and battery use.
I suspect this will be enough for us. We aren’t going to be hardcore boondockers and we‘re shooting for a pretty even mix of full hookup and unplugged camping. These additions to factory solar (which I’m having done before I pick up the trailer) constitute a modest expense that leverages the factory solar infrastructure (wiring, batteries, panels). If it turns out we want more capability than that, I will switch to lithium batteries and possibly add or replace panels. But I’m guessing we won’t have to do that for white a few years.
If some intermediate option like this is too much to think about (it was for me but I had six months) I’d recommend starting with the factory solar, possibly adding a good battery monitor to help you get a really deep understanding of the impact of your camping style on your batteries, then go from there. If you have a generator or plan to get one, you won’t be “stranded” and you’ll have time and experience from which you can figure out your next move (if any).
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Airstream adventures and enhancements thread: Traveling with Tatay
Personal blog (photography, travel, woodworking, flyfishing, food): nryn.com
We use an induction cooktop, microwave, hair drier, television, etc.
It's a wonder people go camping at all. I thought the trailer was a luxury. I'm surprised you bought an AS. With a 5th wheel you can get a washer and dryer , Jacuzzi bath and fireplace.
It's a wonder people go camping at all. I thought the trailer was a luxury. I'm surprised you bought an AS. With a 5th wheel you can get a washer and dryer , Jacuzzi bath and fireplace.
Says the guy with a 30’ classic! 😉
I don’t really think of what we do as “camping”, it’s more having a mobile tiny house that we can drop in some pretty cool, remote locations while we go explore. Having enough electricity to not have to think about it too much just makes our stay more comfortable. We go to some pretty remote locations or we might indeed be tempted by something bigger.
Sometimes having a Jacuzzi at the end of the day would feel pretty good! 😏
I don’t really think of what we do as “camping”, it’s more having a mobile tiny house that we can drop in some pretty cool, remote locations while we go explore. Having enough electricity to not have to think about it too much just makes our stay more comfortable. We go to some pretty remote locations or we might indeed be tempted by something bigger.
Sometimes having a Jacuzzi at the end of the day would feel pretty good! [emoji57]
Good answer. 22 years in the army provided me all the “camping” I will ever need.
After putting in 40 years of doing this "stuff" with tents ... no, an AS is not at all in the same category. There are plusses and minuses to that. It's amazing to me how many people fuss and fight about "I want it all" rather than simply embracing the advantages of what they (now) have. (Anybody miss drying out wet tents on a regular basis ?? )
After putting in 40 years of doing this "stuff" with tents ... no, an AS is not at all in the same category. There are plusses and minuses to that. It's amazing to me how many people fuss and fight about "I want it all" rather than simply embracing the advantages of what they (now) have. (Anybody miss drying out wet tents on a regular basis ?? )
Bob
And that's why were all here. We've had enough of tents. But there are different levels you can take it to. The AS IMO was just a comfortable room on wheels. My point was that if you really want all those other creature comforts then a 5th wheel would be better suited. Heck think of all the real estate for solar and all the storage.
WHAT...no glampcamping allowed, whatever will they do now?
Bob
🇺🇸
Hi
As I drive around the country, there are a *lot* of RV parks with great big water slides and multiple other "attractions" right on site. I have never ever in my most insane moment had any desire to stay at one of them. That said, they all seem to be packed wall to wall with RV's. When I get to my destination, often it's sparsely populated with RV's and the cost is .... errr .... less. That's fine with me.
To say that my way is the only right way is nonsense. The vast majority of folks out there vote on a regular basis and they go a different direction. It's not because they are cheap or going 5 miles down the road is too far. They *like* the places they stop at. 5th wheels fit in that sort of setting *very* well.
Yes, I laugh a bit at the 200 of them on a two acre patch literally in the middle of a wheat field. There obviously must be an attraction to doing things this way. Other than having a lot of neighbors and the community that brings, I am at a bit of a loss to see the benefit. We all get to do it our way ....
Seems completely obvious to me, but there are a *lot* of people out there who disagree ... and that's by no means to say I'm right and they all are brain dead. I worked with a "5th wheel guy" for a lot of years. We went round and round on this forever and ever.
Solar only works when ...errr ... the sun shines The gotcha is that to do well, it needs a *lot* of sunshine. We happen to live in the east and the sort of campsites we wind up in are typically nice and shady (at least the ones we like are). That shade can easily knock your "daily solar" down to 10% or less of the best case total.
In a Classic, running the heat (it is late fall ...) you have the combo of power drain and cloudy / rainy sky. Even out of the shade, there may not be a lot of solar coming in compared to what you are using.
As mentioned above part of the answer is bigger batteries. Your stock battery setup provides about 100AH of usable capacity. That may keep you going for a day, it may be enough for two days with some care. Turn on the inverter and the "maybe one day" is optimistic.
For us, the most rational (as if any of this is rational !!) decision was to bump the batteries up to 400AH of usable capacity. That plus the (2017) stock solar panels has done quite well for us.
Even on a Classic, there is a very limited amount of space. Before you decide to give up some of that precious space for this or that, get out and use the beast. See how it works for you and what sort of places you like to go. See how camping without AC works for you ( = the size of solar to run AC full time is massive). You may camp mostly at places with shore power in the June - September time frame. Who knows ....
Bob
Question,
Should all batteries run down on a marginal Solar Panel situation how long will it take to recharge say two stock batteries with a generator to full power.
Should all batteries run down on a marginal Solar Panel situation how long will it take to recharge say two stock batteries with a generator to full power.
It’s more limited by how much current your charger can supply. If you have a 60amp charger, say, and you are charging half discharged batteries (as low as you should go with lead-acid) you would take that capacity let’s say, 100Amp-hours for this example, and divide it by 60 for 1.6 hours. Any 2000w or better generator will supply more current than your charger can use.
Should all batteries run down on a marginal Solar Panel situation how long will it take to recharge say two stock batteries with a generator to full power.
Hi
If your batteries are lead acid, they go through a coupe of phases as they get charged up.
Step one is indeed gobble as much current as the charger can deliver. The big question always is - how much does this or that charger actually deliver. There are a lot of models out there that do not deliver "label" amps right up to full charge. (for some really good reasons ... ).
Next step is limited by the battery chemistry. The battery no longer gobbles current like crazy. The battery posts are now up to darn near whatever voltage the converter is putting out. The battery is not fully charged. Is this the 80% point or some other point? That depends on a lot of factors. One is just what we are going to call fully charged. ( = that could be the labeled amp hours or the actual capacity of the batteries at their current temperature).
After the taper charge part of the process is over, your fancy super charger may indeed drop into the "let's rev up the battery" phase. If it's doing something useful, you don't have 100% until that part if finished.
Best guess with most batteries is that you will be in some sort of low(er) current charge phase for several hours coming from a pretty dead battery. How long it would take your converter / charger to go into super charge mode is very model specific.
If your batteries are lead acid, they go through a coupe of phases as they get charged up.
Step one is indeed gobble as much current as the charger can deliver. The big question always is - how much does this or that charger actually deliver. There are a lot of models out there that do not deliver "label" amps right up to full charge. (for some really good reasons ... ).
Next step is limited by the battery chemistry. The battery no longer gobbles current like crazy. The battery posts are now up to darn near whatever voltage the converter is putting out. The battery is not fully charged. Is this the 80% point or some other point? That depends on a lot of factors. One is just what we are going to call fully charged. ( = that could be the labeled amp hours or the actual capacity of the batteries at their current temperature).
After the taper charge part of the process is over, your fancy super charger may indeed drop into the "let's rev up the battery" phase. If it's doing something useful, you don't have 100% until that part if finished.
Best guess with most batteries is that you will be in some sort of low(er) current charge phase for several hours coming from a pretty dead battery. How long it would take your converter / charger to go into super charge mode is very model specific.
Bob
Agree! I've never been able to get my generator and my PD4655VL converter to get out of bulk mode in less than five hours while charging a 230AH Wet Cell battery bank. Completing bulk mode is only 80-90% charged. Luckily, I rarely need to use my generator to boost charge my batteries with 400W of solar.
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2021 Northern-Lite 10-2 & F350 DRW PSD, 600W Solar/Victron/600A BattleBorn
146 nights 31,000 miles (first 10 months!)
Sold: 2018 GT27Q, 74 nights 12,777 miles
Sold: 2017 FC25FB, 316 nights 40,150 miles
Sold: 2013 Casita SD17 89 nights 16,200 miles
Agree! I've never been able to get my generator and my PD4655VL converter to get out of bulk mode in less than five hours while charging a 230AH Wet Cell battery bank. Completing bulk mode is only 80-90% charged. Luckily, I rarely need to use my generator to boost charge my batteries with 400W of solar.
Good point, I forgot about the charge curve of wet cells. I’m used to thinking in Lithium terms.
2022 20' Basecamp
1968 17' Caravel
Los Osos
, California
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 613
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlandreth
So if I am understanding this correctly, I could add a portable panel connected by alligator clips directly to the battery and it will not interfere with the factory system?
I believe your system's solar charge controller needs to have the capacity for all of your panels combined.
A&M Solar made a modification to the Victron Charge Controller in my 500 watt system to accommodate a supplemental portable solar panel.
In my case it is a ZAMP 160watt panel connected via the (Airstream factory installed) ZAMP connector on my 2017 25FB battery box.
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