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rivetville · 11-06-2016, 01:26 PM

We picked up our new 2017 Classic about three weeks ago and absolutely love it. Everything about it was better than we hoped with the exception of hot water. During our first few days in our Classic, hot water temperature at the fixtures seemed normal for about 15-30 seconds but then quickly dropped to lukewarm. I tried every possible setting based on the Alde manual but hot water was just not what we expected in a new Classic. I had read about the experiences of other Classic owners and was not thrilled at the thought of modifying a brand new Airstream just to take a shower.

In my search for a solution, I sent a message to Bud (paiceman) to learn more about the Factory fixes to resolve his Alde heating system issue. During our discussions on the Alde, he found a technical document for the Alde mixing valve and forwarded it to me. I immediately hooked up the water in our driveway and begin adjusting the mixing valve as shown in the document. Much to my delight, each small adjustment resulted in an immediate change in hot water temperature at the faucets. I continued adjusting it until hot water was plentiful for the duration of a typical shower.

Prior to receiving the mixing valve document from Bud, I had contacted the Factory and they agreed to get us in quickly to check out the Alde. While I was there, I asked if they could check a few other items and ended up spending two nights in the Terraport. The tech (Paul) gave our system a thorough checkout and adjusted the mixing valve to the Alde recommended setting. The temperature that evening at Jackson Center dropped to 39F and hot water after the adjustment was as good as our previous 25FC and 27FB International Signature with conventional hot water systems. There was plenty of hot water with the shower set midway between hot and cold.

While going over the work performed, the tech handed me a bulletin from Alde that addresses the mixing valve with instructions to resolve hot water issues in the 2017 Classic. I’ve included both Alde documents for anyone else with a 2017 Classic. Both documents are very helpful and worth keeping for future reference.

Adjusting the mixing valve does not change the heating system. Heat with the new Alde system is the best I’ve experienced and a major upgrade for Airstream. It’s seriously good.

Word of caution: The Alde boiler is capable of producing extremely hot water. Improper adjustment of the mixing valve can result in scalding.

Thanks to Bud for finding and forwarding the mixing valve document and Paul at the Factory Service Center for the excellent service.

Terry

RonaldC303 · 11-06-2016, 06:19 PM

Terry,

Thank you for sharing this information with us. I've heard some of it but the documentation gives the whole story.

Ron

lewster · 11-06-2016, 07:24 PM

I have been a major service center for the Aqua-Hot hydronic heating systems used in diesel coaches for 12 years. They also use a mixing valve in their systems, although they are called a 'tempering valve', which actually is a mechanical, thermostatically controlled valve that will mix ambient temperature water to the very hot water coming from the heating system.

In an Aqua-Hot system, that water exits the boiler at between 180º-190ºF. It is IMPERATIVE that a proper setting on the tempering valve be properly adjusted. We typically use 120ºF as the exit temperature of the heated water at the point source, whether it be a shower head or a sink outlet.

Also, your system will have a designated capacity to heat a set amount of water per minute, usually stated in gallons per minute or GPM (your Alde might show this as LPM, or liters per minute). If your water flow exceeds the rating of your heating system, you will not get sufficient hot water, even if your tempering valve is wide open.

Hydronic heating is the BEST way to heat an RV, as you are experiencing......but they MUST be properly set to fully enjoy all of their benefits.

Glad that you have found a satisfactory solution to your problem.

paiceman · 11-07-2016, 04:37 AM

Lewster is spot on. I took our new 2017 to a former Airstream Dealer for state inspection, the techs have over 100 years experience combined. They also work on "big coaches" and have done so for years, like Lwester working on the Aqua-Hot systems. They said the same thing. They looked at the Alde, immediately, pointed out all the drains and connections, looked at it and told me it probably had a 2.5 gallon hot water tank built within the boiler and that the GPM for the system was probably set to 2.25 gpm and that to be very careful when adjusting the mixing valve.

They also mentioned that the hot water systems are the best. Further they mentioned that instead of just blowing out the system I might consider adding RV anti-freeze as that is what they were told to do with the Aqua Hot. I trust these techs and have used them for years, so today I am probably going to winterize the system using the RV anti-freeze, it will only add 2.5 gallons to the effort.

Bud

lewster · 11-07-2016, 05:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by paiceman

Lewster is spot on. I took our new 2017 to a former Airstream Dealer for state inspection, the techs have over 100 years experience combined. They also work on "big coaches" and have done so for years, like Lwester working on the Aqua-Hot systems. They said the same thing. They looked at the Alde, immediately, pointed out all the drains and connections, looked at it and told me it probably had a 2.5 gallon hot water tank built within the boiler and that the GPM for the system was probably set to 2.25 gpm and that to be very careful when adjusting the mixing valve.

They also mentioned that the hot water systems are the best. Further they mentioned that instead of just blowing out the system I might consider adding RV anti-freeze as that is what they were told to do with the Aqua Hot. I trust these techs and have used them for years, so today I am probably going to winterize the system using the RV anti-freeze, it will only add 2.5 gallons to the effort.

Bud

Bud,

EXCELLECT! I've seen irreparable damage done to these types if systems from improper winterizing, You can blow out the system....but ALWAYS fill with RV antifreeze to protect it.

paiceman · 11-07-2016, 06:48 AM

Lewster, thank you for responding - I was hoping you would. She is blown out, but will go over and put in the RV anti-freeze this afternoon.

Thanks again for confirming what my "guys" told me

Bud

Mldun · 11-07-2016, 12:45 PM

Thanks for this very helpful information, we have had our new Classic about 2 months and experienced limited hot water. Where is the mixing valve, on the pump under the seat?

Thanks, mldun

paiceman · 11-07-2016, 01:39 PM

Mldun, the mixing valve is under the dinette seat closest to the front of the trailer, where the boiler is. Pop off the end cap only and it's the black knob right there.

paiceman · 11-07-2016, 01:43 PM

Just completed the winterization of our 2017 Classic. Made my own connections to use the fresh water pump to circulate the water to the hot water boiler and the water system. I had already blown the lines and drained all the low points a week ago but as noted previously decided to add anti-freeze. No big deal, used almost five gallons NOT including the anti freeze I'd already put down the drains.

Not being very familiar with this new system and getting recommendations from several people on the forums and two very experienced techs, plus contact with Alde, I decided to do the anti freeze route.

Bud

dickschaak · 11-13-2016, 09:46 AM

I have my walk thru on the 2017 30 Classic this coming Wednesday. This forum has been a huge help. I would like to ask if there are any items in particular that I should pay attention to during this check out.

paiceman · 11-14-2016, 04:39 AM

dickschaak

Check the workings or not of the inverter. Mine and another member seem to have issues with brand new units.

Also, ask the dealer to do something about the doors which the refrigerator and freezer open toward. The handles on the cabinets that the two doors open toward, if they hit there is a dent in the freezer or the refrigerator. In my opinion it's an awful design flaw.

Ask them to follow the directions given by rivitville in his post with bulletins, ask them to adjust the hot water. Also, make sure the Alde fluid is to the level it should be and request a small supply as it seems to settle out after driving a while.

Other than that, video your walk thru, if you've owned another AS, this one is different.

Naper · 11-14-2016, 05:29 AM

Definitely get a bottle of fluid for the Alde, you will need it and its hard to get. Aide's website is not clear what it is. Seems the European systems get a automotive glycol and the US get a boiler fluid. Two completely different chemicals and shouldn't be mixed. The bottle from Alde doesn't say what it is, in fact doesn't say anything. I had to call Alde to find out if was ready to use or needed to be mixed with water. (Its ready to use)
Our Alde heating system worked great for the first couple of short trips but stopped working all together after a 1500 mile trip to Florida. The circulation pump was running but no heat. Bleed the air out of the system and checked the reservoir it was empty. It took close to 2 bottles ( 1 L each ) I assume there was an air pocket in the system. Works great now!!

lewster · 11-14-2016, 05:42 AM

Boiler grade antifreeze is different from water system antifreeze. Both may contain propylene glycol (DON'T USE ETHYLENE GLYCOL) but the boiler grade has other additives in it to prevent gelling when heated.

your winterizing fluid should also be propylene glycol and distilled water mix. In the Aqua-Hot systems, we would add a 50-50 mix that brought the usage protective temperature into the -20ºF to -30ºF range.

dickschaak · 11-14-2016, 07:33 AM

Great info, thanks

SilverPal2 · 12-06-2016, 03:20 PM

My new 2017 classic hot water system is not working , came from the dealer without fluid in the reservoir tank, I put in a gallon and have bleed the system at least 4 times but still very poor water temp, thanks the info above I have reset the mixing and we will see and let you all know. My hot water does not work without the furnance on heating up the coach,

SilverPal2 · 12-06-2016, 03:22 PM

The Alde system has been turned on all day but no hot water unless I turn the house thermostat up

Naper · 12-06-2016, 03:51 PM

My understanding is the boiler is on when the Alde system is on. The heat is on when the thermostat is set above the ambient temp. The heat does not need to be on to have hot water. Did you try the shower setting.

Mldun · 12-07-2016, 10:02 AM

I have hot water and heat but the hot water seems to run out about the end of one limited shower (turning off shower head when not rinsing).

Any ideas on how to increase the volume of hot water. Never had this trouble with the 6 gallon tank.

Thanks a bunch?
Mike

paiceman · 12-07-2016, 11:39 AM

Mldun look at the first post in this thread by Rivitville. In it he gives a detailed explanation of what to do, how to do it with two pages including pictures one from Alde and one from AS.

Mldun · 12-08-2016, 07:28 AM

Thanks Paiceman,
I am still confused since nothing on the Alde system in my coach looks like it has a valve like this. I wonder if it is different, this is under the front dinette from the end and under the dinette. See pictures attached.

Thanks for everyone's help!