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Air Apparent · 03-09-2010, 07:02 AM

TAC (The Airstreamers Club) was formed by two members who were very frustrated with the WBCCI. A challenge was posted on AirForums that it was almost impossible to start a new club. TAC was the result of this challenge.

The WBCCI was formed with the resources of the Airstream Corporation behind it and the drive of Helen Schwamborn. It also had the momentum of prior caravans being driven by Wally himself.

Will TAC be anything more than a loose association of "members" supporting an annual "birthday bash". To be anything more it takes vision, drive, stategic planning, etc.

Will TAC be just a "Flash in the Pan"?

DD.KARAOKE · 03-09-2010, 07:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bluebird

Will TAC be anything more than a loose association of "members" supporting an annual "birthday bash". To be anything more it takes vision, drive, stategic planning, etc.

Will TAC be just a "Flash in the Pan"?

Yeah I think we have this and more!

jm2 · 03-09-2010, 07:32 AM

good morning, Dave,

I clearly believe that this is a different time and a different place for most who 'stream, and anyone who has an absolute and definite answer to your question today, should also play the lottery tonite....

it would be great to have both Wally & Helen, and Airstream here and participating. well, one out of the three could physically be here at some time, maybe soon, and I think that the spirit and goodwill of the other two can and should be looked to for guidance.

given the youth of TAC, I'd suggest that we have a great opportunity to shape where it goes through concious and involved effort of all who want to participate. there is time to do this right. when doing design work, we used to say that "the beauty is in the process.... "

I'm working on how I might best contribute. how about you?

sincerely,

jm2 · 03-09-2010, 07:35 AM

good morning,

would it be appropriate to ask you to combine Dave's other post this morning into one thread, as they are similar?

please feel free to kill this post. didn't know how else to ask / suggest.

thanks!

mistermike · 03-09-2010, 07:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bluebird

TAC (The Airstreamers Club) was formed by two members who were very frustrated with the WBCCI.......Will TAC be anything more than a loose association of "members" supporting an annual "birthday bash".......Will TAC be just a "Flash in the Pan"?

Dave, I'm trying to respond to both your threads. Perhaps they should be combined because they generally pose the same question.

In my opinion TAC fills a need. There are some of us Airstream owners who qualify for WBCCI membership but do not need the formality of a full club with officers, meetings, elections, politics, egos, etc. We just want to have a good time with my family in the company of like-minded people as time in my schedule permits.

The WBCCI simply does not meet my needs at this time. My perception of that organization (and I truly hope that no one will be offended) is it is comprised primarily for older white retirees with plenty of free time and retirement income to fund this lifestyle. I have asked First Region President Franklin Sanders for age demographics but did not receive a response to that query. Since I have a relatively young family this is important to me.

Furthermore, I do not feel I should be required to join a national organization as a prerequesite to joining the local area "unit". Additionally I do not particularly care for the WBCCI's politics and policies as I understand them. Kicking somebody out of a club because the powers-that-be don't like him is unacceptable to me on general principles. Harassing people with C&D orders from some schmuck lawyers who only want to celebrate Wally's birthday with a get-together is ridiculous. Fiscal irresponsibility is another matter of concern. I cannot support this with even one dime of my hard-gotten funds.

TAC is very informal and ad hoc which is fine with me. So is pay-as-you-play. Since there are no dues there are no expectations of anything so everything that is forthcoming is a bonus. I don't see the need for democratic management or Roberts Rules of Order because I trust the founders to run it properly. Fiscal irresponsibility is not an issue. Even if the only event is that annual "Birthday Bash" to honor Wally Byam. the man who made it all possible, it will be okay with me. I will be proud to display my TAC number VT-1 on my Caravel.

To answer your questions, in my opinion, TAC fills a need that the WBCCI in its present state cannot. We the members can participate in making it what we want it to be.

Finally, the AIRFORUMS is a totally different institution and the get-togethers are secondary to the online community.

Air Apparent · 03-09-2010, 08:01 AM

Mister Mike:

I separated the treads because they have different themes.

I started the "Are You Different Thread" for two reasons. It has been stated in other threads on AirForums that there is no need for TAC because AirForums provides everything needed (a posting forum, numbers, rallies, etc). I have also been asked how TAC is it different from the AirForums. I'm not sure that at this time we really know the answer.

The "Flash in the Pan" thread is about staying power. Will TAC have any relevant staying power. No matter what we like or dislike about the WBCCI it has had staying power.

Hope this clarifies.

Mikethefixit · 03-09-2010, 08:16 AM

YEAH What Mike said and more. I did comment more in detail but out of courtesy to others I deleted it. The time of World Travel like Wally did are gone.He had all the assets of a corporation behind him with money to burn. I think most of today's Airstreamer's are young hard working people who just want to go for a weekend and forget about the office and relax.They have no desire for Pomp and Ceremony and have no idea what ROBERTS RULES OF ORDER are and really dont care.
Do I think TAC is a FLASH IN THE PAN? NOPE We have already been doin rallys and get togethers just without a formal name.
We joined TAC because we dont have the time left to wait for the WB to get its house in order.

ROBERT CROSS · 03-09-2010, 08:42 AM

So instead of Camping.... we now go TAC'n?

mutcth · 03-09-2010, 09:16 AM

This question seems odd and rather premature. It's been a whole month or so since the TAC was announced, a wintertime month when many folks aren't camping.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bluebird

Will TAC be anything more than a loose association of "members" supporting an annual "birthday bash".

Even if that ultimately does become the extent of the TAC, would that be a bad thing? After all, you didn't drop $55 in dues into it to join - just click a button and send an email and you're in.

Quote:

To be anything more it takes vision, drive, stategic planning, etc.

One can argue that the WBCCI doesn't have a ton of that either. They have momentum and a history - but that's not quite the same as vision, drive, or strategic planning.

Tom

Over59 · 03-09-2010, 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bluebird

TAC (The Airstreamers Club) was formed by two members who were very frustrated with the WBCCI. A challenge was posted on AirForums that it was almost impossible to start a new club. TAC was the result of this challenge.

The WBCCI was formed with the resources of the Airstream Corporation behind it and the drive of Helen Schwamborn. It also had the momentum of prior caravans being driven by Wally himself.

Will TAC be anything more than a loose association of "members" supporting an annual "birthday bash". To be anything more it takes vision, drive, stategic planning, etc.

Will TAC be just a "Flash in the Pan"?

Perhaps. But I've been aware of "new club" talk for the 4 years we have been around "The Club". The critical mass just never formed as those who suggested such a thing were "talked to" and lacked the time and resource to take action. That has changed. Resources will not be an issue. For some the increase in dues was a turning point in fact or style, other have been wanting a different format. Even if the WBBCI dues was $0 I would take an active part in TAC. At this point it's a better fit for my "camping" values. We will see if elements of ambition beyond those values emerge in the group. I hope not.
I rather like a loose association of members. I do not need to have my camping managed as a Club member put it. Some may, I don't. I have a wife for that. I for one will initiate an annual TAC gathering. I prefer that language to host or support. It's more of a ...If you they will come... kind of thing.
Great movements are not highly organized in the beginning. They start with someone saying I'm not going to take it anymore and then doing something, refusing to get to the back of the bus, sitting at the lunch counter, burning their bra, or standing up to the Red Coats. They start off chaotic and only become organized when an organizing value emerges that enables people to participate without needing someone to tell them what to do. They know the need action that is required by the movement.
Anyone who doesn't take this seriously has not looked at the resume's of those who understand what the next action required of them is....

I Love Being TACy

mistermike · 03-09-2010, 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Over59

Great movements are not highly organized in the beginning. They start with someone saying I'm not going to take it anymore and then doing something, refusing to get to the back of the bus, sitting at the lunch counter, burning their bra, or standing up to the Red Coats. They start off chaotic and only become organized when an organizing value emerges that enables people to participate without needing someone to tell them what to do. They know the need action that is required by the movement.

This is exactly the philosophy that made this country and I am thankful that it is still inherent in some of our fellow citizens.

DD.KARAOKE · 03-09-2010, 10:52 AM

I agree with mistermike & over59 on this one.

Lothlorian · 03-09-2010, 11:39 AM

Winners see what they want to have happen and losers see what they are afraid might happen.

I think the guys who started this club are winners who have a vision. The American way.

The will to win is worthless without the will to prepare. I think these guys did their homework.

I have not experienced the other club and I am happy to join TAC. I am not into the pomp and ceremony, and I think TAC's free spirit approach is appealing to me and my wife.

I am sure the other clubs are probably great but TAC did a good sales job for me. I think it was the Birthday bash, The picture of the airstreams sitting in the beautiful field. I am excited about going to N.Y.

There is a new kid on the block which will offer an alternative to the status quo. Pretty cool I think

Brian

Brian

47WeeWind · 03-09-2010, 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bluebird

Will TAC be just a "Flash in the Pan"?

Do I hear your Motion to renamed it The Flambé Club?

And are you indirectly suggesting the founders are nothing more than Flamers?

And once they lose their vinegar, they might just flame out?

Or will the TAC morph into the Flash-in-the-Can Tourists?

hampstead38 · 03-09-2010, 03:14 PM

I wrote Rob (a bit late) and tossed my hat in the ring. To echo some of the thoughts here, TAC seems a good fit for my wife and me. In most organizations (clubs included) 20 percent of the people do 80 percent of the work. What happens to TAC depends on not on the majority of members, but the dedicated minority. If I were looking at this as investment, I would feel a measure of confidence because Rob has already demonstrated leadership in the WBCCI arena. Frank's passion is boundless. The new club is solidly rooted in "the new media" here and via the VAP. If you had to put money down, would you bet on the high energy, low overhead upstart club... or the incumbent?

I like the opportunity to do put together something epic. I'd love to do a Cairo-to-Capetown caravan. Or a North American caravan from Alaska to Mexico City. I'd love to see TAC have a presence at Burning Man... not something I'd really expect to excite the WBCCI members.

In the long run, I think great, low-key, informal camping will be the backbone of TAC, but I also think the organic, open structure allows for significantly more creativity and flexibility than a more structured organization. Will it succeed? Who knows? I think the possibilities are exciting and I plan to be along for the ride.

drag'nwagon · 03-09-2010, 07:17 PM

Dave,

You obviously think it is worth it as you are IL-1. I am curious to know why you would start 2 threads questioning the need for and the sustainability of TAC if you are not a believer. The group (TAC members) believes in the following to name a few; family, travel, fun, comraderie, participation at all levels. What TAC does not believe in to name a few; beuracratic run-around, archaic grievence procedures, the fleecing of its members, non-participation, and toast for breakfast.

One big difference between TAC and Airforums is that you will most likely get to camp with the founding members of TAC. I have yet to see Andy R show up anywhere for a rally to support his own members. I have traveled with, camped with, and laughed with all of the founding members of TAC and even if TAC is just a handful of us that share the same ideals than I am in! The question you have to ask yourself is...are you?

wheel interested · 03-09-2010, 07:49 PM

Good point. Air Forums Rallys are basically self run spontaneously whereas TAC has two founders. Time will show each emerge and perhaps show more differences. Air Forums rallies seem to go unchallenged from a central point of view.

Questions are always good. Suspicion not so much. One thing TAC has that Air Forums does not is an attitude even in its early days.

ROBERT CROSS · 03-10-2010, 05:40 AM

POI...Andy started a Forum...the members started the Rally's.

Forum members are a very eclectic group...

hampstead38 · 03-10-2010, 06:22 AM

Quote:

One thing TAC has that Air Forums does not is an attitude even in its early days.

The Airforums have moderators, TAC does not.

silverleeper · 03-10-2010, 08:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hampstead38

The Airforums have moderators, TAC does not.

If TAC was a forum it would have moderators....

TAC uses this forum to communicate, promote and organize it's rallies.

Airforums.com has never been a camping club although there has been talk to having it become that.

Airforums.com as it stands right now is just a forum and nothing more.

Airforum Rallies is just a get together of the members of Airforums.com and who ever else whats to join in for some socializing and camping.