Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 04-25-2019, 01:35 PM   #21
Rivet Master
 
2014 20' Flying Cloud
Long Island , New York
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 11,917
Quote:
Originally Posted by SMKovalchik View Post
Have to get this off my chest. Why do people pay large sums of money to purchase an AS and tow vehicle then go cheap and sit in a parking lot? Understand if you’re “stuck” but a little planning would avoid that. Campgrounds are important and why not support them!?! Many are family owned. WalMart sure isn’t camping.


What . . . ?

Too many judgments above to warrant any further energy IMO.

Great recent comments.

Doh . . .

__________________

OTRA15 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2019, 07:57 AM   #22
Half a Rivet Short
 
2017 30' Classic
Carlisle , Pennsylvania
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 8,567
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevejones View Post
Our 2019 Globetrotter only had two 80AH AGM batteries (not 100AH). At 50% max discharge for AGM that is only 80AH usable. The OP probably has the same batteries.

I was initially a fan of the factory solar install but now feel it is more of a marketing thing. It will help charge your batteries but I don't think it has enough capacity to fully charge them if you've discharged them down to 50%. I guess if you keep your power usage low and your trailer is in direct sunlight, it can maintain your batteries enough to provide the basics for the 12V systems. But I wouldn't use the inverter much. Don't run your furnace or fantastic fan all night. And constantly check your battery voltage.

Steve
Hi

The factory solar *will* indeed fully charge the stock (or any other) batteries. Regardless of the type of charge system, lead acid's take a *long* time to charge. That's just how they work. There is no magic way around that.

The factory solar will hit nearly 200W of output with a Victron controller on it and the stock wiring. With the stock wire and two more factory panels you can hit nearly 400W. The panels are fine, the stock controller is ok, but not the best.

With the stock controller the two panels can deliver just over 12A at 13V to the batteries on a sunny day. My guess is that is where the "160W" number comes from.

Again, the problem comes from the assumption that if you have 10A available for four hours that will take your 80AH batteries from 50% to 100%. Instead what happens with any charger is that you go from 50% to 80% at the 10A rate (in a bit under 3 hours). It then will take *much* longer (at lower current) to bring them up to full charge.

======

First step is a power budget - how much are you going to use in a day? That could be 100AH. It could be something very different. It is a number you manage with your usage. If you go with "I don't care" that's not a budget.

Next step is to work out what part of the country you will be in and when. If you are in the northeast, you might only get 5 hours of peak solar equivalent on a good day. If you are in the southwest, you could do much better.

If you assume 13V and 100AH, you will need 1.3KWH into your system a day. At the 5 hour number, that would be 260W of panels at 100% efficiency and all the power being used as it becomes available.

That works on a perfect day in a perfect setting at 100% effeciency . On a cloudy rainy day in the shade, you might get 100WH. If you want to be able to handle four days of rain, get 400AH of batteries.

If you still want to camp when you only have sun every few days, double or triple the amount of solar. If you want to charge the batteries without long charge times, go with lithium instead of lead acid.

So no, it's not simple / easy / you can ignore it sort of stuff. You can *easily* get into the 150AH a day range without much effort. ( = 80AH batteries dead in < 12 hours). That's why the first step is a good battery monitor.

Bob
__________________

uncle_bob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2019, 09:03 AM   #23
1 Rivet Member

 
2010 30' Flying Cloud
Toronto , Ontario
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 10
Images: 3
CarGenerator for off grid power

Quote:
Originally Posted by SewStream View Post
Does this mean you must run your truck on idle all night to use the CarGenerator? What about the exhaust fumes from your TV? I’d love to hear more about your setup. We could not get enough power from the factory AGM batteries to even run the Fantastic Fan overnight without a (almost) complete drain.
No need to run our vehicle overnight ever. Say we pull in to a Walmart or a non-powered campsite late afternoon or evening. Hookup CarGenerator in under a minute (and lock it to the vehicle if needed), leave our vehicle running for 1-2 hours, and enjoy 1000 watts of pure clean power. Safe, Fast, Easy, and without the hassle of a gas generator. The factory converter charges at the rate of around 60 amps DC. So you can see how quickly that will recharge your trailer batteries, given typical 100-200 battery amps capacity. Plus we get extra available power to run all our lights, take showers, run blenders, watch TV, charge our devices. Then we shut off our tow vehicle engine and go to sleep with a full topped up trailer battery, use fans , furnace or whatever with no worry. No problem for the vehicle, no hassles with refilling tiny gas cans or propane tanks, and surprisingly uses a comparable amount of gas versus running a portable gas generator, see our website with FAQs for more info and actual stats.

Like uncle_bob pointed out wisely in an earlier comment, your trailer 7-way pin connector provides power at best around 6 amps DC. Using our CarGenerator on the other hand, charges safely full speed at the rate of around 60 amps! almost 10x faster charging. For comparison, our 5 solar panels with almost half a killowatt of solar, charges average between 10-15 amps, or at most 25 amps for an hour in perfect sunlight at dead noon.

At Alumpalooza May 31st friday morning 10AM, and at the Airstream Intl rally at Doswell rally on July 24th 10:30am, I am leading a seminar, an informative session entitled "Boondocking Power Secrets" explaining and demonstrating the various charging methods and speed of charging (grid power vs. solar vs. vehicle) and answer any questions regarding these topics.
jschloo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2019, 09:07 AM   #24
Moderator
 
jcanavera's Avatar

 
2004 30' Classic Slideout
Fenton , Missouri
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 9,331
Images: 143
Send a message via AIM to jcanavera Send a message via Skype™ to jcanavera
I guess I just don't get the Walmart thing. I guess if you drive till you're tired then it may be your only resolution. I like to plan ahead my stops. Typically I determine how many miles I plan to drive on a day and then check out the campgrounds within that driving distance. Never has failed me to find a suitable campground stop, and on locales that are busy, I make reservations ahead.

Keep in mind that some WalMarts have local jurisdictions that do not allow camping overnight. The local WalMart by me has signs posted. Secondly and more concerning is the locales where some of these WalMarts are located. While I don't believe we've had anyone on the forum who has reported difficulties, I personally would not stop there, especially being familiar with some of the WalMarts in my metro area. Seems like the bad guys are getting more emboldened carrying their own weapons. Even if you are packing heat, the last thing I would like to see is a gun battle. No one wins there. And those aluminum walls don't give you much protection. To those who say Walmart has camera's and good security, I had a friend whose car was damaged in the parking lot. When he asked management about getting a picture, he was told that the camera's range was close to the entry and not designed to reach the far reaches of the lot (where usually you are asked to park).

Jack
__________________
Jack Canavera
STL Mo.
AIR #56
'04 Classic 30' S.O.,'03 GMC Savana 2500,'14 Honda CTX 700
jcanavera is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2019, 09:23 AM   #25
1 Rivet Member

 
2010 30' Flying Cloud
Toronto , Ontario
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 10
Images: 3
This is an informative video that shows EXACTLY how many amps the various items in our Airstream pull, fantastic fans, lights, stovetop lights, and more. Also shows charging speed from our vehicle. FYI
jschloo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2019, 02:49 PM   #26
Rivet Master
 
AlinCal's Avatar
 
1991 25' Excella
2011 19' Flying Cloud
Santa Ynez , California
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 1,176
Add me to the group that does not get it.
I understand there are many ways to Airstream but calling a Walmart lot a "campground" is past me. I can see in a pinch where you might have no other choice, but if you have the energy to sit inside and consume electricity watching tv while in a Walmart lot I would rather keep driving.
__________________
Good judgment comes from experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgment.
Will Rogers

Alan
AlinCal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2019, 03:10 PM   #27
Rivet Master
 
AirMiles's Avatar
 
2018 27' Globetrotter
Apollo Beach , Florida
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 1,142
My comments on this thread don't have anything to do with Walmart. My comments, and most others, are to help a fellow forum member determine how much power can be used when parked in a location without shore power with a solar powered Airstream. Sure, Walmart's don't have shore power, but neither do many of the most beautiful places where we like to stay in our Airstream including most National Forest Campgrounds, National Park Campgrounds, County Park Campgrounds, BLM land/campgrounds . . . Very little commentary on this thread is about Walmart except from those who want to drag this thread into the mud. Let's save our mud throwing for when we get stuck at a great boondocking location in our solar powered Airstreams.

Notice there are no power cords in this picture from the non-electric Jeff Busby Campground on the Natchez Trace Parkway:
Attached Images
 
__________________
2018 Globetrotter 27Q, 32 nights 4,935 miles, 600W Solar, PD4655L, 6V Batteries, ProPride, 16" Michelin's, 2019 F250 PSD
Sold: 2017 Flying Cloud 25FB, 316 nights 40,150 miles, 400W Solar
Sold: 2013 Casita SD17 89 nights 16,200 miles
Solar Production: 213 kWh in 248 days of use
AirMiles is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2019, 03:27 PM   #28
Rivet Master
 
1976 31' Sovereign
Oswego , Illinois
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,726
Blog Entries: 1
Thumbs down

Quote:
Originally Posted by jcanavera View Post
I guess I just don't get the Walmart thing. I guess if you drive till you're tired then it may be your only resolution. I like to plan ahead my stops. Typically I determine how many miles I plan to drive on a day and then check out the campgrounds within that driving distance. Never has failed me to find a suitable campground stop, and on locales that are busy, I make reservations ahead.

Keep in mind that some WalMarts have local jurisdictions that do not allow camping overnight. The local WalMart by me has signs posted. Secondly and more concerning is the locales where some of these WalMarts are located. While I don't believe we've had anyone on the forum who has reported difficulties, I personally would not stop there, especially being familiar with some of the WalMarts in my metro area. Seems like the bad guys are getting more emboldened carrying their own weapons. Even if you are packing heat, the last thing I would like to see is a gun battle. No one wins there. And those aluminum walls don't give you much protection. To those who say Walmart has camera's and good security, I had a friend whose car was damaged in the parking lot. When he asked management about getting a picture, he was told that the camera's range was close to the entry and not designed to reach the far reaches of the lot (where usually you are asked to park).

Jack
Not only bad guys w/guns at walmart. A off duty in plain clothes dep.sheriff pulled a weapon on mo. pregnant woman for no valid reason except he was upset because her husband pushed him away from her lady is white husb. black internal investigation results county board approved $20,000 for esteem of dept?? Couple filed fed lawsuit still don't no results of suit. Our local walmart is not in bad area, now they have posted signs no over nite parking, as far as me I would not even think of staying over nite at wally world except extreme emergency. This Elected sheriff was defeated last election, I won't say any further about his term in office but many ?
featherbedder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2019, 03:49 PM   #29
Rivet Master
 
AirMiles's Avatar
 
2018 27' Globetrotter
Apollo Beach , Florida
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 1,142
Here is another great example of a non-electric camping location for our solar powered Airstreams. It’s at Alabama Hills BLM with Mt. Whitney in the background.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	7FEA99BA-4677-4683-AB45-CB2C6D263F07.jpg
Views:	33
Size:	502.6 KB
ID:	339141  
__________________
2018 Globetrotter 27Q, 32 nights 4,935 miles, 600W Solar, PD4655L, 6V Batteries, ProPride, 16" Michelin's, 2019 F250 PSD
Sold: 2017 Flying Cloud 25FB, 316 nights 40,150 miles, 400W Solar
Sold: 2013 Casita SD17 89 nights 16,200 miles
Solar Production: 213 kWh in 248 days of use
AirMiles is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2019, 05:09 PM   #30
Rivet Master
 
1976 31' Sovereign
Oswego , Illinois
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,726
Blog Entries: 1
Thumbs down

Quote:
Originally Posted by featherbedder View Post
Not only bad guys w/guns at walmart. A off duty in plain clothes dep.sheriff pulled a weapon on mo. pregnant woman for no valid reason except he was upset because her husband pushed him away from her lady is white husb. black internal investigation results county board approved $20,000 for esteem of dept?? Couple filed fed lawsuit still don't no results of suit. Our local walmart is not in bad area, now they have posted signs no over nite parking, as far as me I would not even think of staying over nite at wally world except extreme emergency. This Elected sheriff was defeated last election, I won't say any further about his term in office but many ?
The lady was 9mo. understand why hubby upset.
featherbedder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2019, 10:18 PM   #31
Rivet Master
 
AlinCal's Avatar
 
1991 25' Excella
2011 19' Flying Cloud
Santa Ynez , California
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 1,176
Here's a pretty good reason to not camp at Walmart..http://www.airforums.com/forums/f415...st-193921.html
__________________
Good judgment comes from experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgment.
Will Rogers

Alan
AlinCal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-27-2019, 06:53 AM   #32
4 Rivet Member
 
stevejones's Avatar
 
2019 27' Globetrotter
Martinsburg , West Virginia
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 268
Quote:
Originally Posted by uncle_bob View Post
With the stock controller the two panels can deliver just over 12A at 13V to the batteries on a sunny day. My guess is that is where the "160W" number comes from.
The 160W number comes from there being two 80 watt panels.

Steve
__________________
Steve Jones
2019 Globetrotter 27 FB
2018 Chevy Silverado 2500 4WD LT
stevejones is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-27-2019, 07:10 AM   #33
Half a Rivet Short
 
2017 30' Classic
Carlisle , Pennsylvania
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 8,567
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevejones View Post
The 160W number comes from there being two 80 watt panels.

Steve
Hi

If they are 80W panels then why do two of then put out 200W and 4 of them put out 400W? Since you also get a lot of posts about "my 100W panels only put out 90W", it's not at all clear the 80W units are any different than the ones we call 100W.

Bob
uncle_bob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-27-2019, 07:38 AM   #34
Half a Rivet Short
 
2017 30' Classic
Carlisle , Pennsylvania
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 8,567
Quote:
Originally Posted by AirMiles View Post
.....

Notice there are no power cords in this picture from the non-electric Jeff Busby Campground on the Natchez Trace Parkway:
Hi

Been there and done that at that campground and many similar ones. Solar is not a big help while you are parked there. I have empirical data .... That kind of site is what pushed us to the 400A battery bank.

For solar to do well for you, you need to be out in the full blazing sun. No shade, no clouds all day long. It does not do a giant blast all at once, so hours and hours of sun are what matter.

In most of the east (other than the beach I'm on right now) the campsites are likely to be shaded. Parking lots (Walmart or Harvest Hosts or Cracker Barrel or ...) may be less shaded. Counting on solar without a lot of info on the site can be risky.

Again, the only *practical* way to do this is to put in a good battery monitor. Without something like a BMV-712 there is no way to keep up with what's going on. Trying to do it by "this pulls that and it's been a while" simply is not accurate enough. Voltages, even with temperature charts (which nobody uses), are not good enough to tell you when you are fully charged or when you should stop using the battery.

It is amazingly easy to damage a lead acid battery by over discharge. It is probably the number one thing people run into doing this stuff for the first time. I would bet there are over a thousand posts here from people who trashed their batteries this way.

Bob
uncle_bob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-27-2019, 08:43 AM   #35
4 Rivet Member
 
stevejones's Avatar
 
2019 27' Globetrotter
Martinsburg , West Virginia
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 268
Quote:
Originally Posted by uncle_bob View Post
Hi

If they are 80W panels then why do two of then put out 200W and 4 of them put out 400W? Since you also get a lot of posts about "my 100W panels only put out 90W", it's not at all clear the 80W units are any different than the ones we call 100W.

Bob
If someone has four panels, they aren't the factory installed panels since AS only puts up two. In this screen shot below from the AS parts list, they are listed as 80 watt panels. Perhaps they are capable of more, but if so I would think AS would market them as such.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	New Picture.jpg
Views:	27
Size:	45.8 KB
ID:	339194  
__________________
Steve Jones
2019 Globetrotter 27 FB
2018 Chevy Silverado 2500 4WD LT
stevejones is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-2019, 07:41 AM   #36
Half a Rivet Short
 
2017 30' Classic
Carlisle , Pennsylvania
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 8,567
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevejones View Post
If someone has four panels, they aren't the factory installed panels since AS only puts up two. In this screen shot below from the AS parts list, they are listed as 80 watt panels. Perhaps they are capable of more, but if so I would think AS would market them as such.
Hi

Well, don't tell the guys at Jackson Center that put them on top of my Classic about three weeks back about that .....

Indeed there *was* a bit of conversation about "we only do three" vs "I want six". Four was a compromise.

Bob
__________________

uncle_bob is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Walmart, Kmart and Targets... mack-in-nc On The Road... 1 05-27-2012 08:30 AM
Help With Campground Hunt - Sundance RV Park And Campground - Coram, MT rebelstand On The Road... 4 08-03-2011 01:18 PM


Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by the Airstream, Inc. or any of its affiliates. Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 12:14 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.