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Old 04-04-2012, 08:02 AM   #41
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Originally Posted by CrawfordGene View Post
..... We really need to get out more. I went out to the trailer and replaced more of the floor yesterday—not sure that is "getting out".

Gene
The season is fast aproaching Gene. Nice summation/observation of the thread by the way.
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Old 04-04-2012, 09:29 AM   #42
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I am glad that you have a love of your Airstream and its size. . I suspect based on your answer that any reasons I have for a small trailer are just not going to be well received so I'll save them for another time. Who am I to argue with a spreadsheet?!!!
Bruce
Ah, the spreadsheet. A bunch of boxes where you can put down checks or leave them blank. All very scientific sounding until you get right down to the act of checking the boxes. This is a judgement call and will be different for each person filling out the spreadsheet. We all have opinions and that is not what the OP asked for. He did not ask why large trailers are better than smaller trailers. He simply asked what the most popular size was.

Bruce, you can't argue with a spreadsheet, them thars the facts pardner!
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Old 04-04-2012, 10:09 AM   #43
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Just did the Factory tour and heard it from the horses mouth.....25' is the most popular seller.

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Old 04-04-2012, 10:41 AM   #44
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Just curiosity I guess. Didn't mean to open up a whole defensive can of worms. I was interested statistically.
Dan
No prob, no offense taken or meant. Just pointing out that even tho I may be a first time buyer, I didn't "mistakenly" purchase too small. I have no regrets. It fits my needs perfectly. As others have pointed out, there are all kinds of reasons for choosing different sizes and layouts. But we all have one thing in common, I think....We love aluminum.
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Old 04-04-2012, 10:50 AM   #45
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Actually I like all of the interest and opinions a seemingly simple question provokes on this forum. It's why I keep coming back.
This all started when me and my brother were sitting at the dinette one night playing cards and he said "man this thing is nice, I'm glad you didn't get the little one (Bambi) that Michele (my Wife) wanted. He then said, "which size is the most popular" I said, i dunno but I bet I can find out.
I decided to limit my question to more recent vintages so we wouldn't get into the whole vintage vs new most popular (which happened anyway).
I've been around boats my whole life. Lots of high end cruisers, ski boats, vintage wood, new fibreglass, sail and motor. So I've seen lots of owner loyalty, pride, satisfaction, dissatisfaction and a whole lot of rationalization, usually after a few about why their boat is best.
All of this is tied to human nature involving the choices we make. I've seen people defend good and bad choices......However
I have never seen the amount of discussion about brand specific size, models, trim levels etc that I have seen on this Forum. I'm hooked and proud to be a part of this. When we bought, it was an Airstream at my wifes insistence. I didn't care what or if we got one. I wanted a used 42 ft Ocean Alexander my neighbor was selling. So you can see how far I turned around.
We chose our 25 partly,mostly because we got an awesome deal. Like I mentioned my wife was in love with the cuteness of the 16ft Bambi but I've been cooped up in small cabins on fishing boats for days at a timesi and knew that would not work for me.
All in all I am enjoying our new purchase immensely and it is usually me who will have it loaded up for a long weekend.
This forum is great. I can sit down for hours and be entertained. The discussion is often spirited, opinionated and informative.
I can't wait to meet some of you on the road.
SO........What is the most popular trim level since 1980. BWA HA HA HA HA.
MODS, should I start a new thread for this one.
Kindest regards,
Dan
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Old 04-04-2012, 11:01 AM   #46
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SO........What is the most popular trim level since 1980. BWA HA HA HA HA.
Yeh, I wonder about which is the most popular 25?

This can go one forever. That's cool.

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Old 04-04-2012, 11:04 AM   #47
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from the President

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- in fact -- there is no disadvantage to a somewhat larger trailer than a 16'. One is not constricted by TV choice, for example. The single advantage of the smallest trailer is in parking it for storage. That the disadvantages outweigh the advantages below a certain size is easier lay out on a spreadsheet..
Not always true. Weight is also a disadvantage in larger. In fact, even the different weight models at the same size, which is why I bought the Sport 16 rather than an International 16. It is at my vehicles weight limit, with a little to spare if I pack light. [Also, it is not just parking for storage that is an advantage, its parking anywhere!]

Last January 4, Airstream President Bob Wheeler seemed to agree when he told a Forbes interviewer...

"The U.S. RV industry has to get serious about lightweight. Travel trailers in particular, and the tow vehicles people are buying. They’re going to have to follow the path that European RV industry has taken. I think the European RV industry is 15 years ahead of us here in the U.S., simply with the things they’ve done in areas like light-weighting." [emph. added]

I agree that 25' is probably a good compromise size for a lot of people. But there are still many who need/want to go to one extreme or the other for many valid reasons. Thus the 16s and the 30+s will continue to be sold.
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Old 04-04-2012, 11:09 AM   #48
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In a related question...what is the most popular color of Airstream? Hmmmm
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Old 04-04-2012, 11:14 AM   #49
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Just because I have one, Im going with the Flying Cloud. I Know they were not made for a long period so maybe we could have a Safari Flying Cloud category.
Any takers?
Dan
BTW I'm watching the Today show while I'm writing this and Billy Ray Cyrus is on. I see he got rid of the spectacular Mullet he used to sport.
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Old 04-04-2012, 12:02 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by danlehosky View Post
Just because I have one, Im going with the Flying Cloud. I Know they were not made for a long period so maybe we could have a Safari Flying Cloud category.
Any takers?
Dan
BTW I'm watching the Today show while I'm writing this and Billy Ray Cyrus is on. I see he got rid of the spectacular Mullet he used to sport.
Throw Down!

The Safari 25 FB SE is the best of all because we have one. The FC is an imitation not worthy of the Safari name.

Today? Was Kathie Lee drunk yet?

Gene
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Old 04-04-2012, 12:16 PM   #51
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Smaller is better?

Quote:
Originally Posted by danlehosky View Post
This may be off topic but I can't find it anywhere. Lets say since 1980, what has been the most popular length for a trailer.
I am saying the 25' and he is saying the 19'. We have a bottle Crown Royal riding on this (which I intend to enjoy)

So guys what is it? Are we both full of it. As you an see I am somewhat biased but I have heard the 25's called the biggest of the smalls and the smallest of the bigs.
Dan
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
From what I have seen of prices, the smaller the AS the bigger the price. I think I want one of those 10 foot modifications. Just not sure what part of our 31' I would keep. Wouldn't be the rear bath, for sure. :-)
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Old 04-04-2012, 12:42 PM   #52
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In a related question...what is the most popular color of Airstream? Hmmmm
Silver

Unless you are an Argosy owner.....
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Old 04-04-2012, 03:00 PM   #53
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Talking Throwdown ?????

Gene,please. The Flying Cloud was being built when the Safari was just a gleem in Airstreams eye and is being manufactured long after the Safari finally made It's last submissive bow. For whatever misguided reason production was ceased on the FC for a number of years but AS finally regained It's sense of honor and discontinued the Safari in favor of the ledgendary FC. And yes Kathy Lee did indeed look like she was feeling no pain as she was groping Billy Ray.
BTW there are now four exterior colors. Bright Grey, Bright Gray, Clearcoat Silver and Polished.
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Old 04-04-2012, 03:17 PM   #54
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I would have liked to see Kathie Lee groping Billy Ray. Did he like it? When we are somewhere with no cable, sometimes I get to see KL and Hoda and realize that anyone can be a TV star.

My favorite color is dirty silver.

Is it true every Flying Cloud has a grow room for marijuana?

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Old 04-04-2012, 03:38 PM   #55
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Growing room option

Mine does.(Growing Option) It comes as a dealer installed option only in California, Oregon and Washington. It fits right next to the solar panels. And yes Billy Ray was delighted with all of the attention. I had to turn it off as I was eating breakfast and quickly losing my appitite. But seriously all of the input this forum gets is really great. I gotta get a good Wi-Fi system so I can stay connected when we are on the road. Or maybe not. I'm enjoying this Trailer much more than my wife and she is who pushed for it. Even when It's in the driveway it's like a magnet for friends and I have been ordered back into the house by her more than once. Damn women have no sense of humor.
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Old 04-04-2012, 04:11 PM   #56
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OK, I am a little confused here! Nothing new for me.....
I still like our trailer!
Bruce
I've no doubt you do. It's why reading around here is interesting when folks are specific about the choice they made. It isn't one of defense, or offense (one better than another) but seeing how it works for them, as they see it.

Just doesn't correlate to why one size or another is more popular (any more than my specific choices have been), as it entails large groups of buyers.
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Old 04-04-2012, 04:32 PM   #57
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Yeh, I wonder about which is the most popular 25?

This can go one forever. That's cool.

Gene
Hi, well it's like this; Before we decided on buying an Airstream we were looking at class "C" motorhomes. What we were looking for was the smallest model with an island queen bed. Well this carried over to the Airstream; We wanted the smallest one with an island queen bed. And that turned out to be our Safari 25-B. At the time that we ordered/bought our trailer, the 25-SS [Six Sleeper] was the most popular. Not what we wanted. Later in the model year 2005 Airstream put the door at the wrong end and had to re-arrange the interior to match. People liked them, backwards Safari's and they sold well. A few years later Airstream did a blood transfusion on the Safari's and with little or no change at all it became a Flying Cloud. And finally it goes full circle and the new Flying Clouds now have a new floor plan called the 25-B. [sounds familiar] So Gene, the answer is the FB models were the most popular 25'ers, but since I have remodeled my living room, I have a one of a kind and like it that way.
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Old 04-04-2012, 05:31 PM   #58
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Rednax, are you saying that size IS or ISN'T important?!
I'm speculating out loud. But I also think there is an optimum size as to what any trailer can do before penalties appear, larger or smaller. Humans are of a given size/weight range, TV's are of a given size/weight range. Climate/terrain is of a given range. Etc. Plenty of ways to fence off boundaries per design. Paved roads. Gasoline, not steam powered TV's (though BartS is getting closer), etc. There is only so much one can do on any of these. There are determinants right down to size of the appliances.

Thus,

As I see it there is relatively no penalty in moving up to about a 25' from a 16'. Not in the TV choice, not in fuel mileage. Not in campsites. The differences are too small in an overall sense.

There is the advantage of storage capacity (water & fuel, not just supplies) with a 25'. Being able to sleep more people, and carry supplies that cover more than one season. Plenty of incentive, IOW. And that it follows the TV better than a 16' is another. Etc.

If we posit that anything can tow a 16', then it is also that almost anything can tow a 25'. Not many folks will tow with a Mini Cooper, but we know it is done. As a sedan, minivan or SUV can all tow a 25' they can also tow the smaller. For a family, which is the more likely family vehicle? Even for many childless couples, the ones that can tow a 25' are a more likely choice in the first place. A Mini can get good mpg solo, but so can some iterations of the others. Not much advantage, then, to the one that is better in only 5k out of 15k-miles of annual use (vacations). TV size then, relatively, is not a determinant as "it" is already what they drive.

Aerodynamics is the crucial component of what can tow what. Weight is a distant second. A sophisticated suspension, low COG are the other factors.
If these trailers still were sized as they were in the 1970's we could move up a few feet. But those few feet are (my opinion) a psychological barrier to towing for many. Now its' really getting long. Without any real benefit (assuming we started with compare & contrast from the smallest size).

The mpg penalty on the 25' versus the 16' is small. Vanishingly small in $$ for a given range of TV's as the frontal area is close enough otherwise. Length and weight play their role, but these are close for their respective sizes given the likely TV.

There are many ways to cut the gasoline bill, but a smaller trailer loses utility in the more miles it travels as it is the penalized in having more stops for supplies, water, and fuel. An offset. The seasonal limitation is a big one. Probably the biggest. (Conversely, it is obviously the one most open to intelligent use in re lowest op budget. But that is more planning, I think, than most wish to do. And it is not the one to be trapped in for days of bad weather, IMO. Still . .. . )

This all has nothing to do with better or worse, one size chosen over another. Individual choices are what they are. But, it would be hard to maintain that operating a 25' is more expensive than a 16' due to these factors. Short of purchase price (and this can be all over the place, from free to full MSRP or custom) operating costs can be compared for any person or group which could use both trailers.

Those persons will use a set amount of propane, electricity and water.

The offset is in capacity. That makes the 25' so very attractive. Not the floorplan, hell, people can and do sleep just fine on air mattresses on the floor (a la my teen years). But one trailer will run out of fuel, storage and capacity before the other. That offsets some putative advantages to the smaller sized TT.

Conversely, when we get up to 28' and larger the economy of scale starts to fall off. Two air conditioners. A big propane burn to heat it. A big TV is more likely. Etc. Hard to fit into some campgrounds, much less travel some roads. Running costs are distinctly higher, and without commensurate increases in storage or fuel capacity to truly offset them.

It's a little like cars. Short of electric doodads the largest a car can be where size matters in "safety" is 4,000-lbs and 120" wheelbase. The curve flattens out after that. In fact, it starts to reverse when we hit trucks, etc. That size is about as good as it gets for utility.

There is an "optimum size", IOW, as the given range is small. And a 25' A/S is just about optimum as a travel trailer. It doesn't make it a better or worse choice, but it does make it an easy one when seen this way. (The exact length is not important, but the relation of size & ability is the central idea. One can argue about a foot longer or shorter, but not very much).

I would not be surprised to learn that a 25' was the default choice of those who eventually went larger or smaller once they more closely identified their own needs/wants. A starting point. Were I selling them it is how I would direct others. Start here. Bang for the buck is high. Go either up or down and things change in this relationship of size to utility.


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Old 04-04-2012, 07:25 PM   #59
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I dunno. I still think there is something liberating about a short TV and trailer combo that fits into a two-deep space.

And it always boils down to what you want. While I agree that a 25 is a really good balance (although few people will actually tow one with a sedan or minivan), last time my wife and I toured a new 25fb, she said " I don't want to go camping with my house."

Different strokes and all of that.

Tom
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Old 04-04-2012, 07:56 PM   #60
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I gotta get a good Wi-Fi system so I can stay connected when we are on the road. .
Ask Gene about that, he's our new expert on wifi.
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