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m.hony · 11-10-2014, 06:35 AM

Some years I winterize 2 or 3 times. I will winterize today. We usually take the trailer out Thanksgiving weekend, so after I use it I will winterize it again. If we use it Christmas, I will winterize it again. If we use it in January or February I will winterize it again. It doesn't take very long, especially with the winterizing kit and valve attached to the pump. Sometimes it is so cold at Thanksgiving I don't even bother hooking up to city water. The way to get around that is to park close to the bath house or run the propane furnace and use on-board water.

SteveH · 11-10-2014, 06:38 AM

I have also traveled a couple of times in sub freezing weather with the furnace running to prevent freezing the pipes. It worked.

The key to getting by without winterizing is to know how long it is forecast to stay below freezing. Almost any heat inside the trailer will prevent freezing if it's only going below freezing for a few hours.

But days.....that will burn lots of propane.

troutjock · 11-10-2014, 07:00 AM

Ok, I think I got it. Keep an eye on the weather. Use the furnace when it is marginal . Learn to winterize and do so as necessary when it is not or when the furnace cannot be run.

Thanks to everyone for freely sharing their experiences and advice. Can't wait to meet you collectively on the road.

mimiandrews · 11-10-2014, 07:07 AM

Let me add one more detail. Tanks don't need to be "winterized" if they're empty. I guess the few cups of water that escape the drain valves will freeze, but there's not enough of it to break the tank.

Protagonist · 11-10-2014, 07:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by troutjock

As to 1), backwater tank can still be used, correct, would just have to be re-winterized after every dump?

Clean fresh water freezes at 32°F. The water in your black tank is not clean fresh water. Urine freezes somewhere between 29°F and 30°F depending on the amount of dissolved salts and sugars in it.* Anyway, the point is, your black tank will freeze last, but it will still freeze.

Important point: If you pour a gallon or so of RV antifreeze into your black tank to keep it from freezing while you're using it, do not add any chemicals or enzymes. Some chemical tank treatments react poorly with RV antifreeze to form a goopy substance best described as "slime."

*Disgusting, I know, by there is a medical test called cryoscopy that measures kidney function by determining the freezing point of a patient's urine— as a diabetic I've had to give urine samples for cryoscopy, so I did a small amount of research on the subject. I did NOT freeze any urine myself! The better your kidneys work at flushing out waste products, the lower the freezing point of the urine, but the better hyrated you are, the higher the freezing point. It's complicated.

KJRitchie · 11-10-2014, 08:45 AM

You can always carry a small pancake compressor with you, purchase a rubber 25 ft hose and purchase the fresh water connector to keep your air hose attached and blow out the water lines. Put a few gallons of RV antifreeze down the drains and toilet.

Kelvin

Goal15 · 11-10-2014, 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Protagonist

Clean fresh water freezes at 32°F. The water in your black tank is not clean fresh water. Urine freezes somewhere between 29°F and 30°F depending on the amount of dissolved salts and sugars in it.* Anyway, the point is, your black tank will freeze last, but it will still freeze.

Important point: If you pour a gallon or so of RV antifreeze into your black tank to keep it from freezing while you're using it, do not add any chemicals or enzymes. Some chemical tank treatments react poorly with RV antifreeze to form a goopy substance best described as "slime."

*Disgusting, I know, by there is a medical test called cryoscopy that measures kidney function by determining the freezing point of a patient's urine— as a diabetic I've had to give urine samples for cryoscopy, so I did a small amount of research on the subject. I did NOT freeze any urine myself! The better your kidneys work at flushing out waste products, the lower the freezing point of the urine, but the better hyrated you are, the higher the freezing point. It's complicated.

Protagonist:

Just to be on the safe side, I'm gonna skip your lemonade popsicles if I ever find myself at another rally with you....

Dana

Protagonist · 11-10-2014, 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goal15

Just to be on the safe side, I'm gonna skip your lemonade popsicles if I ever find myself at another rally with you....

I know I'm the one who brought up the subject, but… Ick!

Goal15 · 11-10-2014, 09:49 AM

Well you had to know that you couldn't put that disclaimer up there without somebody weighing in....

baldwin6601 · 11-10-2014, 10:02 AM

Santa Fe is really high altitude and it can get very cold there. Stick with Tucson!

m.hony · 11-10-2014, 10:06 AM

Yep. The difference in temperature from Albuquerque to Santa Fe is pretty extreme.

slowmover · 11-10-2014, 11:07 AM

IH-10 from East Coast to San Antonio is generally "wnter-safe". But be aware that the weather this week will have every truck driver cutting south to that road to make east-west headway. And plenty of other fools.

This time a year ago I ran a bulk tanker load of hematite from Houston to Moab, UT. On the way back was caught with a few thousand "truck drivers" (steering wheel holders, as the insult goes) barely ahead of "Winter Storm Boreas" who tied up traffic west of El Paso with a number of wrecks of their own making. Spent the night at Van Horn and crept across 100-miles of ice to Ft Stockton for an 0700 arrival. Whereupon IH-10 was shut down from that point all the way back to Las Cruces, NM.

FWIW I'd not ever travel without full propane & full fresh water in the TT. Make adjustments to local conditions for the night. Top off fuel and water next day (come up with a way to have a substantial amount of water).

Power was out for several hundred miles in the above . . don't assume that help is just down the road. Have everything you need to keep your options open.

By the way, for those who disdain CB's: This is one of those times they pay for themselves. GPS with NAV-TEQ is handy, but nothing trumps what the man who just drove past your problem in the opposite lane has to report.

A basic CB would be:

1] Uniden 880 radio (or COBRA 29, but UNIDEN has slightly better receive; most of this is to antenna type and tuning. A 29 vcan be made to "talk loud". Either can have power bumped up)
2] Roadking RK-56 microphone (or ASTATIC 636 and maybe RANGER SRA-198; I use all three depending on radio)
3] Cobra S300 speaker (or S500)
4] Wilson 1000 or 5000 mag mount antenna (permanent mount antennas are MORE than worthwhile)
5] Power to/from battery with 20A fuse protection for vehicle at battery and fused HOT at radio. (Any other way tends to pick up vehicle electrical noise).

-- less than this is hardly worth it, IMO (or, why most folks tend to dismiss CB as being no good: Never used a decent one). You only need do it once, remember. It is cell service that is wallet-busting.

Peak & tune + pro installation should be around $200 past cost of components, parts & supplies. There are maybe 3-4 CB shops in U.S. I'd trust to do it.

GIJOES and WALCOTT 80 are said to be good online retailers. Peak & tune is worthwhile. I use CLAYS CB SHOP in San Antonio across from the Petro Truck Stop (and have used them for eighteen years; IH-10 X582 Ackermann Rd). There is no installation they haven't seen. A permanent CB set-up is gold. And the antenna can be stored when not in use. Antenna tuning isn't difficult but makes a huge difference. A shop such as the above uses the old-fashioned BIRD meter to really nail it down.

Anyone is welcome to PM me on this.

As with all days of "weather" program your GPS to show mile marker number. (Or, why a separate GPS unit can be a better buy than relying on phone map). You need to know where you are to determine where the reported problems are. An earphone is also nice with passengers.

Weather radio is also good for obvious reasons.

.

troutjock · 11-10-2014, 12:10 PM

Gonna keep an eye on that arctic front that is moving in. I'm not planning on leaving until November 19, and it will take a few days to move west from NC to the mountain west, but I've still got adequate time to modify my plans or even bail altogether if worse comes to worse.

As to Sante Fe and Albuquerque, my plans now are to park the AS in and around Tucson and just drive the tow vehicle from Tucson to Colorado Springs. Again, depending on weather.

crisen · 11-10-2014, 12:13 PM

We leave Fairbanks in late Feb to head south for a couple months. When we leave here it is usually around -20 F. This is how we do it. This assumes you have forced air heated tanks.

1- We leave town with the AS winterized and the furnace running since we carry supplies we don't want to freeze and find it is easier to get the trailer warm at the end of the day when the furnace has been on. Yes we burn a fair amount of propane but if it is cold that what it takes.
2-We carry water for drinking and dishes in containers in the trailer.
3-The black tank and gray tanks each have a couple gallons of RV antifreeze in them when we leave. We use the sinks and toilet on the road and flush with RV antifreeze. We add a little antifreeze to the sink traps before heading out in the morning in case the heat goes off.
4-The fresh water tank doesn't get filled until we get far enough south that daytime temperatures are above freezing. We have camped with overnight lows down to -5F after we have added fresh water and not had any problems.
5-We don't use the city water connection when there is any chance of freezing temps as the hose and connection will freeze up. You are much better off using the fresh water tank on board.

J. Morgan · 11-10-2014, 03:15 PM

I will have both of my Airstreams in Las Cruces for this period of time, I wont be winterizing either one. We will set the thermostat at 50 and that is all.

1/2 Ton 4WD Truck, 72 Sovereign Hensley Arrow

dbj216 · 11-10-2014, 03:51 PM

Thanks crisen for your experience from Fairbanks. That adds a lot of credibility to towing and camping in darn cold temps. Way colder than Minnesota. I wasn't sure we could run the furnace while towing. I know many folks turn them off at gas stations, but I guess I have never turned off my fridge while fueling. Lucky so far I guess.

Now troutjock has the real skinny from an Airstreamer in Alaska.

David

m.hony · 11-10-2014, 05:36 PM

I just winterized the trailer for the first time this year. I might go camping 1or2more times and do it again. I just got a gallon and a half of peace of mind.
I drained and bypassed the water heater.
I used compressed air first.
Kitchen sink hot
Kitchen sink cold
Shower hot
Shower cold
Toilet
Bathroom sink hot
Bathroom sink cold
Low point drain hot
Low point drain cold
Black tank flush
Then I used pink antifreeze in the same order.
I feel protected.

m.hony · 11-10-2014, 05:38 PM

Oh yeah-
And I drained (it's still draining) the fresh water tanks.
I drained the black and gray tanks.
Woohoo!

troutjock · 11-10-2014, 05:40 PM

M.hony, you sure know how to party

.

Great checklist, though, gonna print it out and tape it somewhere in the AS.

Patricia720 · 11-13-2014, 11:04 AM

Here's a toilet solution. After I winterize, I put a thick throw rug in the shower and put a portable chemical toilet there. I purchased one that, considering the height of the shower, allows me to use the chemical toilet without needing a derrick to get up. Of course you have to empty the chemical toilet regularly but it's great to have a close option in the middle of a winter's night. I dump my toilet at the regular campground dump or, if none is available, straight into a campground toilet. I use Clorox wipes to clean the toilet after I dump.