Airstream vs SOB quality?

[Ray Eklund]

Originally Posted by journeydog

This is my bombastic opinion. If you don't want to read it...don't.

Bottom lines -

* Thor probably destroyed Wally's vision with their race to the top of profitability.
* Nothing is perfect when it comes off the production line.
* Buy used from someone who fixed most of the problems.
* Be prepared to buy high - sell low.
* Be satisfied before the purchase. Do your homework so that you'll get straight A's
* Smile...

** IMHO - Airstream is right up there in the pre-sale quality department - like the rest, they are all at fault.


Sometimes, I wish the Japanese, Germans, or S. Koreans would get in the RV biz.

*****
Read it all and thank you for putting together your experiences.

My first NEW Airstream spent a week at Jackson Center for warranty work. I drove from Denver, Colorado and back. The dealer's eyes were glazed... over in Denver, swamped with service and repair work packed on the lot. Airstreams were only a small piece of their inventory.

My second NEW Airstream spent ZERO time for warranty work. Not because it did not need warranty work related problems... but I did it myself out of pocket.

I know more about working on an Airstream than I want, although it gave me plenty of opportunity to help others solve their possible issues. There are many others on this Forum who did exactly what I have done... do it yourself right people.

Three years, for example, for an expensive trailer that sits 11 months a year is not a good warranty for most owners. Some owners full time, but even being retired we may have used the trailer for three months a year. Time is a terrible way to judge warranty issues.

The factory may say Warranty Claims are down... Probably not, owners are doing their own work as the Dealer is backed up like a toilet with the Buses, Fifth Wheels and ATV haulers...

I like the warranty programs with automobiles and trucks... mileage. My vehicles have not needed warranty work... yet.

I have household appliances that never had any down time. Although my ignitors in both my Airstreams did not work.

[Bobfrapples]

Our Rigs: 2006 Airstream Safari 25 SE Pulled by 2018 Ford F250 D with a Extended Leer Cap Topper: ( Allowed me to buy and Airstream and not a crappy Toy Hauler).

Oliver is first and foremost a Bathroom Supply Company.They slow production down when there is a recession and fire things back up when the market heats up for Quality Trailers. Nimble is good. Airstream is expanding and expanding which will eventually if not now make them cut corners when hard times hit and they will hit. Thor stock is in the crapper and if Camping World goes Bankrupt.. uh oh oh no.
https://oliverfiberglassproducts.com
Fibreglass V Aluminum.
Airstream's elephant in the room. Hail. We all fear it. I have been hit by it and now have 7 Moving Blankets and 2 Step Ladders to give me some form of protection. Hail Damage is outrageously expensive and almost impossible to find someone Locally to fix it. A Must trip to Ohio.
Fiberglass can be damaged but offers much less chance of Damage and Leaking than the Airstream.
I'd love to see Airstream and the Incredible Zip-Dee Awning Company come up with some sort of Awning like material you could roll out when a Hail Storm is in the Forecast. Some kind of Hooks or Suction Cups to roll material and extend from Front to Back.
Oliver: They need a 25-27 Model. Too small. No Counter-space. Tiny Fridge. Nope for now.
Airstream is killing it with the Globetrotter. Euro Styling . Typical out of the factory issues. We looked at everything from 2015-2019. Grand Design. Nice Features, cheap quality wood. (If you could call it that). Luxe Fifth Wheel.. Yeah baby.. (Who wants to pull this New York Loft around the Country? Nope. Living Vehicle $150,000 Yah.. uh no. Beautiful Rig built by Aluminum Trailer Company but still.. the Hail Problem. I've seen the ATC's with Hail damage.. Just as expensive as the Airstream. Nucamp Avia...Love'm and will check them out for our next Trailer. NuCamp is the one to watch. Lovin my Safari for at least the next 5-10 years! Looking forward to seeing what Airstream comes up with and how their Fiberglass "Nest" takes to the market. Onward..

[Countryboy59]

Airstream hands down for quality and durability. Yes they need a little maintaining but I don’t think much of folks who can’t fix their own stuff.

[RosenBob]

I had an Oliver on order and canceled it just after we bought the AS. The only reason we decided on AS over the Olie is the size. My wife and I are currently living in our AS for months at a time and the Olie was just too small. Btw, they gave us a complete refund of the $10K deposit we placed with the order to get us in the production schedule.

My wife and I toured the factor in Hohenwald TN and were greatly impressed with the quality of their work. After owning the AS now for several months and working on a DIY solar upgrade I can say the guts of the Olie are far better organized and more neatly arranged than the AS. If I wanted to do more boon docking I would probably have an Olie as well. There has been a lot of discussion about AS not being a 4-season trailer. Oliver claims their's is, and I talked with one of the sales engineers who has spent time in an Olie during the winter who claimed there was no issue. I can't speak highly enough about Oliver trailers and other than a few minor issues I feel the same way about Airstream.

[MikeandCarol]

Originally Posted by MAJORJDB

Imho, while I have never heard of the Oliver brand and am sure it is a quality unit, will the company still be in business 10 years from now. Airstream has stood the test of time, even with some models/eras being "better" than others. Good luck and safe travels... Jim

Yes, Oliver will be in business in ten years. They are a fiberglass company that makes trailers as one of their business lines. Family owned and managed, great customer support.

[rsementi]

I totally disagree. The auto industry is light years ahead of the RV industry in every category and especially quality. You don’t need to buy an exotic hand made car to get quality. In fact, the hand made cars are known for quality issues. You can buy a Toyota and it’ll last forever with minor maintenance costs. I wish the auto makers would make RV’s. They’d put AS and the rest to shame. Ok wait, they do! VW California and the Mercedes Benz Marco Polo jay to get started.

[rsementi]

They do make RV’s. The VW California and the Mercedes Benz Marco Polo. And check out this company and see what they fit in a Metris: http://www.harbourcreek.co.uk/listin...lue-motorhome/

[MikeandCarol]

Originally Posted by RosenBob

I had an Oliver on order and canceled it just after we bought the AS. The only reason we decided on AS over the Olie is the size. My wife and I are currently living in our AS for months at a time and the Olie was just too small. Btw, they gave us a complete refund of the $10K deposit we placed with the order to get us in the production schedule.

My wife and I toured the factor in Hohenwald TN and were greatly impressed with the quality of their work. After owning the AS now for several months and working on a DIY solar upgrade I can say the guts of the Olie are far better organized and more neatly arranged than the AS. If I wanted to do more boon docking I would probably have an Olie as well. There has been a lot of discussion about AS not being a 4-season trailer. Oliver claims their's is, and I talked with one of the sales engineers who has spent time in an Olie during the winter who claimed there was no issue. I can't speak highly enough about Oliver trailers and other than a few minor issues I feel the same way about Airstream.

Airstream wins the size contest without doubt. It’s the reason we almost went with Airstream. We’ve found that after a few rainy days we start getting a case of cabin fever. Normally, most of our time is spent outside. But, after almost 4 years we’re happy with our Ollie decision.

Comparing Airstream to Oliver is difficult because they are so different. The Oliver trailer business is small, just over 500 trailers so far. Each is hand made to order. Owners get to know the Oliver family, management and employees. We’ve camped with the owner at Quartzsite and know his sons who run the business. The annual Oliver Rally is sponsored by the company and they come prepared to do warranty work and spend time with owners.

We like Airstreams and still drool a little when one rolls in and parks next to us.

[mkcurtiss]

There are lots of people getting into the whole camping scene....so the demand is high....but spending the big money on an Airstream is a tough pill to swallow for most folks.....

The average lifespan for an SOB is 15 years......which is all that could be expected given the construction methods used....
The average lifespan for an airstream is 40 years, and as we all know, with proper maintenance, the lifespan is indefinite.
Factored out over time, the airstream is a much better value, but any rolling apartment is going to have issues. There is just no way to avoid it....stuff is moving all the time, getting shaken around, misused, abused, neglected, etc.....there are going to be failures and issues with all of them. The fancy auto dealerships are full of cars being serviced, because things broke, failed, screws fell out, etc.....

At the end of the day, the Airstream is just as good as it gets.....maybe for some that is not good enough....to each his own.

[GMFL]

Originally Posted by mkcurtiss

There are lots of people getting into the whole camping scene....so the demand is high....but spending the big money on an Airstream is a tough pill to swallow for most folks.....

The average lifespan for an SOB is 15 years......which is all that could be expected given the construction methods used....
The average lifespan for an airstream is 40 years, and as we all know, with proper maintenance, the lifespan is indefinite.
Factored out over time, the airstream is a much better value, but any rolling apartment is going to have issues. There is just no way to avoid it....stuff is moving all the time, getting shaken around, misused, abused, neglected, etc.....there are going to be failures and issues with all of them. The fancy auto dealerships are full of cars being serviced, because things broke, failed, screws fell out, etc.....

At the end of the day, the Airstream is just as good as it gets.....maybe for some that is not good enough....to each his own.

Very well said

[Mike G]

Originally Posted by Zybane

Having had tons of quality problems with my AS; I've been tinkering around with the idea of moving on so I did some searching. Spent an afternoon at "Lazy-Days RV" in Tampa.

I looked at three DRV supposedly "higher end" 5th wheels, some top of the line Class B's and some half million dollar diesel pusher Class A's. What a sorry state the American RV industry is in. I found tons of quality issues across everything I looked at.

Just some random items:
$150K 5th wheels:
1. Slide bumper/insulators simply stuck on with double stick tape and already peeling off the unit.
2. Front door doesn't even close properly.
3. Interior walls that flex an entire inch when you touch them.
4. Trim pieces/kick plate items laying on the floor from the factory.

$450K "Entegra" Class A:
1. Steps already struggling to come out when the door is opened like the steps weren't lubricated.
2. Misaligned catch on ceiling vent cover, meaning a unit left the factory with a vent cover hanging down inside the coach.
3. Overhead trim piece had fallen off the area above the couch, waiting to be fixed.
4. Sawdust/dirt/debris/fuses laying on the counters.
5. Bathroom vanity doors/mirrors not even installed/missing I assume for repairs?

The America RV industry is a total joke when it comes to quality. I feel a little bit better about the issues with my Airstream but overall it seems like a race to the bottom for everyone. Total shame.

Anyone else have any thoughts about the US RV industry and if anyone truly produces a "quality unit"?

I couldn't agree more. RV's are slapped together with staples, glue, spit & polish. Inferior materials, and inferior workmanship. I've always thought that higher quality would sell. AS is meant to fill that void, but the AS quality is hardly commensurate with the price. A well built traditional RV would be cheaper than AS, and would build a following pretty quickly . . .

[Roadtech]

We are considering downsizing from a 27' to a 23' trailer. We looked at the Oliver II and there were 3 issues with it we couldn't get past. In order of importance:
1. Having to repack the wheel bearings every year and having to continually
crawl underneath it to grease the bearings.
2. Wet bath.
3. Non-ducted air conditioning.

We could live with the smaller space and do like the layout and construction. But the AS wins out due to those three things.

[rsementi]

AS is as good as it gets? That’s what GM used to say when they were on top, until VW and the Japanese Cars almost put them out of business..

[MikeandCarol]

Originally Posted by Roadtech

We are considering downsizing from a 27' to a 23' trailer. We looked at the Oliver II and there were 3 issues with it we couldn't get past. In order of importance:
1. Having to repack the wheel bearings every year and having to continually
crawl underneath it to grease the bearings.
2. Wet bath.
3. Non-ducted air conditioning.

We could live with the smaller space and do like the layout and construction. But the AS wins out due to those three things.

1. The Dexter can be lubed without crawling underneath if you know where the fittings are. I don’t do mine own anymore, once a year I take it in for brake check, bearing repack and Dexter lube.

2. Wet bath was an issue for us too. We found it’s not really a big deal. The bathroom is the cleanest part of the trailer!

3. The Dometic AC cools well but is loud. We prefer camping in cooler weather and locations. But, it takes so long to get to those locations from south Texas that we end up having to use it.

[featherbedder]

Originally Posted by Ray Eklund

Post #4... my Opus on Airstream and the Oliver comparisons. Possibly some confusion. Not myself, but those who see only rivets in their sleep.

The comparison is like horses. I collected fossils on a Ranch in western Nebraska. They ran cattle and bred Arabian horses. I ran into the Badlands to hunt Oligocene Mesohippus horse fossils, but that is for a Fossil Forum, which few here are fossils but getting close to it from what I read.

Arabian horses are large and beautiful horses. That is about all I can say about them. They also eat a better diet.

Quarter Horses are what make a Ranch Work. They are work horses. They eat hay and about anything else growing on a northwestern Nebraska ranch. They are much smaller than an Arabian. But each have a purpose. I cannot say much about the Arabian as I saw none working.

Arabian Horse and a Quarter Horse comparison. They touch when it comes down to riding and strutting around. Riders on the Arabian dress nicer with tighter fitting clothes from what I have noticed. Quarter horse riders are more like myself. Opinionated. Obnoxious at times. ...and to my disadvantage, think out loud when the moment arrives.

OK. Oliver is the quarter horse. Airstream is the Arabian.

Like my mom use to say. "Don't get your panties in a knot."

I hope she was not talking about me, but my sister... but that would be another story.

This is a little off subject but Arab horse and Q. horses are not as described, Arabs are smaller not larger than Quarter average Arab. stands at 14.2 hands is slimmer more defined features not big & bulky. My wife bred & raised arabs for 40 yrs w/one of hers state & natl. champions & 1/2 ownership in mature stud natl. champion, also ARABS much more durable than Quarter just like AIRSTEAM is. Getting back to AS & box. We have had 2 box, 5 AS 1 Argosy. AS just like Arabs well built & dependable. The 2 box I had were many yrs. ago & no faults but no value as AS after yrs. I do agree AIRSTREAM is the ARABIAN sleek & trim. Oliver I have never seen so no comment.

[Countryboy59]

Originally Posted by rsementi

AS is as good as it gets? That’s what GM used to say when they were on top, until VW and the Japanese Cars almost put them out of business..

I guess you’d need to go to a car show and see what brands are highly prized as they age...and which ones are not, to understand why Airstream is a better value in the long run.

[Mollysdad]

There's a lot to like about Oliver, but room is not one of them.
It's like living on a 25' sailboat. Okay for one, crowded for two.
No floor space, no flexibility, since the interior is molded in.
Too high for a 7' wide trailer, IMO.
Living vehicle? Really, really nice if they survive.

As long a Thor execs read posts saying, "I'd never buy anything but an Airstream", they know they got you.
But think about it, Thor makes the SOB's too, so if your bail out, you just arrive at their other door.

[skyguyscott]

Airstream trailers may be the best value in the RV world, but they are not particularly well-constructed, as anyone who has taken a really close look at what is coming off the line can attest. Their value lies in the aluminum shell, overall design and brand reputation.

Much of the love shown Airstream is in fact the reflected love the owners invest in the trailers to fix the numerous, various flaws coming out of JC.

The price paid for a new Airstream is equal to or higher than that for a luxury vehicle, but the fit & finish, the technical sophistication, and the warranty are far, far less than what one would see or expect in the automobile.

Now there are numerous threads on this forum discussing this very issue. The bottom line is that while Thor could invest in lean manufacturing, Six Sigma, TPS, automation, CNC, and various other proven processes to improve the quality of the manufacturing, they are not, presumably because it is hard and expensive and, to the point, unnecessary as long as they continue to sell every flawed trailer that comes off the line as fast as they can push them out.

[Roadtech]

Airstream should offer a "high tech" version in their trailers, which would include a lithium energy system providing enough watt-hours to power air conditioning through the night (so generators would not be required during quiet hours), much more solar and inverter capacity, super quiet air conditioners (maybe DC, low amp draw units with soft start), multiplex wiring, etc. If Winnebago and Coachmen can offer these things on their Class B's you would think there would be a big market for this in AS's in their smaller sizes.

[featherbedder]

A litle more correction of post 35 ARAB riders in show riding do not wear tight fitting clothes but males wear robes, females flowing gowns. Dressage riders, hunter jumpers all wear tight fitting gear they are very few ARABS these events except there is a junior hunter jumper class in ARABS that has age limit of max. 12 yrs and size of ARABS 14 hands tall. This the class that Pennys ARAB won state & national champion. She is quite proud of as was foaled out of one of her mares.