Adios Airstream

[danlehosky]

Jim, we clearly need more information on this specific issue involving Mohave. I was trying to make the broader point that the service model needs to be changed. There is to much opportunity for dealer (AS and non AS) to be involved in the repair process. Lots of people are experiencing poor treatment at the hands of the dealers.

While AS is not directly responsible for this treatment, in lots of ways they should be. The dealer network is the vehicle that we as customers are forced to deal with and AS seems to have little control over outcomes.

Policy changes need to made or changed to make the dealers more accountable and AS needs to hold their feet to the fire. If they cannot support a professional dealer network then they need to change their delivery system.

I could write a service plan that would require regular maintenance or inspection at specific intervals for all new trailers. A proactive model is always better than just being reactive. People shouldn't have to discover leaks by finding soft spots on their floors. AS could develop a checklist that dealer service departments could peform that would professionally find and solve these problems. Just thinking out loud here.

The reality is as long as people continue to purchase these trailers the company has little incentive to change.

I love my trailer, have had very few problems and would like to think that this is the rule rather than the exception. It's hard to do statistical research based on this forum as I've said before because people will complain quicker than they will praise.

Dan

[Gene]

Bruce,

I prefer to act fairly quickly on a problem after the problem causer (dealer, repair shop, etc.) has failed a few times. Give them enough rope to make it easy to go to the top. But people leave trailers for repair over the winter because rates may be cheaper or time is less important during non-camping season. I'm not saying this was the issue here, but it is just another possibility.

It is hard to figure out who was responsible for what in Mojave's case. Triangle had a duty of care—bailment law, negligence law, maybe contract law, and they failed. Airstream may be liable for negligent selection and/or approval of a repair shop. The warranty claim is separate. I still don't see how Mojave is responsible; being slow is not illegal, even in Canada. Sounds like they kept calling everyone and kept getting the runaround. The does not require a consumer to be perfect, just reasonable. But we should ask Henderson Q. Fuddyduddy IV, Q.C., to provide us with a brief on BC and national law on this. Where are you HQ?

Jim, we'll never get the communications between all these parties, so we have to guess based on what we have and make reasonable posts based on possibilities, qualifying them as such.

Gene
Gene

[tpi]

Airstream:
1.Improve warranty service.
2.Better quality plastics on roof, skylight, vent covers, etc. (my biggest gripe to date)
3. Up front disclosure the trailers are subject to filiform corrosion, and while there is no cure, some benefit can come from treatment.

4 Better flooring not subject to rot. Leaks happen with all the holes, but at least limit the damage.

I'm fully aware with more modern construction methods the trailer could be made less service intensive. I'm willing to sacrifice some of that for a distinctive icon. But jeez the above improvements sound like a no brainer, and not at a huge cost.

[Travel Bird]

I have read each comment on this post and have to admit, it is making me a bit nervous! We are still in the "searching" stage and had no idea there are so many service issues. I am going to forge forward with my dream but, this to me is a scary thread!!!

[tpi]

Travel Bird, whats the alternative? White box trailers with eighth inch walls, wood roofs and the same rotting wood floors? Laminated fiberglass sides which may remain laminated? To me the only better quality alternative is in the smaller trailers, the fiberglass trailers such as Casita and Escape.

[Travel Bird]

Originally Posted by tpi

Travel Bird, whats the alternative? White box trailers with eighth inch walls, wood roofs and the same rotting wood floors? Laminated fiberglass sides which may remain laminated? To me the only better quality alternative is in the smaller trailers, the fiberglass trailers such as Casita and Escape.

Only Airstream for me. I would never consider any other brand. I guess I just didn't realize that when I fork out that big cash for a new AS, I need to keep open about how many problems we will have. Just an eye opening thread but, very informative.

[tpi]

My advice is really nail down the service, even before you need it. Seek out the best in your area, do it yourself, travel for it. Whatever it takes. I'm fortunate here in so. CA. there are some good places for service, plus I tend to do a lot of it myself.. Good luck.. It shouldn't be this hard but it is what it is..

[Bruce B]

Anna,
Remember this is the internet.....
Lots of attention to negatives. Keep your eyes open, choose your dealer wisely, maintain the trailer and you will be fine. If you have problems your good dealer will help you through the issues.
Bruce

[Gene]

Anna, are you looking for new or somewhat new or vintage?

For new, check out the trailers in Denver and Colorado Springs dealers, then consider buying elsewhere. Warranty work can be done in JC and when we took the trailer there, we incorporated that trip into a trip to the east coast or another north.

For not so new, you can check out new ones as above, and have a better idea of what you'll want. You'll save a lot on depreciation for trailers more than 3 or 4 years old, and if you look hard and pounce quick, you may get a very good deal.

Vintage means going to rallies (check them out on the Forum) and look over all the variety of trailers and people will tell you what they had to go through to fix them up. then you will have a better idea what to look for, what to expect, and what you want.

If you want new and want to buy in Colorado, the Colo. Springs dealer (if they are still open) does not have much of any reputation either way, although when we looked there the salesman told us lies and then disappeared. So did we, maybe, in retrospect, a bad decision.

If you keep reading here you will find things to scare you. You will also find that many of us are frustrated with QC and bad dealers, but wouldn't get rid our trailers despite all the problems we have had. Because of the iconic design and history, we are disappointed that Thor has not taken seriously its stewardship.

Gene

[danlehosky]

The Casitas and Escapes make me a little claustrophobic. Small windows, narrow, low ceilings...... I'm sure they have their problems too with Qc and service. At least AS has been around for a long time. Remember EarthBound.

Dan

[Fly at Night]

"We have owned our trailer since August of 2010. The dealer had to fix 12 things during the first two weeks we owned it. Since then it has had to go back to the factory three times. This latest time they have had it since May 31st and still have not repaired it. We've had over 50 problems with it to include replacing the AC unit, both axles, the floor and now both walls. We would not recommend this trailer manufacturer to anyone."

Airstream?
>
>
>

Nope.
Earthbound.

BTW, love the idea of a live-action meet at JC between Bob Wheeler, Crawford Gene, danlehosky, and Bruce B. I'd clear my calendar for that one!

But I get first dibs on the beer and popcorn stand. I'll make enough for my post-warranty repair bills, apparently.

"The Clash of the Titans" Trailer - YouTube

[Travel Bird]

Originally Posted by CrawfordGene

Anna, are you looking for new or somewhat new or vintage?

For new, check out the trailers in Denver and Colorado Springs dealers, then consider buying elsewhere. Warranty work can be done in JC and when we took the trailer there, we incorporated that trip into a trip to the east coast or another north.

For not so new, you can check out new ones as above, and have a better idea of what you'll want. You'll save a lot on depreciation for trailers more than 3 or 4 years old, and if you look hard and pounce quick, you may get a very good deal.

Vintage means going to rallies (check them out on the Forum) and look over all the variety of trailers and people will tell you what they had to go through to fix them up. then you will have a better idea what to look for, what to expect, and what you want.

If you want new and want to buy in Colorado, the Colo. Springs dealer (if they are still open) does not have much of any reputation either way, although when we looked there the salesman told us lies and then disappeared. So did we, maybe, in retrospect, a bad decision.

If you keep reading here you will find things to scare you. You will also find that many of us are frustrated with QC and bad dealers, but wouldn't get rid our trailers despite all the problems we have had. Because of the iconic design and history, we are disappointed that Thor has not taken seriously its stewardship.

Gene

Gene, not planning on purchasing in CO at this point but, do want to know that we don't have to drive thousands of mile for service. We are hoping to buy new. No time for headaches for an older unit. I have heard that Nolan RV is good for repair??? Any suggestions are welcome! Thanks all!

[xrvr]

1,, do not believe all you read on the forums,,2',,many who post negative do it repetitively,3'm still remember AS has some problems but most owners do not even know the forums exist.4',,almost all the AS owners I have met are happy and satisfied and I have owned 4 of them. Jim

[danlehosky]

Fly, I want 10%.
When I talk about the relationship between AS and authorized dealers the one thing that comes to mind is the PDI. Some dealers charge for this service, some don't. This, is an example of where AS drops the ball. Why is a procedure as important as this not policy driven from the manufacturer. This is an example of where the factory could control an outcome and an opportunity to educate a new customer in maintenance and other care. Are there any policies from AS regarding this? Is there a consistent checklist. Are the people who perform the PDI properly trained? Are Lot Jockeys assigned this task if the dealership is busy? Who knows?

These and other issues are what AS needs to control. When we turned over a new building to the owners we did a commissioning This insures the staff will understand how the building functions, how to maintain the systems and who to call for service. We took this very seriously and only senior staff could perform this function. Does AS control the procedure of the PDI? If some dealers charge and some don't, I think not. This should be a clearly defined part of the buying and service iniatiation process.

Dan

[Zia]

I baught my second Airstream last December and beside a few hick-ups which were gladly fixed by the dealer, my experience has been extremely good used them in snow, rain never any leak or any problem with either of the unit. There are always exceptions one should contact the right folks at Airstream.
Good luck in your next purchase

[JimGolden]

I like the idea of buying one used, way out of warranty, but in good condition, for 10% the price of new. Read these boards and know what you're looking at.

It is truly tragic the messes that some of these people are in.

If you are not capable of doing heavy maintenance on an RV, then you are going to pay (often through the nose) to have it done. That difference alone (if you can wrench on your own vs. if you can not) may make buying an RV a bad choice. Perhaps this sounds a bit harsh, but it is pretty much a self evident truth.

Roof leaks due to seams is nothing more than using some Kool Seal to fix. A $20 gallon jug and a $4 paint brush and you're good to go. But if you don't know to do this, then it can leak and leak and leak and rot out the floor structure. Not cool!

I view RV's much like I view boats; that is, unless you've got a bag of cash that you're itching to get rid of, it's almost never a good idea to buy a new one. Most RV's get used once or twice a year. You can buy one a couple years old for half what it cost new, and let the other person take the depreciation. Just know what you're looking at when you go to buy it.

There are so many excellent posts on this forum alone that a person who would take a month to just read up would know all they'd need to know to buy a good used unit.

I do feel sorry for those who have bought a new one and gotten yanked around. That is really sad. I wish you all the best in whatever route you go.

If you have decent mechanical abilities, I say get an older one but a solid one and go to town. If you don't, then I'd look for a solid 3-5 year old unit, have somebody who is good mechanically inspect it for you, and make friends with a good RV mechanic.

There's nothing terribly difficult about working on an RV. There are several really good books on the subject. For the most part, the silver trailers are better than the stick frame ones, by a lot. But you still can get taken to the cleaners if you don't know what you're looking at and don't know how to maintain one yourself.

I'm rambling here....but it really is a travesty that brand new mega dollar trailers have this many issues.

I bought my '87 34' Avion for a good price. I have had very few problems with it. I have about $14K total now in it and it's got brand new everything (water heater, a/c, three roof vents, toilet, kitchen faucet, DWV plumbing, six tires). If you want a long Airstream, get an '85 or newer with the thicker frame. If you want a shorter one, get whatever year you like. Look at Avion in the mid 80's. They had large living room windows, a super stout frame that will never fail, real hardwood cabinets, and good furnishings. The older Avions were built wonderfully, but have smaller windows and are darker inside. I really like the mid 60's Airstream 26 footers. My grandpa has had several and never had a major problem with any of them. Bottom line is that you need to know how to work on it yourself. If you do, then they are cheap and easy to maintain. But if you have to pay someone else to work on it, they can be giant holes in the driveway that you throw money into.

I wish you all the best of luck!

[Bruce B]

Originally Posted by Fly at Night

[I].....BTW, love the idea of a live-action meet at JC between Bob Wheeler, Crawford Gene, danlehosky, and Bruce B. I'd clear my calendar for that one!

But I get first dibs on the beer and popcorn stand. I'll make enough for my post-warranty repair bills, apparently.

First of all I am a very happy drunk! No argument from me after a beer or two!
But seriously, one of the things I like about this forum is the ability to have a discussion like this and not have it deteriorate into a pile of garbage. I understand that mine are not the only ideas. Nor do I know what others have been through unless we express the thoughts and experiences somehow. This is a good example of a forum's potential for expression.

Bruce

[ROBERT CROSS]

Originally Posted by danlehosky

Fly, I want 10%.
When I talk about the relationship between AS and authorized dealers the one thing that comes to mind is the PDI. Some dealers charge for this service, some don't. This, is an example of where AS drops the ball. Why is a procedure as important as this not policy driven from the manufacturer. This is an example of where the factory could control an outcome and an opportunity to educate a new customer in maintenance and other care. Are there any policies from AS regarding this? Is there a consistent checklist. Are the people who perform the PDI properly trained? Are Lot Jockeys assigned this task if the dealership is busy? Who knows?

These and other issues are what AS needs to control. When we turned over a new building to the owners we did a commissioning This insures the staff will understand how the building functions, how to maintain the systems and who to call for service. We took this very seriously and only senior staff could perform this function. Does AS control the procedure of the PDI? If some dealers charge and some don't, I think not. This should be a clearly defined part of the buying and service iniatiation process.

Dan

Dan,

PDI...you have to be joaking,

This is Airstreams version of a Pre-delivery inspection.

If your dealer charged for this your due an apology, and a few $$$$.

Bob

[danlehosky]

Thats what I mean Bob. No I did not pay, but some do. I've heard PDI at some dealers is 300.00

Dan

[Bruce B]

Originally Posted by danlehosky

Thats what I mean Bob. No I did not pay, but some do. I've heard PDI at some dealers is 300.00

Dan

Not all dealers are equal. Not all Airstreams are delivered in the same condition. Ever see an Airstream when it comes to the dealer? They are filthy, they need final adjustments (door latches?) the bedding needs to be removed from the plastic it is packaged in and made, trailer washed, batteries installed and systems checked. I am sure there is more to it than I have just listed.

As a Vespa dealer I do PDI's. You ought to see the scooters I have seen delivered by other dealers! We take about 1 1/2 hours to assemble, check and test drive a Vespa. We are fussy! We adjust, check and inspect everything we can. We charge for a PDI. Not all dealers do but you do not tend to get the best prep from those that do not (there are exceptions to that) but in general I have a saying, You may not always get what you pay for but you seldom get what you do not pay for....

We got a fair deal on our new Airstream. Certainly not the lowest price but not the highest. The dealer had the trailer spotlessly clean and detailed. We had a long careful introduction to the trailer and its systems and an introduction to all of the people we might need in the case of problems. We where handed a suggested maintenance schedule and when I informed them that I planned to do the maintenance myself I had about 10 minutes with the service manager who made sure I knew what he believed was important. He takes all of my calls and answers all of my questions. We have a great dealer!
I'm not sure about forum etiquette here but we purchased from a dealer in NJ !

We have had a few "issues" with the trailer but none have stopped us from using it at any moment. Most have been with "things" not built or assembled by Airstream itself but rather installed by them. We have no leaks, no missing parts and we have had a very good experience so far!

I have cleaned construction debris from areas of the trailer the average owner will never see. I have also corrected a number of nit picking "dumb" mistakes but I am fussy! My tank monitors work perfectly now (after replacing one bad sensor and carefully calibrating the system). The entire trailer is 100% at the moment and my job is to see that it stays that way.

I'd buy one again in a flash!

Bruce