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Old 08-28-2004, 05:18 PM   #1
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Added Features of "Limited" models

What exactly are the added features of the new "limited" package? Yes, the hickory cabinets are obvious, but even the Airstream site just says "and many additional features" or something to that effect. I'm curious as to what they actually add?
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Old 08-29-2004, 08:29 AM   #2
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Some things

Power stabilizer jacks (no, not self levelling, just powered).

Different outside trim with red stripe.

Upholstery materials, pillows, valances, etc.

Hardware such as knobe, hinges, door grab handle, faucets,
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Old 08-29-2004, 09:05 AM   #3
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swoopy colored graphics on the sides, and mudflaps with "airstream" on them.

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Old 08-29-2004, 09:37 AM   #4
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Don't forget the matching Limited Jackets.

We thought the Limited model looked really sharp ... but we couldn't see where we were getting an additional $8,000 in value. So we went with the Classic.
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Old 08-29-2004, 10:39 AM   #5
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'Limited' means that replacement parts will not be available for long, making them vintage classics before their time.
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Old 08-30-2004, 02:59 PM   #6
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Yeah - I don't quite understand how an additional $8,000 in value is achieved either...I thought I must be missing something but based on your responses I'm not sure I am; Iat this point I think it sounds like the Classic is a better value proposition.
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Old 08-30-2004, 03:34 PM   #7
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Higher R value insulation.
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Old 08-30-2004, 05:13 PM   #8
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My wife and I recently got the 30' Classic Limited. Here's what we got for our $8000 that I know of: (Actually, with the dealer discount, it was probably closer to $6000, plus tax.)

1. Burgandy Zip Dee awnings and chairs, instead of blue. The main Zip Dee awning never opened and closed properly so I took it to an Airstream dealer in MT looking for a minor adjustment, and contrary to my instructions the dealer repositioned the "J-hook" that secures the awning to the roof, putting addt'l rivet holes in roof, he smeared silicone (!!) sealant all around and over it, scratched the aluminum surface, and made the awning even more difficult to operate.

$20 Walmart chairs are more comfortable and functional.

2. Clear acrylic outside entrance door handle with the word "LIMITED" inscribed on it. You can see it if you look closely.

3. Hickory wood interior complete with numerous scratches and mis-aligned cabinetry straight from the factory. The Hickory dinette is so cheaply finished that my wife is unable to use normal place mats because they stick to the surface.

4. "Brass fixtures" some of which by all appearances certainly appear to be plastic with a brass-colored finish, some of which the finishes were coming off after first use.

5. His and Hers matching Airstream logo hats and jackets; thankfully, you don't have to get them in burgandy. Haven't seen these yet since they were sent to our home about 3 months after we purchased the "Limited" and 2 months after we left home for the summer. Cute for the geritol generation, but not probably not very useful. Give me a chioce of 2 packable gore tex parkas next time for my money, please.

6. Burgandy pin striping on outside sidewall of trailer, and the word "LIMITED" inscribed on a plastic insignia. The word "AIRSTREAM" is also in gold colored plastic on the front and rear of trailer.

7. A "Flag Holder" as per Airstream's description. This is a metal box placed underneath the trailer just behind the entrance door steps. Since my wife and I do not have a flag to carry in it, we have found it is ideal for storing our entrance door rug (an indoor/outdoor carpet measuring about 4'x8').

8. Moen filtering faucet - not sure if this is the same Moen model that is put in all Classics or not, because it is shown in both Limited and non-limited literature. I LOVE this faucet! It filters on demand, pulls out to spray, or fill big items that won't fit in the sink, and shows the % of the filter life remaining (mine is now at 89% after 2 months of use).

9. 40# propane tanks, instead of the 30# tanks that are standard in the Classics. One of our tanks must have a loose sensor, or something, inside the tank which makes an annoying t-w-a-n-n-n-n-n-ng everytime you take a step inside the trailer. I"ll have this looked at when I'm at the factory for repairs next month.

We used 28# total of propane so far this summer, and had it filled at Montana Propane in Helena,MT last week for a grand total cost of $4.04 during their annual open house. We got free hamburgers, hotdogs, soft drinks, cookies and chips just for stopping by. It didn't matter if we were "Limited" or not, but by all accounts, I think that was the best bargain of the summer!

10. My truck is Burgandy and Silver, so I wouldn't want blue and silver. The Limited comes in burgandy graphics.

One time Henry Ford returned home only to find his wife had painted over his imported walnut wood family room walls with white paint. When she asked him what he thought about it, after some hesitation he said "peace in the family at any price."

I guess I feel like Henry must have felt. After thinking about it, I'll still take the Limited, at (almost) any price. (And, maybe my wife will paint over that damn hickory wood!)

John
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Old 08-31-2004, 08:05 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyfisher
9. 40# propane tanks, instead of the 30# tanks that are standard in the Classics. One of our tanks must have a loose sensor, or something, inside the tank which makes an annoying t-w-a-n-n-n-n-n-ng everytime you take a step inside the trailer. I"ll have this looked at when I'm at the factory for repairs next month.

John
John are you sure that the sound you hear isn't the OPD valves? I know my '01 Safari and my '04 Classic have that clank which I think is the float device inside the tank. Its especially evident when you don't have the stabilizer jacks down.

Your sink faucet is an upgrade over what is supplied in the Classic.

Jack
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Old 08-31-2004, 08:29 AM   #10
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I spoke with Airstream Sales Dept. yesterday about the insulation in the Classics and Limiteds. This is what I was told; There is NO difference in the insulation in ANY of the Airstreams. The exact same insulation is used in all models .ALL models. The ONLY difference is in the slide out section of the coach. Here I was told they use the bubble-foil faced insulation. So I asked. " So this is a myth about upgraded R value insulation used in the Classics and Limiteds?" I was told yes a "big myth". I was told that you could request the bubble-foil insulation to be installed everywhere in the coach at substantial increase in cost but it is not done as amatter of course. Vicki also said something about she didn't know why they were telling people that on the production line. I've heard it so many times on the forum that the Classics and Limiteds have higher R-value insulation that I called to pin down the answer as I am interested in a 34 Classic sometime in my future. So, who has the correct answer? I can only relate what I was told. If the factory is telling new owners the there is an upgrade in insulation, when there isn't, I think they should clear this up.
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Old 08-31-2004, 08:55 AM   #11
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Here' another thing that I don't understand. Hickory is slightly less expensive than Red Oak. So why are Hickory cabinets an upgrade? The same people are making them aren't they. I doubt that they use two different techniques of assembly. The hardware couldn't account for more than a tiny part of the cost of the upgrade. Go figure.............

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Old 08-31-2004, 10:03 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Craftsman
Jack,
" So this is a myth about upgraded R value insulation used in the Classics and Limiteds?" I was told yes a "big myth". So, who has the correct answer? I can only relate what I was told. If the factory is telling new owners the there is an upgrade in insulation, when there isn't, I think they should clear this up.
Jack
Their long time employee and tour guide, Don Ambos, who is on their web site is the one who is giving out this information. We talked about R values when I went on the tour of the factory in 2001 and he made the statement that the Limited's had a higher R value. I may even have his statement on video tape since I taped a lot of the tour and some of his comments.

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Old 08-31-2004, 10:38 AM   #13
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jack,
I believe you are correct as it's something that has stuck in my mind. I would have to go back and review older posts, but I know I've heard it repeated on the forums. BUt..... according to Vickie, although it's being said, it's not true except for the actual slide out portion. So, I guess it's somewhat true. I was looking at what you actually received for an extra $8,000.00 (list). Burgandy material awning material I wouldn't think is more expensive than blue. 4lb.tanks instead of 30, I'd have to look that up. Electric stabilizer jacks, O.K.. Gold tone fixtures. That's a matter of taste.A flag storage box ? A couple of jackets, a matter of style. Different graphics? Hickory instead of Oak. Oak can cost more? I know there is a couple of things that I'm leaving out, But $8,000.00?????? I see maybe $1,500.00. and bragging rights, but $8,000.00. Somebody help me see the light. I'm all for an upgrade, but I just don't see one worth that much. In reading the specs. I kept thinking, there's something that I'm missing here.
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Old 08-31-2004, 10:43 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Craftsman
jack,
I'm all for an upgrade, but I just don't see one worth that much. In reading the specs. I kept thinking, there's something that I'm missing here.
Jack,

I guess its one of those things that you need to get the official specs from Airstream to figure out. This is one of those things where you would love to go to a dealer and do a side by side comparison...but you know I have never seen a Limited sitting at my local dealership for inventory purposes.

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Old 08-31-2004, 10:50 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Craftsman
...In reading the specs. I kept thinking, there's something that I'm missing here.
I think the only thing you are missing is the marketing aspect. The eight grand figure was probably determined over cocktails at some Group Training excersize. In my line of work, it would be called a brown number.

Most people are taking out a loan to purchase their new Airstream. Although I'm too lazy to do the numbers, that $8000 probably only adds $10 to the monthly loan payment. The prospective buyer, overwhelmed at his chance to own an American classic, is thinking for only ten bucks more...

That's just my opinion,
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Old 08-31-2004, 12:27 PM   #16
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insulation myths or fact

I wish there were one definitive answer from THE source. I am somewhat bummed. I have shopped two dealers one for the 2003 and another for the 2005. Both have told me that there are differences in the insulation, that the Safaris have better insulation then the CCDs and that the Classic has upgraded insulation over the Safaris. That held a lot of sway with both our decisions. It just doesn't sit well with me now. It either is or it isn't and it shouldn't be advertised falsely to help clinch the deal.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Craftsman
Jack,
I spoke with Airstream Sales Dept. yesterday about the insulation in the Classics and Limiteds. This is what I was told; There is NO difference in the insulation in ANY of the Airstreams. The exact same insulation is used in all models .ALL models. The ONLY difference is in the slide out section of the coach. Here I was told they use the bubble-foil faced insulation. So I asked. " So this is a myth about upgraded R value insulation used in the Classics and Limiteds?" I was told yes a "big myth". I was told that you could request the bubble-foil insulation to be installed everywhere in the coach at substantial increase in cost but it is not done as amatter of course. Vicki also said something about she didn't know why they were telling people that on the production line. I've heard it so many times on the forum that the Classics and Limiteds have higher R-value insulation that I called to pin down the answer as I am interested in a 34 Classic sometime in my future. So, who has the correct answer? I can only relate what I was told. If the factory is telling new owners the there is an upgrade in insulation, when there isn't, I think they should clear this up.
Jack
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Old 08-31-2004, 12:51 PM   #17
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Quote:
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I wish there were one definitive answer from THE source. I am somewhat bummed. I have shopped two dealers one for the 2003 and another for the 2005. Both have told me that there are differences in the insulation, that the Safaris have better insulation then the CCDs and that the Classic has upgraded insulation over the Safaris. That held a lot of sway with both our decisions. It just doesn't sit well with me now. It either is or it isn't and it shouldn't be advertised falsely to help clinch the deal.
As noted earlier on my plant visit, I was told the insulation used in the Safaris and the Classics are identical. They also talked about the foil back insulation used on the slide outs and the supposed higher R-value insulation on the Limiteds. Note this was summer of 2001 and the 2002 units were in production at the time. Things change over the years and to be honest with you its hard to get the definitive word even when you call direct.

When I called Jackson Center in the spring of 2001 I was told that I could pick up my Safari there and that the prep would be done by the Jackson Center service folks. I told this to my dealer and he said no that wasn't available. I told him that customer service was saying yes. I eventually got a letter from the sales director up at Jackson Center who told me that the direct delivery option had ended and that the customer support person I talked to was misinformed.

So who knows? Maybe the tour guide was speaking from past history (and he has a lot!) and nobody has corrected him regarding current practices at this point? Needless to say we need to get this insulation question up to a higher level of the Airstream food chain to get the definitive answer. If everyone except slide out components gets the same insulation pack today (2005), has this always been the case or has their been a model differentiation, limited, classic, safari, ccd, in the past years?

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Old 08-31-2004, 02:18 PM   #18
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I, too, took a factory tour awhile back (one of several during the past several years) where Don Ambos pointed out the superior R-Value insulation being put into the Limited series. At that time, they may have been putting this insulation in the slide portion only, but that's not what Ambos said.

Airstream really needs to do a better job training their dealers about product specs, and in my opinion they should also require dealers' service people to attend factory service training (if not already required).

Oh, and I forgot to mention that our Limited series has electric leveler/stabilizer jacks that are rather nice. The brochure from the manufacturer says they are for leveling, but they don't say how much weight they can support; I suspect that they are for stabilizing only though.

I would think that the Limited options add no more than $1,000 - $1,500 to the total value. It would be nice if Airstream would let a customer pick and choose among these various items.

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Old 08-31-2004, 02:53 PM   #19
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Limited Package
Burgundy Tape - Exterior
Classic Medallion Burgundy 10" (3)
"ltd" Lettering (3)
Gold Accent Lettering-exterior
Hickory Wood
Electric Stabilizer Jacks
Acrylic Entrance Door Handle "limited"
Flag Storage Box
Brass Lavy/shower Hardware
Burgundy Wide Body Zip Dee Chairs
Hardwood Tops
40 Lb Lp Bottles & Cover
Pure Touch Faucet
Jackets And Caps (2 Ea)
Sofa Pillows (2) Decorative, (1) Accent
Bedroom Pillows (2) Decorative,
Throws (1) Bedroom (1) Sofa

I believe the above to be correct....
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Old 08-31-2004, 03:46 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JPAIRSTREAM
Limited Package
Burgundy Tape - Exterior
Classic Medallion Burgundy 10" (3)
"ltd" Lettering (3)
Gold Accent Lettering-exterior
Hickory Wood
Electric Stabilizer Jacks
Acrylic Entrance Door Handle "limited"
Flag Storage Box
Brass Lavy/shower Hardware
Burgundy Wide Body Zip Dee Chairs
Hardwood Tops
40 Lb Lp Bottles & Cover
Pure Touch Faucet
Jackets And Caps (2 Ea)
Sofa Pillows (2) Decorative, (1) Accent
Bedroom Pillows (2) Decorative,
Throws (1) Bedroom (1) Sofa

I believe the above to correct....
Jim - (It is Jim, isn't it?)

The specs for my 2004 also say "BRASS lavatory/shower hardware".

My shower head is a brass colored plastic, and the (Moen) shower/faucet on/off control and backplate is chrome colored/plated metal of some sort.

The combination of chrome and brass together in the shower looks tacky at best, and if I got the intended hardware, then Airstream is not advertising truthfully.

John
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