WD/Anti Sway hitches: Who needs 'em?

[richard5933]

Actually, even a semis often use a hitch capable of shifting the effective weight of the trailer by using a sliding fifth wheel. The whole idea is to keep the weight balanced on the tow vehicle.

[Wazbro]

Originally Posted by jondrew55

Especially for people who are close to the edge of their payload/tongue weight limits and dump an extra 100 pounds of hitch in the mix trying to fix it.

This is where a WD hitch is actually needed most. If close to weight limit you are more likely to be over rear axle weight limit.

Also many TV manufacturers and receiver manufacturers have a higher tongue weight limit with WD then just on the ball.

[drbrick]

As the saying goes - "Your Choice, Your Life, Your Responsibility" but please, while on the road don't kill me in the process. Here is my Blog Post on the "Roll Over" of Travel Trailers if you have any interest.. https://www.marriedwithairstream.com...idents-part-1/

[jimfa440]

Originally Posted by jondrew55

I did a thread a week or so ago about towing a new trailer home with no WD or Propride hitch. My plan is to install my current ProPride when I get it home. But driving around got me thinking. My truck has a max tongue weight of 2000 pounds. My current GT and even the new 30' GT I have on order should be around half of that. So why use any hitch at all? I just got back from driving on the highway and there are people hauling work trailers left and right with nothing more than a ball. What makes travel trailers so special? Because we get scared by stories of droop and sway? Assuming your trailer is properly weighted in the front, you should really have no issues unless of course you're in high wind situations, correct?

I'd not advocating people getting rid of their hitch set ups. I'm sure I'll keep mine since I already have it. I'm just wondering if we're making more out of this than it needs to be. Especially for people who are close to the edge of their payload/tongue weight limits and dump an extra 100 pounds of hitch in the mix trying to fix it.

I understand how you feel about your fabulous TV. No matter how good your TV, it cannot control heavy cross winds or the pull/push of semi trucks and flying busses. Do yourself a favor and install that ProPride, you will be glad you did.

[jondrew55]

Originally Posted by richard5933

Actually, even a semis often use a hitch capable of shifting the effective weight of the trailer by using a sliding fifth wheel. The whole idea is to keep the weight balanced on the tow vehicle.

I think this is what ProPride/Hensley claims to mimic with their design. I really like the PP and the way my trailer tows on it. I just don't know I'd have ever shelled out the $3.5k it costs. It came with my GT from the previous owner.

[Ken G]

I spent some time in residential construction. F250s are the truck of choice. Most of the bumper pull utility trailers are relatively light, and are being pulled locally @ lower speeds. Everybody pulling heavier loads such as equipment, materials, BIG horse trailers is using 5th wheel or gooseneck and one ton truck or more.

[jondrew55]

Originally Posted by Mollysdad

None that I've seen. Have you?
As far as professional operators, no one cares more for their precious cargo than horse fanciers.
Those trailers are heavy. WD hitch? Nope.

I'm only the messenger. I'm not advocating towing on the ball. But, for some reason, we RV's seem to be caught up in numbers more than others.

This is really my whole point.

[jondrew55]

Originally Posted by jimfa440

I understand how you feel about your fabulous TV. No matter how good your TV, it cannot control heavy cross winds or the pull/push of semi trucks and flying busses. Do yourself a favor and install that ProPride, you will be glad you did.

If you'd read my post completely you'd see I already have the PP. This is more of an academic discussion if we RV'rs are just overthinking things based on how commercial users tow all manner of trailer with no WD or anti sway.

[fossil5775]

I hauled horses around for 40 years. When it was just a 2 horse bumper pull, I figure it was about the equivalent of my fc 19'. Never had wd, hadn't even heard of it. Was around a lot of people with lots of money invested in what they hauled. No one had them. I can say I could tell the difference between a half ton and 3/4 in pull. We don't use wd on our airstream & we have had no issues. But we have a good f150, which is far higher in payload & tow capacity than the 150's of the old days. If I had any bigger airstream, I'd put one on. Another reason we stay small!

[jondrew55]

Originally Posted by drbrick

As the saying goes - "Your Choice, Your Life, Your Responsibility" but please, while on the road don't kill me in the process. Here is my Blog Post on the "Roll Over" of Travel Trailers if you have any interest.. https://www.marriedwithairstream.com...idents-part-1/

Ok. 1 Paragraph on ball towing, the rest about wrong tow vehicle, poor weight distribution, bad tires, speeding etc. A WD hitch alone does not fix any of those.

[gypsydad]

Hey, if you don't want to use a WDH with Sway Control, go for it! My Blue Ox with Anti Sway saved our bacon a couple times in situations where we were forced into an emergency maneuver to avoid collision from another driver...at highway speeds. There are several Youtube videos out there showing what "can" happen towing a trailer when sway starts. You can argue all you want, and many do here. (I'm not arguing, by the way!) But think about your investment behind you and your family; if that WDH with SC could just be the difference in an emergency maneuver; been there, and anti-sway with my WDH is a no brainer for me. Seatbelts are only of value when needed, right?

[jondrew55]

Not trying to be argumentative (well, maybe I am), but how do you know the WD/AS system helped in those situations? I know my truck has automatic Anti Sway trailer breaking. Not exactly sure what the threshold to set that off is and frankly I don't want to find out.

Originally Posted by gypsydad

Hey, if you don't want to use a WDH with Sway Control, go for it! My Blue Ox with Anti Sway saved our bacon a couple times in situations where we were forced into an emergency maneuver to avoid collision from another driver...at highway speeds. There are several Youtube videos out there showing what "can" happen towing a trailer when sway starts. You can argue all you want, and many do here. (I'm not arguing, by the way!) But think about your investment behind you and your family; if that WDH with SC could just be the difference in an emergency maneuver; been there, and anti-sway with my WDH is a no brainer for me. Seatbelts are only of value when needed, right?

[Al and Missy]

I didn't read every post, but the one thing I didn't see talked about is the geometry of the trailers and hitches observed. First, disregard any trailer with a gooseneck hitch, which is many cargo trailers. They act like fifth wheels with the pivot point over the rear axle of the TV. Very little potential for sway. Then disregard any short trailers. The issue with travel trailers, particularly longer ones, is the polar moment about the trailer axles. The longer a trailer is, the more likely it is to cause sway.


Now we are talking about a smaller group of observations. Trailer sway is a real thing. It can happen. As Dirty Harry would say, "Do you feel lucky today?"

[jondrew55]

Originally Posted by Al and Missy

I didn't read every post, but the one thing I didn't see talked about is the geometry of the trailers and hitches observed. First, disregard any trailer with a gooseneck hitch, which is many cargo trailers. They act like fifth wheels with the pivot point over the rear axle of the TV. Very little potential for sway. Then disregard any short trailers. The issue with travel trailers, particularly longer ones, is the polar moment about the trailer axles. The longer a trailer is, the more likely it is to cause sway.


Now we are talking about a smaller group of observations. Trailer sway is a real thing. It can happen. As Dirty Harry would say, "Do you feel lucky today?"

Well since you asked, I just ran a 30 mile errand thru town, up the 417 from Oviedo to Sanford and back. Zero gooseneck trailers at least 20 trailers from little 2 wheelers, to large contracting trailers with bobcats and other heavy cargo, plus varying sized box trailers. All on a ball. I'm not counting semis. Your milage may vary, I know I regularly see gooseneck trailers on the road, but small proportions compared to non gooseneck.

Dirty Harry was never about "feeling lucky" It was risk reduction with that big pistol. It gave him an edge. Like Josey Wales standing with his back to the sun when he picked a gunfight.

[wulfraat]

I have a propride as well. I use very little WD on the spring bars - just not needed with a 3/4 / 1-ton SRW truck with 800lb Diesel engine over the front axle.

Sway control of the propride is excellent - gives you the best of both worlds when towing with a heavy duty truck - easy on the trailer frame and superior sway control.

[richard5933]

I think something missing from the discussion about things like flatbed trailers not have WD is the fact that a travel trailer, by it's design, is more susceptible to the effects of wind and turbulence created by passing trucks. I remember seeing some videos which demonstrated how easy it was for the bow wake of an approaching vehicle to set the trailer sway in motion.

[DonRich7878]

It has been observed that a majority of RV'ers use some form of WD/Sway hitch. Therefore, can we say that a majority of RV sway roll over accidents happened while using this equipment? Dr Brick shared a very scary video of a pickup and trailer being whipped off the road and rolled in a great cloud of dust. I am speculating that this accident occurred while using an anti sway/WD device and in fact may have contributed to the tragedy. The initial cause of the sway can clearly be seen in the video, excess speed and wind pressure from the truck being passed. Was the subsequent tow vehicle rear end skid caused because the WD device pulled too much weight from the rear axles? Just asking?

[richard5933]

Originally Posted by DonRich7878

It has been observed that a majority of RV'ers use some form of WD/Sway hitch. Therefore, can we say that a majority of RV sway roll over accidents happened while using this equipment? Dr Brick shared a very scary video of a pickup and trailer being whipped off the road and rolled in a great cloud of dust. I am speculating that this accident occurred while using an anti sway/WD device and in fact may have contributed to the tragedy. The initial cause of the sway can clearly be seen in the video, excess speed and wind pressure from the truck being passed. Was the subsequent tow vehicle rear end skid caused because the WD device pulled too much weight from the rear axles? Just asking?

Without putting the TV and trailer on the scale your question can likely not be answered.

Just because one is using a WD hitch doesn't at all imply that it is being used correctly. I'd venture a guess that a large number of people do not have a clear understanding of how to properly set up their WD, are not loading the trailer properly, or a combination of both.

For example, there are far too many suggestions still being made on various online forums that to lower tongue weight one should add weight to the rear of the trailer - something sure to aggravate problems and make sway more likely. Even with a WD and sway control, a poorly-loaded trailer is still likely to encounter problems.

So even if your premise is correct and the majority of accidents happen while using WD hitches and sway control is in use, that doesn't mean that there weren't other factors/problems which counteracted any advantage they may have provided.

Possibly one place I think I could agree with your premise though, even without weighing anything, is that a WD hitch and sway control might give people unwarranted confidence and actually hide symptoms which might occur at slower speeds, thus resulting in the driver towing at speeds much higher than they safely should. The faster you travel, the faster things can go wrong.

[jondrew55]

+1 What he said

Originally Posted by richard5933

Without putting the TV and trailer on the scale your question can likely not be answered.

Just because one is using a WD hitch doesn't at all imply that it is being used correctly. I'd venture a guess that a large number of people do not have a clear understanding of how to properly set up their WD, are not loading the trailer properly, or a combination of both.

For example, there are far too many suggestions still being made on various online forums that to lower tongue weight one should add weight to the rear of the trailer - something sure to aggravate problems and make sway more likely. Even with a WD and sway control, a poorly-loaded trailer is still likely to encounter problems.

So even if your premise is correct and the majority of accidents happen while using WD hitches and sway control is in use, that doesn't mean that there weren't other factors/problems which counteracted any advantage they may have provided.

Possibly one place I think I could agree with your premise though, even without weighing anything, is that a WD hitch and sway control might give people unwarranted confidence and actually hide symptoms which might occur at slower speeds, thus resulting in the driver towing at speeds much higher than they safely should. The faster you travel, the faster things can go wrong.

[PB_NB]

If we were in Europe, I would say that most RV accidents would be occurring on combos setup on a ball only.

Here, could it also be assumed that most RV accidents occur when operators are driving well above 60 mph and don’t have any WD or sway prevention?

Proper loading for adequate TW could be a big factor. Avoiding speeding which can be hard to do on the freeways. Running at 80 mph on crappy trailer tires isn’t going to end well.

I would agree that WD may not be as big a concern if proper loading is followed and speed is kept to a max of 60 mph. There are a lot of other factors to consider for safe operation and towing so we have to assume that the mechanical situation has been looked after.

I know that my sway event occurred when I was light on the tongue weight and doing 75 mph when I got hit by a cross wind. Took a minute to get it under control. I was using a ball hitch with my little Camplite trailer and car.

With my AS and Honda Pickup I use WD and passing a semi has no effect on the trailer. I wouldn’t go back to a ball and give up the stability and ride that I get with my WD setup.