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Old 10-06-2009, 01:23 PM   #1
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The unofficial pp users guide...

hello

it's time for a new hitch thread...

and this is it.

cheers
2air'
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Old 10-06-2009, 01:29 PM   #2
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a little background & a few playground rules...

ok, we are started.

in mid 2008 a NEW version Pivot Point Projection hitch apparatus came to the market.

over the last 2 years there has been some discussion of this new gizmo...

these threads are all worthy of reading.

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f464...ach-37994.html

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f464...ket-42311.html

RV.Net Open Roads Forum: Travel Trailers: Hensley Alternative???

recently i purchased one, as many others on this forum have done...

my pp has been installed and now i'm pulling with a pp...

previously i've towed with the haha,

and many users of THAT product have joined me in building an archive of useful information here...

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f464...ide-26279.html

all of the good stuff on THAT hitch is IN that thread...
___________________________

the goal of THIS thread is to build a similar collection of USEFUL posts on the pp.

and to help each other USE this contraption.

IF you have a pp, tow with a pp, WANNA learn more about USING the pp please JOIN me in this effort.

but PLEASE don't use this thread for endless (and un resolvable) debate on NEED, PRICE, WHICH BRAND, or vendor squabbles.

just scan the HITCH section here and pull up a thread for that purpose.

YES, there are other threads and places to put that nonsense.

BUT HERE....

let's try to stick to HELPING each other with our pp-z...

cheers
2air'
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all of the true things that i am about to tell you are shameless lies. l.b.j.

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Old 10-06-2009, 01:33 PM   #3
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Which one 4 me ???

some will be debating the purchase of ONE or THE OTHER...

here are places to do just that...

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f464...ide-45987.html

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f464...-3p-51958.html

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f464...hes-54158.html

and even a place for hybrids, and franknhitches...

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f464...ger-46627.html


cheers
2air'
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Old 10-06-2009, 01:39 PM   #4
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is there a method to THIS madness...?

my basic plan here is to...

-get us rolling (done)
-solicit OWNERS and USERS to JOIN ME here...
-set the tone and chart a basic course (in this post)
-provide a brief background NOW (links) with more LATER...
-show before n after shots of my set up
-provide a QUIK INSTALL GUIDE, very basic with photos.

then...

-go back and cover the install and setup in great DETAIL
-with every nut/bolt, measurement, adjustment and so on...
-discuss the issues of FITTING relative to 'streams and the crap collected on the stream tongue
-do a side by side comparison of EACH basic component of the haha and pp, explore the differences good OR bad
-explore the ADJUSTABLE stinger in greater detail and fine tuning the fit for various rigs...

then...

wander OFF into hookups, leveling, towing issues, pp care, preflight checks, customer service, resources, online stuff and so on...
____________________________

there is no way 2 predict EXACTLY how this thread unfolds and the list of topics and needs may wander, deviate and circle back...

which is the organic nature of threads like this.

no doubt folks will have questions about the haha and this is NOT THE PLACE for those questions...

and it's not the place for a pissnmatch on other hitches.

ok?

cheers
2air'
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Old 10-06-2009, 01:47 PM   #5
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OK

here is the stream's PAST and CURRENT nose...

i like the look of the new nose job.

cheers
2air'

click TWICE on any pix for a LARGER view...
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Old 10-06-2009, 01:51 PM   #6
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boxes, LOTS of boxes....

the pp is delivered...

VERY nicely packed.

and i'll come back to the INSIDES of these boxes, later...
_____________________

looks like ~234 lbs.

subtract 15 lbs for the packaging stuff ...

and it comes in at ~220 lbs or 100 kg.

remember to lift with the legs, not the back!

cheers
2air'
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Old 10-06-2009, 02:06 PM   #7
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quik install step ZERO...

installation begins with prep'ing the trailer tongue...

remove a bunch of stuff...

-the tank cover and tanks,
-flag holders,
-OLD HITCH parts,
-move the safety chains OUT of the way,
-tidy up the break-away brake wiring
-lay the 7 pin connector clear...
-remove (or not) the stainless tongue sleeves (classics), which typically have a LOT of rust underneath
-(the pp CAN be installed with the ss sleeves ON if desired)
-clean the cup of old grease
-clean up the box/lid
-deal with batteries or other gadgets (gensets) mounted on the tongue...
_________________

this is also a good time to repair any ISSUE on the tongue.

for example HOLES drilled for other hitches, rust, flaking paint, wiring, gas fittings, battery boxes and so on...

in my case the HOLES are patched and rust scuffed down, while AWAITING the por 15 and glossy a/s tongue paint...
__________________

so here is my nekked tongue ready for install (but before the fresh paint)

it's really odd to see the tongue so bare given the crap typically mounted...

cheers
2air'

the next few posts are just a BASIC/QUIK visual on install,

the pp comes with an instruction set with the DETAILS...

so this NOT the complete instructions (yet)

and serve only as a quick visual (and to help devoman...)
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Old 10-06-2009, 02:14 PM   #8
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quik install step 1...

install weight distribution jacks...

one on EACH SIDE,

~ 25 inches from the cup, along the A frame.

the U bolts are tightened JUST to firm, NO MORE than 20-30 ft-lbs.

these can be repositioned SLIGHTLY as needed to clear tongue stuff.

cheers
2air

click twice on any pic for a LARGER view...
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all of the true things that i am about to tell you are shameless lies. l.b.j.

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Old 10-06-2009, 02:26 PM   #9
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How does the PP come to the HAHA as far as the weight of the entire unit?

Also what is the weight of the height-adjustable stinger?

Brian
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Old 10-06-2009, 02:29 PM   #10
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quik install step 2...

attach frame bracket...

the frame bracket is used to center the tail of the YOKE...

-the frame bracket and hardware are clearly labeled (see the first pic)

-mark a spot ~20 inches from the cup along the A frame rails...

-attach using the U bolts/plates/washers/nuts...

-CENTER this bracket relative to the A frame width and FIRM up the nuts...

here are some random views...

and a PIC showing the w/d jacks AND frame bracket mounted...

cheers
2air'

click twice on any pic for a LARGER view...
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Old 10-06-2009, 02:34 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moosetags View Post
How does the PP come to the HAHA as far as the weight of the entire unit?

Also what is the weight of the height-adjustable stinger?

Brian
hi brian...

the total weight is ~ the same, maybe a little less DEPENDING on which fixed drop stinger is used with the haha.

i'll post pics comparing EACH element for size/shape later...

the adjustable pp stinger is IN the lower R box in post #6.

that box is ~52 lbs shipping weight, so i'm guessing the stinger is ~48-50 lbs

(there was misc bits of hardware in that box too)

i'll post pix of both brand stingers sidebyside, since the dimensions are different...

cheers
2air'
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all of the true things that i am about to tell you are shameless lies. l.b.j.

we are here on earth to fart around. don't let anybody tell you any different. k.v.
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Old 10-06-2009, 02:49 PM   #12
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quik install step 3...

attach MAIN hitch head...

next comes the PP main hitch/head unit...

yes my pp has a head...
____________________

best way to lift/mount the head is to USE the stinger and tow vehicle RECEIVER BOX...

to LIFT, back up and place the pp main hitch/head OVER the ball...

don't forget to grease the ball.

pics here show...

1-the main pp head...

2-the pp head attached to the stinger attached to the truck...

((in this 2nd pic on the right, the cover plate is removed and the A frame/cup outlined for orientation.))

(many of these pics have RED and SILVER TARGETS drawn on the hitch head. these spots MARK the 4 bearing/pivot points)

(i added these marks to better show the pivots and 4 bar linkage, the RED and SILVER targets aren't part of the factory paint)

but i'll gladly MARK UP your pp, for a price...


3-placement of the head/ball UNDER the cup on the A frame

4-lowering of cup OVER the ball ON the main hitch head...

cheers
2air'

click any pic twice for a LARGER view...
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all of the true things that i am about to tell you are shameless lies. l.b.j.

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Old 10-06-2009, 02:58 PM   #13
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Intermission...

ok early readers,

time 4 a pause.

the laptop battery is running LOW

while the bladder is running HIGH

so we'll get back to the quik install (only 4 more steps) shortly...

i gotta take a break from the unofficial pp users guide...

4 a different kind of pee pee (no user help needed)

back in 30 minutes.

cheers
2air'
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all of the true things that i am about to tell you are shameless lies. l.b.j.

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Old 10-06-2009, 03:17 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2airishuman View Post
hello

it's time for a new hitch thread...

and this is it.

cheers
2air'
I Haven't towed a whole lot yet with the ProPride (maybe 500 miles, however I have hitched and unhitched a lot. Since the trailer and hitch are both new, I don't have much grounds for comparison. The ride however is definitely smoother than my previous trailer and Equal-I-Zer.
I have found it very quick and easy to hitch and unhitch. I learned that it is unnecessary to remember the angle of the tow vehicle when unhitching.
This is my hitching procedure:
I purchased a pair of the magnetic based yellow sticks. I place one on the end of the stinger, and the other on the lip of the box on the trailer.
We position the truck to back toward the trailer. I then position the head of the hitch on the trailer so the box is aimed at the stinger. If the truck is coming in from an angle to the left, the hitch head must off set to the right and visa versa. My wife then backs the trailer using the top of the poles as a guide. When the stinger is an inch or two from the box, the truck is stopped, as I align the box and stinger vertically using the tongue jack. The truck is then backed gently into the box. Both OCLs are fastened and lynch pins inserted. I then raise both WD jacks 35 full turns. Finally I hook up the safety chains and raise the trailer jack.
To unhitch, I first release the safety chains and then crank both WD jacks full down. I then use the trailer jack to raise the tongue slightly. Then I release both OCLs. Next the trailer jack is raised while closely watching the hitch. When the weight is fully off of the truck, the hitch will move noticeably, (this motion is especially noticeable in the Rock Tamers bars). Then simply pull the truck forward.
It is not the order things are in the manual, but it works great for me. I have not tried it, but I am sure I could do it by myself, with a bit of hopping in and out of the truck.
Regards,
Ken
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Old 10-06-2009, 03:48 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by w7ts View Post
I Haven't towed a whole lot yet with the ProPride (maybe 500 miles, however I have hitched and unhitched a lot....

I have found it very quick and easy to hitch and unhitch...
hi ken and thanks for jumping in.

none of us have towed a WHOLE LOT yet with the pp, so we are all learning.

imo an IMPORTANT step in mastering the dock/undock is doing exactly what you have done...

as in hitching and UN hitching a bunch.

doing so provides LOTS of practice with the process, connecting chains/7 pin, brake cable, jack tightening, leveling and so on.

Quote:
Originally Posted by w7ts View Post
...I purchased a pair of the magnetic based yellow sticks. I place one on the end of the stinger, and the other on the lip of the box on the trailer...

I am sure I could do it by myself, with a bit of hopping in and out of the truck...
the hitchnrods are VERY HELPFUL and i've used them for years.

((the rods can be seen in the lower LEFT pic/post #12))

often now the rods aren't needed but they are ALWAYS available as help.

i connect solo EVERY TIME; typically it takes 2-3 minutes...

and longer IF i'm hurried or helped by others...

cheers
2air'

ok the holding tank has been drained, the batteries charged, the running gear exercised...

lets finish the quik install...
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all of the true things that i am about to tell you are shameless lies. l.b.j.

we are here on earth to fart around. don't let anybody tell you any different. k.v.
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Old 10-06-2009, 04:03 PM   #16
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quik install step 4...

attach weight distribution (w/d) (spring) bars...

spring bars are available in varied rating from 700? to 1400 lbs.

they operate INDEPENDENTLY from the sway control,

and can be tensioned from near zero to the max rating.

the spring bars INSERT into the underside of the main hitch head'

and are secured by a NEW patent pending gizmo (not directly part of the grease zerk)

i'll post details about this new feature later.

these pics show the spring bars after INSERTION into the main jack head

and after attachment to the lower end of the w/d jacks USING the spring bar links...

the w/d bars are installed WHILE THE TV IS STILL CONNECTED and supporting the main hitch head...

1 for the street side and one for the curb side.

this step requires GREASE to coat the spring bar end, bushings and squirt in the zerks...

easy peasy...

cheers
2air'

click any pic twice for a LARGE view...
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all of the true things that i am about to tell you are shameless lies. l.b.j.

we are here on earth to fart around. don't let anybody tell you any different. k.v.
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Old 10-06-2009, 04:27 PM   #17
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quik install step 5...

attach the YOKE...

with this design the YOKE replaces the 'strut bars' 'shear bolts' and several sets of pins.

-the YOKE is installed from UNDER the A frame and behind the tongue jack.

-2 big arse bolts connect the yoke to the sides of the main hitch unit via holes and welded nut blocks...

-these nuts/bolts are torqued to 250 ft-lbs and pass though steel n bronze bushings...

-after YOKE attachment the STINGER is disconnected from the HITCH HEAD...

-ONLY THEN is tv pulled forward, to leave the assembly hanging on the A frame...

-at this time the yoke TAIL is attached to the frame bracket (see quik install step 2, post #10) using the remaining frame bracket hardware.

-the the yoke side bolts are loosened and adjusted, so that the YOKE is LEVEL with the A frame ~1-2 inches below it...
________________

pics show the...

-yoke with the A frame/cup graphic superimposed for orientation...

-yoke attached UNDER the A frame with highlights and the critical bolts (250 ft-lbs torque)

-side view showing the LEVELING of the yoke 1-2 inches below the A frame...

-side view showing ALL of these parts relative to the A frame...

cheers
2air'

click any pic twice for a LARGER view...
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all of the true things that i am about to tell you are shameless lies. l.b.j.

we are here on earth to fart around. don't let anybody tell you any different. k.v.
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Old 10-06-2009, 04:49 PM   #18
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quik install step 6...

the ADJUSTABLE stinger...

the pp comes with a DROP adjustable and TILT adjustable stinger...

it's ANOTHER unique component of the pp 3p package...

with this ONE stinger it is possible to match the trailer to a spectrum of receiver box angles and tow vehicle heights.

basically the user measures the cup height (level trailer) and the receiver box height (level tv)...

then selects 3 holes on the 2 stinger parts to match the height of both...

((the WAY to calculate this is in the INSTALLATION instructions shipped with the hitch))

the stinger can also be tilted UP or down a few degrees, again covered in the factory instructions...

we'll cover the details of these manipulations LATER...

THIS ADJUSTMENT (stinger set up) is the VERY FIRST STEP in the official INSTALLATION instructions...

but i've placed it later for easy following of the quik install steps...
______________________

-here is a pic of my pp STINGER adjusted for the lifted 4x4 f-250 (~5.5 inches drop)

-and a 2nd shot with a REMINDER that the stinger nuts/bolts are torqued to AT LEAST 150 ft-lbs...

cheers
2air'

click either twice for a LARGER view...
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all of the true things that i am about to tell you are shameless lies. l.b.j.

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Old 10-06-2009, 04:50 PM   #19
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Hitching Time

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2airishuman View Post
...
i connect solo EVERY TIME; typically it takes 2-3 minutes...

and longer IF i'm hurried or helped by others...

cheers
2air'

...
You're speaking the truth THERE my friend. I particularly DREAD having a guy with a beer in his hand (and God only knows how many in his gut) start waving this way and then that way and then yelling "NO your Other Left".

Children and teenagers are actually more helpful IMHO, and I've used the Hensley Hitch Helper to move the ball an inch or two to the right or left - VERY Easy! But I agree yellow sticks are great too.

Paula
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Old 10-06-2009, 05:14 PM   #20
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I like it. Looks leaner, less bulky.

Curious how the powder coat performs over time.

Is the adjustable stinger compatible with the Hensley?

From numbers published here, it appears 20-30lbs lighter than the Hensley (including stinger)?
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