ProPride bent stinger.

[Ron Gratz]

Originally Posted by ROBERT CROSS

Something bad happened….
---snip---
Whats important is that certain things need to be done to reduce the chances of it happening again.
Educating the user is number one.
---snip---

Bob's statement about educating the user should be the #1 lesson to be gained from this thread.

The manufacturer of the hitch stated back in Post #21:

"After looking more closely at her photos IT DOES appear the her yoke is also misaligned which would indicate that the hitch was up against the stop at some point. ---"

An important part of educating the user should be to provide some warning in the INSTALLATION And OPERATION manual about avoiding a TV/TT angle which would cause the hitch to be "up against the stop".

In an online version of the manual -- https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/9594331/ProPride%203P%20Hitch%20Installation%20and%20Opera tion.pdf,
I found no mention of avoiding too sharp of an angle when backing. If other versions of the manual are lacking the warning, I think it would be good to remedy that omission.

People who never have used a ProPride hitch, no matter how experienced or inexperienced with other hitches, would have no reason to know that backing into too sharp an angle could do major damage to the hitch.
They most likely would assume that as long as the TV and TT did not make contact, there would be no limit to the backing angle.

Since there was evidence to "indicate that the hitch was up against the stop at some point", I think that should be accepted as the most likely cause for the damage to Annie's hitch.

And, I think it also should be accepted that a properly-placed and properly-worded warning in the Owner's Manual might prevent other owners from encountering a similar problem.

As for the chains causing the bending of the stinger --
Annie stated that the installer lengthened the chains and they were very close to dragging.
I would like to see an explanation of how chains with that much excess length, even if they were routed over the WD bars, could cause the damage which occurred.

Ron

[tony6373]

Annie,

I'm about 110 miles away in Hillsboro (about 50 miles south of Dallas) on I-35 south. If you could come here to NTAC (North Texas Airstream Community) I would be happy to inspect your hitch, trailer A frame and the receiver on your trick. We have parking for fellow Airstreamers for $15 / night full hookups.

I have over 100,000 miles on my old Hensley hitch which is very similar to the ProPride. I once bent a strut when I had to panic brake while in a slight turn. Hensley has always been very fair with replacement parts and service and I would expect ProPride to be the same.

If you come here just ask anyone where to find Tony and Kit or call 254-266-0327.

Best wishes and safe travels.
Tony T

[SteveSueMac]

That's a good suggestion, Ron. My copy of the user manual covers installation, hitching and unhitching. A final section on operating instructions while driving forward, backing up and setting up at a campsite would be very helpful.

I also wonder if those of us who have ever read a sentence in the manual that feels potentially confusing or ambiguous have sent suggestions to Sean to improve the guide?

Sean has been great with his time for the multitude of questions I've asked by phone or text, but with some 8000 PPs on the road, it doesn't seem practical for a live conversation with Sean to be the primary educational approach.

Annie's suggestion, for example, of including an illustration of how the chains should be connected is a great suggestion. There are also several videos on YouTube but no official ones on operation by Sean/ProPride the company (that I'm aware of). That would be VERY helpful - again, for installation, hitching, unhitching and basic driving, backing and camping use.

One last thought - Annie - in addition to your incident, it's got to feel odd being the center of this thread. I think in general, we're all trying to learn from your difficult experience. In the heat of that learning process, we're probably being less than sensitive to your feelings from time to time as we try to wrap our heads around exactly how this happened. It's so important to figure this out but not so important that we forget your disappointment with - and courage for sharing - your situation. Please filter through as best you can and if I can be of any help at all, please feel free to PM me. I'm sure you're in constant communication with Sean and I hope the advice received here about checking out all the systems associated with towing are helpful to you! Safe travels on the road!!

[rodsterinfl]

As for the chains causing the bending of the stinger --
Annie stated that the installer lengthened the chains and they were very close to dragging.
I would like to see an explanation of how chains with that much excess length, even if they were routed over the WD bars, could cause the damage which occurred.

If the chains were caught between that space when the head rotated, they would be locked in place perhaps compromising length at either end during head rotation/pivoting.

Looking at the picture of the hitch head and not the stinger, it would seem that there are two possibilities to bend the ends of the hitch head plate upward, 1) a turn with the chains caught between the head and bars or 2) a jackknife situation where either the chains or bars moved upward to bend the plate. The point of the bend and the bars/chain condition or markings should tell. The greater damage on the head looks to be on the left side.

As far as the chain information, I remember lengthening the chains to match the description in the installation and reviewing the directions- that part was documented. It might be helpful to add a section as SteveSueMac mentioned. using your new hitch- hitching tips on uneven ground, backing, avoiding a jackknife (max angle of hitch)

At least you have a replacement either inbound or already there and will be on your way soon Annie. You have all of us as a resource and contact point too.

[LFC]

Originally Posted by Jim Flower

Like this?
Backing uphill in the mud. Jim

You can only back straight up and no uphill mud climbs.

That leaves me out....

[Bruce B]

This is really simple.
Route the chains the way they are supposed to go.
You will never have this happen again.
If you do "jackknife" again and you have the chains in the proper place all you will need to do is loosen 4 nuts and re-center the cross bar on the trailer.
Ask me how I know.....
This is actually one benefit of the ProPride vs the Hensley design.
Bruce

[anniemaine]

Thanks everyone. I have contacted a mobile rv service. I'll have them check out the entire hitch and I should be on the road again by Thursday, a little wiser. With great gratitude, Annie

[dcheshire]

Keep having fun Annie!! We've all made mistakes and the important thing is no one was hurt and you'll be back on the road and having fun very soon! In the meantime, enjoy some camp coffee.

[Morgan guy]

This thread is starting to remind me of a state park in Utah, Dead Horse Point. It has been beat to death and all we are getting now is speculation, which apparently has no end.

[adonh]

Originally Posted by anniemaine

My stinger is significantly bent and slightly twisted.

Are there 2 bends or just one. In the picture looking down it looks like it bent as it comes our of the TV receiver as well as where it attaches to the adjustable portion of of the bar.

[Ron Gratz]

Originally Posted by rodsterinfl

Looking at the picture of the hitch head and not the stinger, it would seem that there are two possibilities to bend the ends of the hitch head plate upward, 1) a turn with the chains caught between the head and bars---

Looking only at the photo which was posted by Annie, I can see how one might conclude a chain got caught between head and bars.
However, the above photo of a different hitch from a different angle indicates a clearance of more than 2" between the bar and the plate which was shown as "rippled" in Annie's photo.
It seems to me there is plenty of room for a chain to be pulled across the bar without getting caught.

If a chain were routed over the left bar and the TT swung to the right, the weight of the drooping chain between bar and receiver would keep the chain down on the bar. The chain would follow close to a straight line between bar and the chain attachment point. The chain might or might not contact the plate. If it did, the tension in the chain would not be sufficient to damage the plate. Remember, Annie said her chains almost touched the ground, so there would be plenty of excess length to keep them from becoming taut. Only about 1.6" of chain would be pulled across the bar as the TT swings.

---or 2) a jackknife situation where either the chains or bars moved upward to bend the plate.---

I see no way that a bar could move upward. The front end of a bar is prevented from moving upward relative to the plate by virtue of its being locked in its socket. And, I see no way that a chain would cause any load on the plate.

---The point of the bend and the bars/chain condition or markings should tell. The greater damage on the head looks to be on the left side.

I agree there is not enough evidence to say what caused the "ripple".

Instead of automatically assuming the main head was prevented from rotating due to an incorrectly routed chain, I think we should defer passing judgment until we have a better basis for knowing what really happened.

Ron

[Sean Woodruff]

Originally Posted by Ron Gratz

I agree there is not enough evidence to say what caused the "ripple".

Instead of automatically assuming the main head was prevented from rotating due to an incorrectly routed chain, I think we should defer passing judgment until we have a better basis for knowing what really happened.

Ron

When you complete your investigation of the evidence I hope you'll invite me to your courtroom for the passing of judgment.


-

[Jim Flower]

Originally Posted by dkottum

oh oh . . . two hitch conspiracies in one thread.

I actually really like my Hensley. I was just trying to demonstrate the accuracy of Sean's assessment of what happens in a nasty situation. I have created lots of nasty situations while trying to learn all sorts of things. Most of the nasty stuff has only happened once, except for backing into things, which I have now remedied. Jim

[ROBERT CROSS]

Nothing is so disappointing as unappreciated sarcasm.

Bob

[Ron Gratz]

Originally Posted by Bruce B

---If you do "jackknife" again and you have the chains in the proper place all you will need to do is loosen 4 nuts and re-center the cross bar on the trailer.---

In order for the cross bar to "slip", it has to overcome the friction force between bar and frame.

The friction force depends on the tension in the U-bolts and the condition of the surfaces of cross bar and frame.
The tension in a U-bolt depends on the condition of the U-bolt threads and the amount of torque applied to the U-bolt nuts.

Seems to me that if the friction force is too great, the cross bar will not slip when it should, and hitch/stinger damage could occur.
And, if the friction force is too small, the cross bar will slip when it should not, and the sway-resisting ability of the hitch will be reduced.

My first question is -- how does one know the correct amount of torque to apply to the U-bolts?

The online version of the ProPride INSTALLATION And OPERATION Instructions which I cited in an earlier post simply states:
"Step 7: Tighten the U-Bolt Hex nuts with your 11/16” socket."
I find no mention of the proper amount of torque.

My second question is -- how far can the cross bar slip? It looks as if the U-bolts pass through slots in the cross. If so, the amount of "slip" would be limited by the length of the slot and the proximity of the bolts to the sides of the A-frame.

If the cross bar slips 1" and the length of the yoke assembly is 20", the upper unit of the hitch head could rotate an additional 3 degrees before further rotation is prevented.
This means that an overload condition could occur at a TV/TT relative angle of approximately 86 degrees instead of approximately 83 degrees.

It seems to me that a slipping cross bar simply allows one to back into a slightly sharper angle before potential damage occurs.

Ron

[mojo]

I think it's done!

[dkottum]

Originally Posted by Jim Flower

I actually really like my Hensley. I was just trying to demonstrate the accuracy of Sean's assessment of what happens in a nasty situation. I have created lots of nasty situations while trying to learn all sorts of things. Most of the nasty stuff has only happened once, except for backing into things, which I have now remedied. Jim

Sorry Jim, my inability to communicate well. The sarcasm wasn't directed to you. The "two conspiracies" suggestion was making light of those who are trying to inflate the bending of a hitch bar assembly from backing too sharply, while possibly limiting the ProPride's movement with improperly positioned safety chains. When you posted the Hensley hitch damage from something similar, I snickered to myself "two conspiracies", and made a dumb reply.

[Tater]

Annie, I congratulate you on giving things your best shot and sharing the bent bar issue. Fortunately, you will be or are back on the road by now continuing your journey. I would imagine that anyone who has pulled a trailer has has an aww sh** moment at one time or another but the most important things is that you recognized there was a problem, are getting it corrected and now have more knowledge as to hopefully prevent it from happening again.

[dkottum]

Indeed none of us ever quit learning and it often costs us something. Enjoy your travels and continue to seek help anytime. This is surely not a big deal.

[Jim Flower]

Originally Posted by dkottum

Sorry Jim, my inability to communicate well. The sarcasm wasn't directed to you. The "two conspiracies" suggestion was making light of those who are trying to inflate the bending of a hitch bar assembly from backing too sharply, while possibly limiting the ProPride's movement with improperly positioned safety chains. When you posted the Hensley hitch damage from something similar, I snickered to myself "two conspiracies", and made a dumb reply.

Doug,
I understood exactly and join you in your assessment. I think Bob just had his spoon out. Jim