HELP with setup: Tundra, Blue Ox, 23FC FB, Cat Scale Visit

[avonroemer]

We have a ‘14 dc Tundra pulling a 23D Airstream, Blue Ox with 1000# bars. Ball assembly top bolt is in the 3rd hole down. Setup was done per instructions (remember bolts need to be torqued). With 750# tongue weight, bars on 9th link, it handles great and is level. We do have the rear sway bar. I keep trailer tires at 80# cold. With the Tundra, and all trucks really, you must pay close attention to payload. If the CAT scale numbers for steering axle and drive axle total more that the GVWR on the door then you are overloaded. That number is the weight of the truck, plus passengers and gear in the cab and bed, plus the tongue weight and the weight the Blue Ox transfers to the truck. I frequently bump that number when loaded for a trip.

[Dick tracy]

have someone with experience drive it and tell you if you are merely a nervous driver.

[xyzabe]

Why don't you contact Blue Ox customer support for help? I've had a Sway Pro for years and they were great in helping when I set up with my F-150 and again with my F-250. Go over what you have, your CAT info and your issues. They will give you one or more suggestions to get you set up right. It might take a call or two, but it's worth getting their help. They are the experts on their systems.

Mon-Fri 7:30-5:00 CST
info@blueox.com
For Retail Customer Order Support Call: 855-682-0369

[TUW]

Hi--I tow a Flying Cloud RB/Bunk 23 with a 2020 F-150 (tow package) and the Blue Ox, on link 8 with the 1000 lb bars. We are always heavy when traveling, as we use our trailer most in the summer for 6-week stints--between kids, myself, and pets and all of the gear, we are fully maxed in the truck and trailer. Trailer always does best towing with a full water tank and empty black/grey as someone else noted. Only time I have problems is when the tanks are empty heading home and we hit a bad cross wind--tendency to get sucked into semi-trailer wake when they are passing me, and I have to stay alert. I do like the blue ox hitch--very straight forward once you figure it out.

[Dick tracy]

Originally Posted by TUW

\. Only time I have problems is when the tanks are empty heading home and we hit a bad cross wind--tendency to get sucked into semi-trailer wake when they are passing me, and I have to stay alert. I do like the blue ox hitch--very straight forward once you figure it out.

OR don't let trucks pass you.

[2008AS]

Originally Posted by JEB

When I first brought my trailer home from the dealer, my Blue Ox performed terribly. After eight CAT scale weighs, two sets of spring bars, three hitch adjustments and three link positions, I finally have it dialed in. Turns out, my dealer supplied spring bars were too heavy, which resulted in the link setting being too low, which in turn resulted in two little deflection in the spring bars. Looking at your numbers, it looks to me like you might have a similar problem—insufficient deflection (“bow”) in the spring bars. At a dead hitch weight of 800, I would expect you to be at the 11th link on 750 lb bars but try this procedure to see if you can zero in on the correct setting.

First, make sure your trailer really is level at the existing hitch height. Don’t rely on your eyes or a bubble level. Find a level parking lot and with the trailer hitched up, measure the height of the frame in two places: 1. From the ground to the bottom of the frame just in front of the rear bumper; and 2. From the ground to the bottom of the frame on the tongue. For ease of reference, I pick the spot on the frame just under the front of the propane cover. Make sure these two measurements are the same or as close to the same as you can make them with hitch adjustments. If the front is too low, raise the hitch height up a notch and measure again. If too high after adjustment, go back to where you started. Better to be slightly too low than too high.

Second, go to a CAT scale with your now level trailer. Best if you can do this fully loaded and ready for travel. Drop the trailer and weigh just the truck. Pay close attention to the front axle weight. Now hitch up the trailer and put the spring bars on the 9th link (Blue Ox recommends use of the 9th, 10th or 11th links, which will provide between 2”-4” of deflection on the spring bars). Roll the trailer back onto the CAT scale and get another weight. Is the weight on the front axle the same or lower than the first measurement? If lower go to the 10th link and weigh again. Keep repeating the process until you get as close to the first front axle weight as you can without going over. If you are still not close to fully restored by the 11th link (within about 50 lbs or so), the spring bars are too light and you’ll need to start the process all over again with 1000# bars.

Once you have found the link that gets you closest to the unhitched front axle weight of your truck without going over, check to make sure that your trailer is still level. If it is, you are as dialed in as you’ll ever be with your current equipment. If not, drop the trailer hitch height one notch and repeat step 2 again. This will take time and some patience and possibly a $300 investment in a second set of spring bars, but you’ll eventually get there.

When you say 9th, 10th, 11th link. Are you counting from the loose end of chain or the end attached to the sway bars?

[2008AS]

Originally Posted by TUW

Hi--I tow a Flying Cloud RB/Bunk 23 with a 2020 F-150 (tow package) and the Blue Ox, on link 8 with the 1000 lb bars. We are always heavy when traveling, as we use our trailer most in the summer for 6-week stints--between kids, myself, and pets and all of the gear, we are fully maxed in the truck and trailer. Trailer always does best towing with a full water tank and empty black/grey as someone else noted. Only time I have problems is when the tanks are empty heading home and we hit a bad cross wind--tendency to get sucked into semi-trailer wake when they are passing me, and I have to stay alert. I do like the blue ox hitch--very straight forward once you figure it out.

Again. How do you count 8 links? From which end of the chain.

When I tow with my blue ox, I have 8 loose links hanging. Meaning the 9th link from the loose end is where the WDH cam is attached.

[JEB]

Originally Posted by 2008AS

When you say 9th, 10th, 11th link. Are you counting from the loose end of chain or the end attached to the sway bars?

I count it the same way Blue Ox counts it—from the loose end. But there’s an easy way to cross reference. Count the number of links from the end of the spring bar and the bottom of the cam when the spring bars are attached. At 9 links, there should be 3 1/2 links showing between the spring bar and the cam. At 10, 2 1/2 links showing. At 11, 1 1/2 and you need to start thinking about heavier spring bars.

[2008AS]

I run mine at 9 links. It seems really tight, but pulls best at this setting with the least amount of sway.

[GettinAway]

I looked at mine yesterday as I hooked up. I’m on the eighth from the end. Seems like lots of bow in the bars. I get nervous about putting too much torque on the front of the frame and getting separation with my 25FB. Pulls great, no sway and a level truck and trailer.

[fenderltd]

Updates, almost 2000 miles with running 9th link, 1000lb bars, and full fresh water and it felt pretty good! It's possible because I don't have much experience towing - that's the truth so I could maybe try the 750lb bars, with no fresh water and it might be fine. The 2000 mile trip gave me experience and confidence in towing so Dick Tracy may have been somewhat right as well.

I do think running with the fresh water full, I was over 750 so I guess the bars had to be swapped to the 1000 anyway.

[Profxd]

Adding the weight of a full tank of water increases the TW to 750lbs you have raised the TW% from 11.3% to 13%. This is the most likely reason for the improvement but sure go ahead and try it with the tank empty and report back.

[Martee]

Originally Posted by Profxd

Adding the weight of a full tank of water increases the TW to 750lbs you have raised the TW% from 11.3% to 13%. This is the most likely reason for the improvement but sure go ahead and try it with the tank empty and report back.

When I put a full tank fresh water in my 25FB, my hitch weight decreased ever slightly. Which implies the fresh water tank must be directly over the axles or very close to it on my trailer, to not affect my hitch weight.

[pteck]

From your original cat scale weights, you had sufficient WD tension to suggest that was not the root of your issue. Unladen front axle 3540lbs, towing w/o WD, 3360lbs. It's generally recommended to have 50% FALR (front axle load restoration) with WD, but each measurement showed you were closer to 100%. That's frame bending stress on both the TV and trailer and over-relying on WD to compensate for other factors. Personally, I would go back to the 750lb bars as a 23FC and Tundra don't warrant the need of extra stress created by 1k bars.

Profxd is right that your tongue weight is less than ideal and can contribute to less than desired stability. Load distribution within the trailer, and water, can help dramatically. It should also be said not to load particularly heavy objects at the rear of the trailer (past the axles).

There are other variables still. Martee touched on a good one with trailer tire pressures. But also, what are your tire pressures for the Tundra? I assume stock wheels and tires? It's not a bad idea to inflate the tires beyond door jamb pressures: 3 PSI increase in front, 5 PSI rear. Some aftermarket model tires just have soft sidewalls and the increased pressure can help overall stability.

Most important but can show us a side picture of your WD hitch? What type of drop shank are you using? Specifically does the shank project the ball away from the bumper significantly? Many truck owners unknowingly do this to create clearance to open the tailgate. This effects a critical wheelbase to rear-overhang ratio dimension - effectively giving the trailer leverage to induce sway and porpoising. Another way to say it is that it's compromising the nice long wheelbase of the truck.

Glad you were able to get some wheel time in and you had a safe trip!

[Dick tracy]

Originally Posted by pteck

From your original cat scale weights, you had sufficient WD tension to suggest that was not the root of your issue. Unladen front axle 3540lbs, towing w/o WD, 3360lbs. It's generally recommended to have 50% FALR (front axle load restoration) with WD, but each measurement showed you were closer to 100%. That's frame bending stress on both the TV and trailer and over-relying on WD to compensate for other factors. Personally, I would go back to the 750lb bars as a 23FC and Tundra don't warrant the need of extra stress created by 1k bars.!

Did I understand you correctly that a WD hitch shouldn't move too much weight off the rear axle to the trailer and the TV front axle??? You said it over stresses both frames on the TV and TT???
The Blue Ox is designed to throw 40% off the rear axle, 20% to each the TV front axle and the TT, leaving 60% still on the rear axle. On most of our AS the tongue weight is around 1000lbs, move 200 each direction is what we want. We don't want so much weight on the rear axle that it lightens the front's ability to steer and brake properly. And the truck manufacturers expect you to use a WD system.
Just curious where you came up with that stay?