Towing with a Jeep

[Figaro]

we have a 2001 Jeep Cherokee Sport
5,000 GVWR
2.5L
we want to pull a new 19' Safari Bambi.

we are traveling musicians so we will be
living in the airstream often as well as
traveling throughout the states.
we have around 1,500 lbs of gear, including our body weight.

the total wet GVWR of a new 19' Safari is 4,500

this is our first airstream purchase so we have
lots of questtions.

first and foremost, can the Jeep handle a 19' Safari Bambi?

the dealer we are talking with tells us yes, but we want to
know what airstreamers recomend and say.

thank you and look forward to response,

anthony & lizzie

[CanoeStream]

Welcome to the Forums Figaro! Ah yess -- dealers. Gotta love 'em though...

There are a few details that would be useful in answering your question. Is it a 6- or 8-cylinder engine? Your manual may have the figures but can you tell us the Payload Capacity (or subtract empty weight from GVWR)? Finally, do you know what your Jeep's rear differential ratio might be? 3.73? 4.10?

Thank you!

[2airishuman]

anthony and lizzie

welcome to airstreamn'

always exciting when a new trailer is close at hand, and selecting the proper towing equipment is so important.

short answer....no i would not tow with your jeep cherokee...not me.

longer answer.......there are many threads here directly related to towing...and even the ones that aren't about jeeps will help you to learn/understand towing issues....

go to the towing sub sections and just start reading....or search a few terms...

http://www.airforums.com/forum...earchid=294648

http://www.airforums.com/forum...earchid=294660

http://www.airforums.com/forum...earchid=294661

http://www.airforums.com/forum...earchid=294665

here are a few to start....

happy travels are ahead

2air'

[Silvertwinkie]

Not a chance with a 2.5L, 1500lbs of cargo, fuel for the truck, and gear for the Bambi. Not by a longshot. It'll move it, but thats only part of the equation. I can move my 25' Safari with our 5hp snowblower.

[2airishuman]

anthony and lizzie

i see from your other post that you have the straight 6 in the jeep....i still would n't tow with it....

more importantly it looks like you are still deciding on a tv/trailer combo...and have not purchased the trialer yet? and you are planning to live part of the time in the trailer?

the 19s are cute and great weekenders...but i think that's tooo small for 2 people who plan lots of days.....

i'd suggest 23-25 as the smallest living space....look for a newer coach ready to use (not a fixer)....and then find a newer t.v. that will pull it safely.....

in other words...spend some more time finding the best size living space with the proper style and features....for your intended travel......

and after making this important decision.....find the properly sized t.v.

neither needs to be new....but both should fit their purpose and your needs.....

that will be less money in the short/long run than trying to use a marginal t.v. with a tightly sized trailer....

cheers
2air'

[CanoeStream]

Really, really, really lie down together in a Bambi corner bed if you continue to consider one.

I have to agree with everyone above. A 19' is to small to spend any serious time in. I have a 25' Classic and feel that with the three of us ( myself, wife and son) it's tight. It's fine for short trips, but if we were traveling for long periods, I'd want something larger.A lot of the smaller Airstreams look great when your at the dealer, but I think that once you actually are out and using it, they can start to feel really small and cramped. I don't think there are to many people who trade down in size but quite a few who trade up.

[Figaro]

thanks for all your responses. they are a big help.

another trailer we are looking at is a 1970 27' international overlander. we checked it out and it is in really good shape but know we would definetely need to get it inspected.

another airstream we found and are interested in is a 1977 22' argosy in perfect condition. some of you might know the one i'm looking at, it's been on ebay for the past few days.

we are also traveling as 3 people with 2 small dogs, a one eyed cattle dog and a min pin.

so we're thinking that we need to upgrade vehicles from your responses.

for people who have never pulled an airstream, is there a big difference in handling and being comfortable pulling a 27' as opposed to a 19' or 22'?

thanks again,
anthony & lizzie

[2airishuman]

well there is a trailer cliche'

the smaller the trailer,
the more people, dogs
and pigs are inside.....


your current options are all over the chart...

new bambi,
70s 22 agosy,
70s 27 overlander

and this sort of thinking isn't unusual for newly minted airstreamers...

there are lots of variables to consider...which we aren't privy toooo.

and many ways to become happy airstream travelers....

but it would seem that a newer trailer would be better suited for travel without concern about axle upgrades, tanks, leaks, working fridges....and so on, and also would have larger/better living space, storage and so on....

like this one........

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...tem=4612736484

pulled by a newer ford/gmc/chevy 3/4 ton truck or van.....

where the pig could hang...

cheers
2air'

[Figaro]

thanks for your thoughts.
if you know any other links of newer trailers that would be great.
we're still puting it all together.

a & t

[Silvertwinkie]

Originally Posted by Figaro

another trailer we are looking at is a 1970 27' international overlander. we checked it out and it is in really good shape but know we would definetely need to get it inspected.
another airstream we found and are interested in is a 1977 22' argosy in perfect condition. some of you might know the one i'm looking at, it's been on ebay for the past few days.
we are also traveling as 3 people with 2 small dogs, a one eyed cattle dog and a min pin.

so we're thinking that we need to upgrade vehicles from your responses.

for people who have never pulled an airstream, is there a big difference in handling and being comfortable pulling a 27' as opposed to a 19' or 22'?

I agree, I think before you go any further, you need to look a a better tow vehicle. True the Argosy is going to most likely weigh the least, but the reality is that you have an army going with you. We had 1 dog and the two of us and we were always out of room in the 19' Bambi. I couldn't see a 22' being much better in terms of space given your companions. In our 25' Safari, we are pretty comfy and have more storage. But then again, your Cherokee isn't gonna tow that either. The 27' (dry) is most likely going to weight as much as the Bambi is wet (again the older units are bit less heavy), but there again, if you're getting a basic thumbs down here from most folks on the Cherokee with a 19', the 27' is even more out of the safe question. My brother has a Cherokee H.O. in line 6 and it's a great truck for what it does. He could maybe tow my 3000lb 19' boat, and IMHO that's about the top of his limit, should be your range too.

I think 25' should be the smallest coach you should look at. The 27' sounds great if you all have sleeping, storage space you need for all and a tow vehicle to handle it.

As for towing, yes you can notice a slight difference, but nothing to worry about. In reality, I like the dual vs. the single axles. Odd as it may sound our 25' tracks better full loaded than our Bambi did either way. Most folks that have upgraded will say that they like the way the larger coached tow than the smaller ones.

[ankornuta]

I'm able to pull my 26' 1958 Cruiser with my 2005 Jeep Grand Cherokee... I have the 5.7L Hemi in there and can tow up to 7200 pounds. It's a breeze to get the trailer moving but I can tell you that it isn't much fun. It gets pushed around a bit by the trailer. Since I'm knee-deep in an off-frame restoration I have time to think about a new tow vehicle. I may end up with a Hensley Arrow hitch in the interim though, that would certainly help from what I've heard.

[sofron52]

We have a 19 ft Bambi and pull it with a 2000 Range Rover with a 6600 lb tow rating. We have no trouble whatsoever but the Bambi would be toooo small for your use. We travel as three people and a small dog and two weeks is about the limit of our tolerance.

[85MH325]

If you're really serious about buying an Airstream for serious long-term travel, there are a number of things you need to do. First, forget about your tow vehicle until you find the trailer that suits your needs. (Your 2.5l Jeep would probably tow a Scamp 16' nicely, but I wouldn't do anything larger or heavier with it than that!) In any event, tow vehicles are a dime a dozen, and can be found easily. Trailers, on the other hand, take a lot more effort. Make a list of everything you plan to haul, and then figure out approximately what it weighs. Make a list of everything you plan to pile into the trailer and make sure you know how much THAT weighs.

Once you've done that, go shopping. Go look at every Airstream you can find, and take notes as you look. Age, size, and condition are irrelevent at this point. These trips will give you a really good idea about what amenities come in what year range; what sizes have the space you're comfortable in; and they'll give you an opportunity to think about how to carry the 'stuff' you need on the road. Within a short time you'll also know what to expect condition-wise for the average unit of a specific age.

You'll also soon find out what size range really fits your lifestyle and comfort level as well as your 'stuff'. You'll also figure out after a while, when "THE" trailer comes along in "THE" size you want with "THE" features you want at "THE" price you're willing to pay... and you'll be able to scoop it quickly and feel good about it.

While you're trailer shopping, you'll have the opportunity to shop tow vehicles as well. You'll probably want something on the order of a Suburban or Excursion, or a van to carry your equipment in. You'll also have the opportunity to find out what power trains are offered in which vehicles and what's around to tow with. I mentioned weights early on because you'll need to know what the gross vehicle weight rating is on both the trailer and tow vehicle, as well as the gross combined weight rating that the tow vehicle is capable of towing. Some Airstreams are notoriously light on the cargo weight they're capable of carrying because the net weight of the trailer is close to the gross axle weight ratings. Check all that carefully. I'll grant that they're guidelines and not absolutes, but they'll go a long way to saving you some serious problems on the road with overloading...

If you spend the time to do your homework before you jump into something, you'll likely get a tow vehicle/trailer combo that will actually suit your needs and will be a joy to own. If you buy something on impulse, you'll likely end up buying and selling a couple of tow vehicle and trailer combinations before you get what you really should have gotten in the first place.

Good luck and happy hunting!

Roger

[59toaster]

Originally Posted by ankornuta

I'm able to pull my 26' 1958 Cruiser with my 2005 Jeep Grand Cherokee... I have the 5.7L Hemi in there and can tow up to 7200 pounds. It's a breeze to get the trailer moving but I can tell you that it isn't much fun. It gets pushed around a bit by the trailer. Since I'm knee-deep in an off-frame restoration I have time to think about a new tow vehicle. I may end up with a Hensley Arrow hitch in the interim though, that would certainly help from what I've heard.

Wheel base is part of the problem. I think the rest of your problem is hitch related. What are you using for a hitch?

[slowmover]

(Been looking through some of these old threads and thought I'd add some Daimler-Chrysler specs for the Jeep Cherokee [XJ-series; not Grand] that might be of help to someone else thinking of towing with an XJ. I love 'em, so remember that [am on the third one currently].)

Wheelbase: 101" (considered short).

Weight: (have owned two of the 2WD versions. Both scaled at a little over 3,400-lbs each; empty, but with full fuel and no driver or passengers. Add another 450-lbs for 4WD; or, nearly 3,900-lbs before driver and pax plus misc). I have seen plenty of instances of modified 4WD Cherokees that weigh in excess of 4,700-lbs.


Towing capacity: 5,000-lbs on a Class III receiver (I recommend Hidden Hitch) with a weight distribution rig. Probably, the REESE Strait Line "Dual Cam" is the best lower cost choice. Otherwise, I'd have a 3P-style hitch.


A fact not noted, but the factory makes a point of stating:

No more than 25' in length, and 64 s/f of frontal area with a maximum tongue weight of 750-lbs.

Axle loading maximum (rear; or GAWR) is: 2,700-lbs with either the DANA 35 or MOPAR 8.25 axle. (With the I6-242 cid engine and Aisin-Warner4 transmission, the rear axle ratio is 3.55 with or without limited slip.

The GCWR (gross combined weight rating) is 8,781-lbs in 2WD and a hair over 9,000-lbs with 4WD (spring capacity).

Example: My current XJ weighs just under 3,400-lbs. With my wife and I aboard, plus about 50-lbs of essentials, we are already at nearly 3,760-lbs.

Assuming the weight distribution remains constant on the rear axle (solo) of 43%, then we are at 1,634-lbs, with 1,066-lbs to go to maximum.

Note that many Jeeps are not fitted by their owners with tires that are properly weight rated. Each tire needs a capacity of around 1,400-lbs to squeak by the GAWR.

The brakes do NOT have a great deal of reserve capacity (front disc/ rear drum). I have upgraded two of my XJ's and recommend that.

It will take some sorting to get the numbers to work, but assuming that one will be toting a 5,000-lb trailer behind a moderately loaded TV is a stretch. At least for a long trip.

That said, the 4.0L six and AW4 trans are bulletproof. It will take an XHD ATF cooler (and PSF cooler, IMO) to get the best from the Jeep (plus the HD radiator according to the 2001 manual). The gearing is more than adequate (peak torque is around 3,200-rpm) so be careful of tire sizing that one can cruise just below peak torque at highway speeds.

I have towed several small trailers (extra low to ground) and weight was no consideration on an 1800-mile roundtrip on the Plains at several thousand pounds. MPG was good at 12. Fighting winds with an enlarged frontal area (make the measurements, p-l-e-a-s-e) would be another story.

Don't fall for the idea of unibody being inferior to body-on-frame, that is ridiculous. A unibody vehicle is engineered for strength without weight. The abuse put on 4WD Jeeps is amazing. Tremendous aftermarket support for those who want to modify.