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Old 12-16-2020, 10:28 PM   #181
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I have a 2017 GMC 4X4 1500Crew Cab with the 6.2L Engine and the Max Trailering Package (3.42 Rear Axle, heavier rear springs, etc.) that we use to tow our 1991 34" Limited weighing about 9,000 pounds. I've had virtually no problems with the truck and it is a pleasure to drive...far more than my prior 3/4 ton Yukon XL which was good in it's own right.

Although premium gas is required/recommended, these trucks are really great on mileage. On a trip in New England I got a high of about 12.7 MPG towing with an average of about 11.8. Solo on the trip I've got over 22 MPG during multiple day trips.


Here we were at Lake Erie SP campground (great overnight stop)!
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Old 12-17-2020, 06:50 PM   #182
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Steve, what’s your payload and hitch weight? Great looking combination!
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Old 12-18-2020, 07:41 AM   #183
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Steve - thank you for sharing your tow experience, but without providing weight ratings, it is difficult for folks new to towing to determine if this is a “safe” combination.

Payload - your topper is about 200 lbs, tongue weight @ 15% of trailer weight is 1,350 lbs, driver and passenger about 300 lbs total 1,850 lbs with an empty backseat and truck bed.
Gross Combined Vehicle Weight Rating - most have half ton trucks Gross Vehicle Weight is 7,000 lbs or less. Using that as an example, your 7,000 lb truck + your 9,000 lb trailer total 16,000 lbs. GCVWR on my previous TV was 14,500 lbs.
Rear Axle Rating.

Putting better springs on the back do not impact the above weights, but help keep the truck level. This is a common half ton requirement for towing 26’ or longer trailers, or when the bed and cab are loaded with cargo and possible a topper?

Here is an example of someone towing a triple axle AS to Top of Georgia AS park. While hosting in August, a fellow pulls in with a recently shined beautiful triple axle 34 foot AS. After an impressive, “Wow that’s a beautiful trailer”, we followed that up with, “What is he towing that long, heavy trailer with”. He uses an Infiniti version of the Nissan Armada, that was setup by Andy T at CanAm. He also claims it is a safe towing combination. However, he was the only person towing AS’s at the park who agreed with that evaluation.

99.5% of the folks that provide advice on towing heavy loads - like towing 9,000 lb trailer suggest a heavy duty truck: like YouTube channels - Keep Your Daydream, TFL Trucks, Long, Long Honeymoon, Big Truck, Big RV, and maybe more. For example, Land Yacht Harbor in Melbourne has about 40 triple axle AS’s parked over the winter. Guess how many tow with half tons?

MPG statements are most effective when they address the “range” that you can tow your trailer before refueling. Does your average MPG allow you to go 300+ miles without refueling? How big is your gas tank, how fast do you tow? I get much better mileage (11MPG) instead of 10 MPG going downhill, or driving 60 MPH on level terrain, like in Florida.
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Old 12-18-2020, 08:02 AM   #184
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Originally Posted by superChop View Post
Steve - thank you for sharing your tow experience, but without providing weight ratings, it is difficult for folks new to towing to determine if this is a “safe” combination.

Payload - your topper is about 200 lbs, tongue weight @ 15% of trailer weight is 1,350 lbs, driver and passenger about 300 lbs total 1,850 lbs with an empty backseat and truck bed.
Gross Combined Vehicle Weight Rating - most have half ton trucks Gross Vehicle Weight is 7,000 lbs or less. Using that as an example, your 7,000 lb truck + your 9,000 lb trailer total 16,000 lbs. GCVWR on my previous TV was 14,500 lbs.
Rear Axle Rating.

Putting better springs on the back do not impact the above weights, but help keep the truck level. This is a common half ton requirement for towing 26’ or longer trailers, or when the bed and cab are loaded with cargo and possible a topper?

Here is an example of someone towing a triple axle AS to Top of Georgia AS park. While hosting in August, a fellow pulls in with a recently shined beautiful triple axle 34 foot AS. After an impressive, “Wow that’s a beautiful trailer”, we followed that up with, “What is he towing that long, heavy trailer with”. He uses an Infiniti version of the Nissan Armada, that was setup by Andy T at CanAm. He also claims it is a safe towing combination. However, he was the only person towing AS’s at the park who agreed with that evaluation.

99.5% of the folks that provide advice on towing heavy loads - like towing 9,000 lb trailer suggest a heavy duty truck: like YouTube channels - Keep Your Daydream, TFL Trucks, Long, Long Honeymoon, Big Truck, Big RV, and maybe more. For example, Land Yacht Harbor in Melbourne has about 40 triple axle AS’s parked over the winter. Guess how many tow with half tons?

MPG statements are most effective when they address the “range” that you can tow your trailer before refueling. Does your average MPG allow you to go 300+ miles without refueling? How big is your gas tank, how fast do you tow? I get much better mileage (11MPG) instead of 10 MPG going downhill, or driving 60 MPH on level terrain, like in Florida.

Your right; inquiring minds want to know this stuff! But it is a pretty trailer...
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Old 12-18-2020, 08:17 AM   #185
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Steve, that’s a nice looking set up. I’m sure it’s working well for you. Thanks for posting.
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Old 12-18-2020, 09:04 AM   #186
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I can help a bit with the questions for Steve. The 2017 max tow 4x4 crew cab 6.2 L has a max tow rating of 11,700 +/- capacity. But the tongue is limited to 12,500 lb, so for a travel trailer (they are much more demanding than the trailers GMC uses to set max limits) the practical safe limit for this vehicle is about 8,300-9,600 lb. depending on how the trailer is loaded and what sway damping performance he is getting from his hitch. Steve's trailer empty is 8,400 and loaded for camping is somewhere north of 9,200 lb. So, in Steve's case safe performance in dire emergencies will very much depend on how he has the hitch set up, how he has the trailer loaded, and how much air pressure he has in the trailer tires, the rear vehicle tires and the front vehicle tires. This set-up could be quite marginal for stability in emergencies and in unusual wind situations, depending on the details. It will tow very well in normal circumstances leading the driver and passengers to conclude it is a safe set up, but it will only reveal its true capability if an emergency surfaces.
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Old 12-18-2020, 09:14 AM   #187
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Steve, that’s a nice looking set up. I’m sure it’s working well for you. Thanks for posting.
Exactly...And if a problem should occur somewhere down the same road we're on, we are likely to be too far down that road to be effected by it.
TETO

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Old 12-18-2020, 09:59 AM   #188
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Here's some information on weights and capacities for my tow vehicle combination. When I weighed the trailer, the fuel tank and fresh water tank were full and we had 400 pounds of passengers in the front seat. I added the topper later and it weighs about 160 pounds, but the weight is not included for the truck. When we're actually traveling on a trip, I would allow for about 300 additional pounds in the truck and about 800 additional pounds in the trailer.

As an aside, the truck has a 26 gallon fuel tank and I wish that it were more like 36 gallons for additional range. However, at 71 years old, I can attest that my personal range is less than that of the vehicle!
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Old 12-19-2020, 06:38 AM   #189
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Exactly...And if a problem should occur somewhere down the same road we're on, we are likely to be too far down that road to be effected by it.
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The odds are very strongly in favor of Steve ever getting into this problem you describe. Some of live life in fear of asteroids falling on our homes. Some of us don’t.

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Old 12-19-2020, 07:47 AM   #190
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The odds are very strongly in favor of Steve ever getting into this problem you describe. Some of live life in fear of asteroids falling on our homes. Some of us don’t.

TETO

Jeff
And yet, asteroids DO hit homes. Just because odds are small doesn't make them zero.

https://www.wired.co.uk/article/mete...house-how-rare
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Old 12-19-2020, 08:17 AM   #191
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RV accidents are not as rare as most people believe. Statistics indicate they occur at an average rate of 1 accident per 12,300 RV miles. 1 accident with injury every 30,300 RV miles traveled. Sway and oversteer are the number two and three leading cause of accident with injury, and those two causes are directly related to towing close or over limits.

I don't think these numbers are comparable to asteroids or lightning strikes.
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Old 12-19-2020, 09:25 AM   #192
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I’m a new AS owner who knew instinctively that my Tundra w/tow package was not the TV I would need in the Rockies, towing my 25 ft. FC. I’m always baffled as I read these threads as to why someone would want to tow an even larger rig (we now have a 28 ft. International) with the Tundra or some other passenger vehicle supposedly equipped to handle the weight.

There will be instances where that rig will push that TV to its limits or beyond, especially if the mountains are among your places of interest.

Those instances are more prevalent (though less amusing) than asteroids. I’ll plan for protecting my wife and I from things that actually might happen.
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Old 12-19-2020, 10:28 AM   #193
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RV accidents are not as rare as most people believe. Statistics indicate they occur at an average rate of 1 accident per 12,300 RV miles. 1 accident with injury every 30,300 RV miles traveled. Sway and oversteer are the number two and three leading cause of accident with injury, and those two causes are directly related to towing close or over limits.

I don't think these numbers are comparable to asteroids or lightning strikes.
I have a very difficult time with the numbers you posted. If your numbers are factual, I should have been in 20+ accidents and injured over 8 times. Could you please produce the source for this data...
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Old 12-19-2020, 02:08 PM   #194
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RV accidents are not as rare as most people believe. Statistics indicate they occur at an average rate of 1 accident per 12,300 RV miles. 1 accident with injury every 30,300 RV miles traveled. Sway and oversteer are the number two and three leading cause of accident with injury, and those two causes are directly related to towing close or over limits.

I don't think these numbers are comparable to asteroids or lightning strikes.
So, of all the RV accidents, how many are driver error? My guess is it would be a huge percentage.
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Old 12-19-2020, 02:10 PM   #195
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And yet, asteroids DO hit homes. Just because odds are small doesn't make them zero.

https://www.wired.co.uk/article/mete...house-how-rare
Bobbo, I’m thinking it’s time to move back into a cave, a very deep and safe cave. I’m worried sick.
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Old 12-19-2020, 02:20 PM   #196
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The new 1/2 ton Ford Hybrid is gonna be the ultimate RV tower with 7000 watts of available power all the time!
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Old 12-19-2020, 02:42 PM   #197
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The thing about all these TV threads, is there is a majority here that just sits in wait for someone to post that they tow AS “X” with TV “Y”. Then there’s this huge chorus of, “we need to see your door sticker!” “We need to see your scale sheets!” The feeding frenzy is unfortunate. The poster usually posts, they have driven many miles without any problems. That doesn’t matter. We are ALL about the numbers! We can PROVE you are unsafe! Just a time bomb just waiting to detonate. I mean, it’s right there in the numbers.. The problem I see is the biggest factor in an accident is driver error. Plus, the numbers have grey areas. I upgraded to 20” wheels, E rated tires, a suspension upgrade, better shocks. None of those things change the infamous door sticker, but they do improve towing considerably.
So the next usual comment is, if you get in a wreck you’ll crucified by the lawyers!! Really? I think your in asteroid territory again.
So, what is the weakest link in payload? Tires, suspension, the rear axle itself? Some big truck guys are proponents of a 30% cushion on every weight limit. Measure it at every tire! If Martha moves a can of peas from the pantry you better get back to the scales.
RVs are pulled millions of miles every year by half ton pickups. Which leads me to another, just weird statement. “Half ton pickups are no better than passenger cars!” I can fill the 6.5’ bed with firewood and my Tundra handles and rides fine. Would it be easier to roll with a load of firewood? Sure, but I don’t drive like an idiot. I also don’t need a step stool to get in my truck. I think that’s maybe tough to fit that much firewood in a Ford Taurus, but I could be wrong.
Maybe the next time someone posts that they pull AS “X” with TV “Y” we would benefit from not seeing 12 immediate requests for a copy of the door sticker! Or the receipts from the scales!
I totally admit to not being able to use cruise control coming down off of Vail Pass. I’m ok with that. I also would struggle more than you big truck guys if my transmission blew up and took out my truck and trailer brakes while coming down Beartooth Pass.
I just use a bit of common sense. Which could be the biggest consideration when looking at TV safety.
I don’t think I’m ready to pull a 30 footer with a minivan, but I know it’s done. Maybe there are two right answers to this 1/2 ton vs 3/4 ton question. Plus a lot of grey area.
FYI, I’ll be pulling my 25 from Missouri to AZ next month with a half ton. There’s time for you to find different routes to avoid me, and warn your families to do the same.
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Old 12-19-2020, 04:02 PM   #198
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Deleted post. I may have crossed the line..
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Old 12-19-2020, 05:35 PM   #199
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The new 1/2 ton Ford Hybrid is gonna be the ultimate RV tower with 7000 watts of available power all the time!
I wouldn't hold your breath just yet. The vehicle has to pull the trailer up the hill but the trailer break really eats into the ability to regenerate the batteries. There is no free lunch.
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Old 12-19-2020, 05:38 PM   #200
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Bobbo, I’m thinking it’s time to move back into a cave, a very deep and safe cave. I’m worried sick.
. A 25' Airstream is a far cry from a 34'. 1/2 tons do really well with 25' and shorter when set up correctly.
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