Porsche Cayenne, VW Touareg, Audi Q7 owners

[cedonly]

One interesting point is that my tire expert/supplier recommmended we over inflate the airstream tires when we are parked over the winter. He said it is normal practice to inflate tires up to 50% over the rates limit to prevent flat spots.

The justification is that the rating is an “operation” rating.

This is not for operation. Before we move our Airstream, we move back to rated tire pressure

[Tom_T]

Originally Posted by cedonly

One interesting point is that my tire expert/supplier recommmended we over inflate the airstream tires when we are parked over the winter. He said it is normal practice to inflate tires up to 50% over the rates limit to prevent flat spots.

The justification is that the rating is an “operation” rating.

This is not for operation. Before we move our Airstream, we move back to rated tire pressure

While that was from a tire supplier, I would check if it could negatively affect your tire warranty for use contrary the tire manufacturer's specs.


I know that that was often done with the old school bias ply tires back in the 1950's & `60's - but the mfgrs. weren't as strict & folks not as litigious back in the day, as they all are now.



Cheers!
Tom
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[cedonly]

Thanks Tom. Yes it was from a very reputable supplier.

I did some more searching and goodyearrvtire.com actually suggests to overinflated tires when the rev is stored

“Inflate tires to recommended operating pressure plus 25%. Ensure that the rim manufacturer’s inflation capacity is not exceeded”

So seems like recommended practice from the manufacturer

Originally Posted by Tom_T

While that was from a tire supplier, I would check if it could negatively affect your tire warranty for use contrary the tire manufacturer's specs.


I know that that was often done with the old school bias ply tires back in the 1950's & `60's - but the mfgrs. weren't as strict & folks not as litigious back in the day, as they all are now.



Cheers!
Tom
///////

[SteveNdebbie]

Originally Posted by Tom_T

Cayenne-airs,


I think that you're off too low on your CayGTS's tongue wt. rating. 617 sounds like the lower rating for the Cayenne e-Hybrid - which is reduced due to the additional EV batteries' wt.



Pretty much all 3 of the V/A/P cousins SUVs are rated the same - Touareg, Cayenne & Audi Q7 for the same towing & tongue wt. (hitch wt.) at 7716 lbs. towing capacity & 770 HW regardless of model year & regardless of which engine from 3.6L VR6 to 3.0 TDI to NA & Turbo V8s - with the exception of the e-Hybrid/Hybrid, & IIRC the Q7 is down to about 7000 lbs/700 HW due to the added wt. of the longer 3 row vehicle.



Your 2014 CayGTS should have a tow rating of 7716 lbs, with a "bearing" hitch capacity of around 700-770 lbs., with a higher HW rating if weight distributed (check the sticker on your factory hitch receiver).



So unless the 25FB has more than the distributed tongue wt., you should be fine - as others on here have said (go back & read some other posts in this very long topic).


Also keep in mind that Porsche doesn't tout their WD rating, because WD hitches are illegal in most/all of Europe & the UK - but they do have well hidden WD ratings for the factory hitch which are higher than the "bearing" HW, & sometimes both are listed on the factory hitch decal.


If you don't have a factory hitch - i.e. an aftermarket one - then can it & get a proper factory hitch with all of the electronics that allow the Cay to automatically adjust the engine, trans, brakes, sway control, etc. to operate as soon as you connect to the trailer tow bar. Sunset Porsche up near you (Portland area IIRC) has the best pricing & discounts on the parts - including the 958 factory hitch. It will need to be dealer installed - or at least the Cay reprogrammed after installation by another.



I got a Hensley Cub (good for trailers up to 6000 lbs) to use it on smaller TVs like the Cay etc. & have been very happy with it's "zero sway" sway elimination system (our vintage 1960 Avion T20 is about 3500 lbs with 542 tongue wt. as currently configured). If your wet & loaded 25FB will be more than 6000 lbs., then you'll need to look at the Hensley Arrow &/or ProPride hitches of the same/similar PPP design for trailers up to 10,000 lbs. I'm very happy with our H-Cub!



There are also other WD/AS hitches out there which others use, that you'll see by reading prior posts in here.


Contact Andy T. at CanAm in Ontario Canada about hitch reinforcement for your Cayenne, which he can send you pix & info to have a local shop do it (if needed), since you're in the PNW far from his shop. He also has other replies in this topic's long thread worth reading, as well as a few others towing 25 (FB & other) with their Cayennes.


I'd suggest that you spend an evening(s) reading through this topic to get up to speed on a number of Cayenne related issues.


Also I recco that you join up with PCA if not already a member, since for $46/yr. for 2 members, you'll get an excellent monthly Panorama magazine & a local Region's one, a bunch of fun events & activities which are free to minimal cost, discounts on parts etc., & a local group of fellow Cay owners to help. If already a member - then you know this!



Cheers!
Tom
///////

So we were able to find this 2006 25’ FB Safari SE with a Hensley arrow hitch.

We already owned this vehicle


We bought the Safari in Michigan and towed it to Can Am


And had reinforcement to our hitch


And enjoyed a trouble free, sway free, 6000 mile trip from Ohio to the Oregon and California coast and back.



We will be looking for a replacement vehicle someday and this thread should prove very useful. Kind of like the Audi but how is the reliability of it and these other German autos?

[TouringDan]

I went to the Audi dealer a while ago to have a warranty item taken care of my wife’s Audi A3. While I was there I looked at some Audi SUV’s to check out the payload numbers.

The first was an Audi SQ5. The payload was 1,058 lbs.
The next was an Audi Q7. The payload was predictably larger at 1,323 lbs.
The last was an Audi Q8. I was surprised at the low payload rating of only 1,102 lbs.

I then stopped at a Jaguar dealer. The Jaguar F-Pace is a beautiful SUV with a tow rating of 5,290 lbs, enough to tow my 66 Tradewind. The payload is a dismal 826 lbs.

It looks like my dream TV is still the Cayenne S.

Dan

[Tom_T]

Originally Posted by SteveNdebbie

So we were able to find this 2006 25’ FB Safari SE with a Hensley arrow hitch. Attachment 339143

We already owned this vehicle
Attachment 339144

We bought the Safari in Michigan and towed it to Can Am
Attachment 339145

And had reinforcement to our hitch
Attachment 339146Attachment 339147

And enjoyed a trouble free, sway free, 6000 mile trip from Ohio to the Oregon and California coast and back.

Attachment 339148Attachment 339149Attachment 339150Attachment 339151

We will be looking for a replacement vehicle someday and this thread should prove very useful. Kind of like the Audi but how is the reliability of it and these other German autos?

I'm curious how hard your Acura with the V6 worked on the mountain grades to, from & within OR & CA?



My experience back in 2013 towing our 1960 Avion T20 with a few rented 2012-13 body-on-frame Nissan Pathfinder SUVs with the 4.0L V6 & AT - which was of similar size to your Acura MDX (??) with the 3.5 or 3.6L V6 - was that it worked very hard at high rpm on even modest grades, & was constantly up & down shifting when cruising at 55-65-ish on the freeway while towing our much lighter 1960 Avion T20 (3000-3500 lbs wet/loaded).



The equivalent Honda Pilot/Ridgeline was at the bottom of the list in a towing test of some auto show I watched recently, & I have another vintage trailer buddy who had a 2010-13-ish prior style Ridgeline with the same problems on moderate to steep grade - slow going.



Ergo my decision to look for the mid-sized SUVs with a V8, but most of them either have gone to turbo V6 or high power but poor towing mpg turbo V8s from all of the German brands now & since 2015> MY.



Cheers!
Tom
///////

[Tom_T]

Originally Posted by TouringDan

I went to the Audi dealer a while ago to have a warranty item taken care of my wife’s Audi A3. While I was there I looked at some Audi SUV’s to check out the payload numbers.

The first was an Audi SQ5. The payload was 1,058 lbs.Attachment 339167Attachment 339168
The next was an Audi Q7. The payload was predictably larger at 1,323 lbs.Attachment 339169Attachment 339170
The last was an Audi Q8. I was surprised at the low payload rating of only 1,102 lbs.Attachment 339171Attachment 339172

I then stopped at a Jaguar dealer. The Jaguar F-Pace is a beautiful SUV with a tow rating of 5,290 lbs, enough to tow my 66 Tradewind. The payload is a dismal 826 lbs.Attachment 339175Attachment 339176

It looks like my dream TV is still the Cayenne S.

Dan

Dan -


Well the TDI V6 diesel & normally aspirated V8s are gone from the Porsche, Audi & VW made SUVs.


The Cayenne S since 2015 has been the 3.6L V6 TT as used in the Macan (a lighter vehicle), & you now can only get a V8 in the Cayenne Turbo or Turbo S flavors at a much higher price point.



No V8s at all from VW & Audi!



MBZ is the same with the GLE (formerly ML) - unless you go to the AMG TT V8.



Not sure about BMW X5 V8s now.



A very limited German mid-sized SUV field for us Trailerites anymore!



Cheers!
Tom
///////

[SteveNdebbie]

Originally Posted by Tom_T

I'm curious how hard your Acura with the V6 worked on the mountain grades to, from & within OR & CA?



My experience back in 2013 towing our 1960 Avion T20 with a few rented 2012-13 body-on-frame Nissan Pathfinder SUVs with the 4.0L V6 & AT - which was of similar size to your Acura MDX (??) with the 3.5 or 3.6L V6 - was that it worked very hard at high rpm on even modest grades, & was constantly up & down shifting when cruising at 55-65-ish on the freeway while towing our much lighter 1960 Avion T20 (3000-3500 lbs wet/loaded).



The equivalent Honda Pilot/Ridgeline was at the bottom of the list in a towing test of some auto show I watched recently, & I have another vintage trailer buddy who had a 2010-13-ish prior style Ridgeline with the same problems on moderate to steep grade - slow going.



Ergo my decision to look for the mid-sized SUVs with a V8, but most of them either have gone to turbo V6 or high power but poor towing mpg turbo V8s from all of the German brands now & since 2015> MY.



Cheers!
Tom
///////

Our MDX is a 2011 and has the 3.7 L V6 with 300 hp. and does take premium fuel. Acura changed to the 3.5 L with the 3rd generation maybe for better fuel economy? I usually manually shifted with the paddle shifters and kept it in 4th gear at 4000-4300 rpm. Max torque is at 4500 rpm. It sounds like a high rpm but it seemed quite happy at that rpm and no overheating (has transmission cooler), and that would take us down the highway about 70-73 mph. If we had a grade, say 5-6%, then we would drop into 3d gear and travel about 50-55. If we just used the sport mode it didn't hunt gears and usually ran in 4th or 5th gear. We have a 6 speed transmission. Steep grades of 8-10% with switchbacks does require 2nd gear at times, both up and down esp for saving your brakes, when we were on route 33 through West Virginia and Virginia and occasionally on hwy 101. The MDX never seem to labor and had decent acceleration if we kept the rpm’s higher. VTEC would kick in and we would get moving. With the newer MDX’s we’re not sure it would do as well?

Steve

[TRIPPPIN]

Originally Posted by Tom_T

Dan -


Well the TDI V6 diesel & normally aspirated V8s are gone from the Porsche, Audi & VW made SUVs.


The Cayenne S since 2015 has been the 3.6L V6 TT as used in the Macan (a lighter vehicle), & you now can only get a V8 in the Cayenne Turbo or Turbo S flavors at a much higher price point.



No V8s at all from VW & Audi!



MBZ is the same with the GLE (formerly ML) - unless you go to the AMG TT V8.



Not sure about BMW X5 V8s now.



A very limited German mid-sized SUV field for us Trailerites anymore!



Cheers!
Tom
///////

There are some new V8s in the 2019 BMW X5, X7 and the 2020 Mercedes GLE 580 coming this fall.

[bbandeddie]

Originally Posted by Tom_T

).



The equivalent Honda Pilot/Ridgeline was at the bottom of the list in a towing test of some auto show I watched recently, & I have another vintage trailer buddy who had a 2010-13-ish prior style Ridgeline with the same problems on moderate to steep grade - slow going.

Cheers!
Tom
///////

We tow our 2014 27FB Eddie Bauer with our 2017 Ridgeline with no issues. Just returned this week from a five and half month tour from Ontario to the bottom of Baja and back - 19000km total. The winter before we went Ontario to Arizona and back.

I’ve never had an acceleration issue or issue climbing hills. A couple times climbing grades I’ve had people pull in front of me and knock us from 60 back to 40mph but once they were out of the way no issues getting back to 60 lickety-split.

Pure towing mileage averaged 12.25mpg last winter and 12.5mpg this winter (as defined by records kept in Road Trip of pump receipts going pump-to-pump with trailer attached - 11000 of 19000km) The fuel consumption improvement is mostly due to the lower speed limits (and maybe the ethanol free fuel) in Baja.

The only time I faced an issue accelerating was in Arkansas but it turned out that the grade on that hill varied between 20 and 30%. With a hairpin in the middle of the hill lack of speed wasn’t much of an issue, 30mph was plenty fast enough.

Highway driving mostly in fifth, sometimes fourth. With a headwind, mostly fourth. The Ridgeline just purrs along. VTEC doesn’t engage until about 5300rpm which we rarely hit.

I dunno. I guess it’s all about expectations. The Ridgeline has been excellent for us and we really appreciated it’s smaller size and tight turning radius in Mexico!!!

[jaybauman]

Originally Posted by SteveNdebbie

With the newer MDX’s we’re not sure it would do as well?

I previously owned a “newer MDX” with the 9-speed ZF transmission. I never towed with it, but it seemed like you could find a gear to your liking (whether it be fuel economy, HP, or torque) at any speed. It might tow your trailer quite well.

[SteveNdebbie]

Originally Posted by jaybauman

I previously owned a “newer MDX” with the 9-speed ZF transmission. I never towed with it, but it seemed like you could find a gear to your liking (whether it be fuel economy, HP, or torque) at any speed. It might tow your trailer quite well.

The MDX is my wife’s vehicle and she shared the driving on out trip. She is 4’10” and she can get in a comfortable driving position, and I can hit the driver 2 button for it to self adjust to my settings. When it comes time we may look at newer MDX’s since the other options are pretty expensive. We tend to buy vehicles that are about two years old at the time purchase. In 2011 the towing package with the extra transmission cooler was standard but now it’s an option. The Honda Pilot may get a look too, and even though Andy Thompson said that the Honda Odyssey is the best in towing among the Pilot, Ridgeline and Odyssey my wife said no way to having a minivan again. We really do like the MDX for everyday driving (minus the fuel economy). I think I did hear there has been a little dip in the reliability of the newer models?

[jeffmc306]

Originally Posted by TouringDan

I went to the Audi dealer a while ago to have a warranty item taken care of my wife’s Audi A3. While I was there I looked at some Audi SUV’s to check out the payload numbers.

The first was an Audi SQ5. The payload was 1,058 lbs.Attachment 339167Attachment 339168
The next was an Audi Q7. The payload was predictably larger at 1,323 lbs.Attachment 339169Attachment 339170
The last was an Audi Q8. I was surprised at the low payload rating of only 1,102 lbs.Attachment 339171Attachment 339172

I then stopped at a Jaguar dealer. The Jaguar F-Pace is a beautiful SUV with a tow rating of 5,290 lbs, enough to tow my 66 Tradewind. The payload is a dismal 826 lbs.Attachment 339175Attachment 339176


It looks like my dream TV is still the Cayenne S.

Dan

Dan, our 2016 Touareg TDI had a payload of 1180# and 7700# towing. Axle ratings were pretty good too: Front: 2976#, Rear: 3439#. It towed our FC23FBT easily and got 16 MPG, 28 without the trailer. We’d still have it but we moved up to a 27’ GT.

[out of sight]

Originally Posted by TRIPPPIN

There are some new V8s in the 2019 BMW X5, X7 and the 2020 Mercedes GLE 580 coming this fall.

These were all great tow vehicles but I'm afraid the allure is now gone since they have eliminated the diesel engines.

[TouringDan]

Originally Posted by out of sight

These were all great tow vehicles but I'm afraid the allure is now gone since they have eliminated the diesel engines.

I am a big fan of the Porsche Cayenne with the turbocharged V6 gas motors. I like these specs for the 2019 Cayenne S:

406 ft-lbs of torque @ 1,800-5,500 rpm
18/23 mpg
7,700 Lb towing capacity
4,454 lbs curb weight, 6,261 lbs GVWR- max load 1,807 lbs

Dan

[out of sight]

The gassers are getting better, that's for sure. Not quite up there yet to challenge a diesel as a tow hog.

When I was young I wanted my max torque at 7000 RPM. Now I like to chug along at 1500 RPM.

[TouringDan]

Originally Posted by out of sight

The gassers are getting better, that's for sure. Not quite up there yet to challenge a diesel as a tow hog.

The Cayenne S is a much better TV than the Touareg was IMHO. It has the same low end torque plus high end torque that gives it 434 hp versus the 225 hp of the Touareg. It also weighs 700 lbs less giving it 700 lbs more payload. The Touareg only is better in fuel economy- 28 versus 23 highway.

Dan

[thewarden]

The Cayenne Turbo S is the top of the heap, 570 HP and 590 TQ @ 2500 rpm. While the diesel was awesome, it does not hold a candle to the Turbo V8 in any category except mileage. And given the price of diesel fuel (more expensive than premium), probably not that much more to operate per mile.

[HappyHapgood]

My wife and I are towing a 2015 28’ Landyacht that is a complete pig weight-wise, with our 2016 Cayenne Diesel. The CD is a towing beast. I’m not going to admit how much overweight we might be relative to the Porsche spec, but we are well within the GROSS COMBINED weight. We typically tow with two bikes on the back of the airstream and a third bike and other junk in the back of the Porsche. Out tongue weight is, well, heavy. We use an Equalizer hitch and a LOT of weight transfer to keep within the CDs axle limits.

But the end result? About 12000 miles of towing experience with a lot of that in California hills and mountains. It tows like an absolute dream. ROCK solid. Zero even hint of sway at 70 mph with cross winds and tractor trailers passing.

About 3 weeks ago I had a seriously scary situation where I was driving about 60 miles per hour and a car to my right - about equal with my right front fender and driving 20 mph slower than I was... swerved into my lane. I hit the brakes and turned VERY aggressively to the left. Result: I won’t claim that I didn’t know the trailer was back there, but it was very solid. Zero sway and darn impressive handing.

Power is good. Transmission is 8-speed awesome. 65 to 70 mph is typically 8th gear if flat and even headwind. Hills might shift to 7th or even 6th if moderately steep, or the steepest of the steep might go to 5th gear. But it will easily hold 70mph up any hill we have encountered from NC through the south, Texas, New Mexico, Arizona, California and Oregon.

Positives: it isn’t an F250/350 Diesel, but it is a beast. And it is smooth, quiet and very refined. And fun to drive when unhooked (which we do often and then head out on trails and into the back country... or often tow the airstream deep into back country). 4 wheel drive confidence. 15 mpg towing at 65 or 14 at 70.

Downsides? There are a few. First, it does not have a ton of storage room. I certainly would like to be able to carry more in the car. But I don’t want a truck and not even sure I want something big like an Escalade/Navigator. Second, i don’t mind diesel (have another diesel car at home) but for equal power I’d rather have gas and eliminate the diesel nasty pumps and occasional challenge of finding a station. The thing absolutely guzzles DEF fluid and Porsche put the filler in an idiotic place... inside the car UNDER the rear floorboard. So EVERYTHING has to come out of the vehicle to add DEF... INCLUDING the spare tire! And I’m adding DEF about every 2000 miles.

But... another of the absolute BEST parts of the car? The warranty. After dieselgate Porsche effectively extended the warranties and it includes BUMPER to BUMPER for five years from NOW!! Talk about worry free towing!

[out of sight]

I agree. I have a 3.0 liter Mercedes and the power and smoothness is awesome. I test drove the new F-150 3.0 liter diesel thinking it would be the same but was noisy, rough, and powerless in comparison. Finally I went to a 6.7 Cummins. Not nearly as refined as the Mercedes but you get the feeling you're sitting on an industrial powerhouse. Different feeling but good in its own right.