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Old 08-21-2021, 07:45 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fungus View Post
......


Anxious to see the payload capacity of the F-250.
Hi

I think you can make a pretty good guess based on the trim level and the major options. Diesel is a big payload hit.

If it's gas powered and a King Ranch / Platinum + full up tow packages, something just under 3,000 pounds is a pretty good bet.

Bob
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Old 08-25-2021, 09:13 AM   #42
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I have a 2019 International 30’. Pulled by a 2019 Expedition Max and when towing I use premium fuel. Best combination I’ve ever had. Been towing for 40 years. But if I were to change anything it would be to get an F150 1/2 ton and still with the eco boost. 400 hp and 500 torque.
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Old 08-25-2021, 09:44 AM   #43
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2000 30' Excella
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Get the 3/4 ton Duramax

Get the 3/4 ton GMC Denali. You can be comfortable and safe towing. A true luxury truck that looks and rides great. Mine is like a Cadillac with all the comfort options. You will never have problems with control of your rig and you will be safe.
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Old 08-25-2021, 09:59 AM   #44
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Tow Vehicle

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Originally Posted by TankerIP View Post
I am just starting to research this Tow Vehicle forum. We are thinking about replacing our '09 Ram Diesel - tough to do but maybe necessary. And, now the dilemma: 1/2 ton gas vs 3/4 ton diesel (or gas?). We now have a 2019 FC 25RB, I think wt is about 7000#. Apparently there are some 1/2 ton gas options that will pull our 25'. I'm just started going through posts. Interesting stuff to consider. A new diesel engine is easily a $10,000 upcharge over a comparable gas. And what about costs of driving diesel vs gas? We live in Texas so flat land driving is the norm. But we like to go west now and then and appreciate the way our diesel gets us up and over the occasional 9,000 feet. I guess my current mileage is low side of 14mpg.

Just pondering. Need to start looking at internet. Ford, GMC, Ram. And the pandemic -- I hear that's made truck buying worse?
Its hard to understand how the shift in Tow Vehicle from, say Chev Suburban type vehicles to Pick Up Trucks has happened. You mention that apparently there are 1/2 ton TV out there to tow your 25 footer.
Of course there are, they never left! We towed our 1989 AS 25 footer with a 2003 Chev Suburban 1500 (1/2 ton) Gas and could get 12-15 MPG at 70 +MPH. We would compare our MPG with other TVs, often 1/2 and 3/4 Ton Diesels, only to find they did do much better.
The last time I did Cost Comparison/Benefit between a Diesel vs Gas engine, you had to drive over 100,000 miles just to break even. At that time (10+ years ago) the cost difference of a Diesel Vehicle was around $8000.00. It didn't make much sense then and probably less now!Of course there are more Pick Ups that offer a Diesel than a SUV like a Suburban.
The trend to Big Ass Pick Up Tucks amazes me, I don't get it. The Tow Vehicle "King of the Road" was always the Suburban type vehicle!
We tow an Oliver Elite 2 with a GL450 which matches the Oliver's requirement perfectly. The last Rally we attended, we were the only non Pick Up Truck there and people were astonished that you could Tow with a SUV like our. IMO, the Car/Truck as well as the RV industries have done a job on everybody!
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Old 08-25-2021, 10:13 AM   #45
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I owned and operated an 18 wheeler and logged 3 million miles. As an owner of a big truck I educated myself as to what happens to an engine on the inside when it starts towing even light loads.
The question should never be, " can my truck tow this?". The real question should be, "What happens to my engine when I am towing?"
We could geek out and talk about cylinder head temperature and pressure, but I will just give you my two cents worth from the perspective of a retired pro driver, who is now an old fart towing a small Airstream with a gas burning Ford F150.
My truck pulls my little Airstream without trouble, BUT...because it's a gas burner it is causing more wear and tear on the V8 5.0 engine. The reason is because gas burners run hotter than, and at higher cylinder pressures than diesels.
I always tell people... yes your gas burner will pull, but the cost is lower fuel mileage and shorter lifespan of the engine. Diesel engines are made for pulling.
So...my rule is this for gas burners: whatever your tow capacity is...cut it in half... then stay away from mountains.
I already had my truck when I bought my trailer, so I will drive it until it's done. Then I am going to the F250 6.7 diesel... that way when I get the big trailer there isn't a problem.
I think it's always better to have more power than I need all the time rather than not.
Diesel's are significantly more expensive, but in my experience will save you money and worry over the long term.
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Old 08-25-2021, 10:20 AM   #46
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Parts. What's that to do with a new truck? Try buying a windshield. Supply chain disruptions everywhere and are coming home to roost.
Yes, SUV over pickup unless you need a pickup.
For towing, diesel over gas but how many miles towing a year?
1/2 ton diesel over 3/4 ton of either gas or diesel.
My choice, a 1997-8 Ram 2500 Cummins 12 valve with automatic, not a new one.
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Old 08-25-2021, 10:38 AM   #47
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I pull our 27FB Globetrotter with a 2020 Ram 1500 Eco-Diesel. Surprisingly, it pulls with ease under all conditions. Taken it across country a couple times, thru CO, ID and WY. Just a data point for you to consider.
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Old 08-25-2021, 10:53 AM   #48
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I’ve been reading truck wars threads for a long time and they never change much.

My experience with a 2007 5.7 liter Tundra is this—I have towed two different trailers weighing around 7,500 lbs loaded about 70,000 miles without problems. The Colorado mountain passes give it no trouble. I rebuilt the brakes at around 100,000 miles because towing is rough on brakes. One catalytic converter of 4 replaced, all 4 oxygen sensors, one stalk for wipers. With 135,000 miles runs like new. Suspension seems to be overbuilt as are other components. It uses lots of gas and most trucks do. Toyota reliability is well known and the older Toyotas were the best. I have never been stranded by a Toyota.

Electric and hybrid trucks are the future, but prices are too high now. New trucks are absurdly expensive and hard to find. Used trucks are also expensive, but a better deal now while we wait for electric and hybrid trucks to be more reasonable in price. It is good to be careful about weight and unless you and your passenger each weigh 400 lbs, you have two Newfoundland dogs in the back seat, carry a 4 wheeler in the truck bed and all of your clothes in the trailer along with a month’s food, a 1/2 ton works fine. There’s a myth that some diesel owners subscribe to—gas engines aren’t strong enough to tow trailers. That may have been true a generation ago, but the 5.7 L. engine is a beast. If you really need a truck soon, look for a 5 year old Tundra and you’ll be good for years.
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Old 08-25-2021, 10:53 AM   #49
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Hi

Given the enormous range of payloads out of all manufacturers *and* the variation in extra stuff brought along: We no longer are in a world where "150/1500" has a clear cut meaning compared to "250/2500" or to "350/3500". There is a gigantic amount of overlap. You would need to bore down into the fine print on each example to really know what is being referred to.

Are there differences? Of course there are.. This isn't saying there are no differences, only that the overlap really makes sorting difficult.

Bob
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Old 08-25-2021, 11:14 AM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobbo View Post
3/4 ton. Gas or diesel is your preference. The $10,000 premium at purchase will be mostly recovered on resale. The higher cost of maintenance will not be, but is offset by higher mpg.
Strong 2nd to this and would go a bit farther in fact, especially if you maintain the truck yourself. I have a small fleet at work and replace them every 4 to 6 years. The residual value at resale for a HD Diesel will beat a gasser hands down, every time by 15%+. And unless you time the purchase poorly or pay sticker (current bizzare sales environment aside) a 1/2 ton ends up costing more over the life of the vehicle in my experience unless you buy a bone stock 1/2 ton and put very few miles on it (and even then not always) and it will be less capable.

Driving a 1 ton or 3/4 ton is no more difficult than a 1/2 ton... biggest hassle is waiting for the only diesel pump at each island. Just my 2¢
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Old 08-25-2021, 01:14 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mollysdad View Post
The compromise that everyone faces is "a 1/2 ton with not much payload vs a 3/4 ton with lots of payload and initial cost, but is harder to get in/out, park, live with."
I was faced with the same dilemma 5 years ago but with a size smaller trailer...I have a 22 ft 5000lb GVWR airstream. I went with the GMC 1/2 Ton with Max Trailering Package which ups the GVWR which ups the payload... mine has north of 1800 lbs as built (SLT 4 dr, short box) which works for me. I was just looking on the GMC site and they have increased the payload to a max 2,285lbs for a 1/2 ton truck depending on how you build it out. Yea... not as much as a 3/4 ton but maybe enough. I went with 6.2L gas... pulled over the rockies a couple times... no problem.

Now my opinion concerning your situation... I believe that the GMC with Max Trailering Package will work just fine for you and your 25 ft trailer... any bigger and I would go with a 3/4 ton (i prefer gas... diesel not worth the buy in cost to me)
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Old 08-25-2021, 01:50 PM   #52
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Gaining 15% at sale of a diesel is deceptive because that extra money to buy it could be earning money as an investment. The longer you keep the diesel, the more you could
earn. Since one of the things diesel proponents say is that they last a very long time, you won’t be getting that 15% any time soon. The time value of money principal is that money in hand is worth more than money you may get sometime in the future (inflation is part of that factor, but also money you don’t have can’t be used to earn money). While the diesel may last hundreds of thousands of miles, will the container (the truck) last that long? Alleging a gas truck will cost more over the years compared with a diesel is another reason promoted by diesel fans, but initial cost outweighs repairs for at least some gas trucks. As noted, our Tundra has had few repairs—costing about $1,000, or $71.43/year (a tank of gas when we’ve filled most of the tank). Toyota used trucks get a premium because of their reliability and when the time comes, I am sure a contractor would be glad to have it as a work truck.
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Old 08-25-2021, 04:20 PM   #53
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Ditto to what Jeff mentioned. I have a 2021 Ram 2500 6.4L Hemi like his except 2wd. Ordered 2/25/2021, received it 5/28/2021. 3 months and 3 days. Was told 7 to 8 weeks. The diesel was $9,500. extra. My 10 year savings in fuel cost was $3,043. gas as opposed to diesel. Plus less maintenance cost. But, "to each his own". Good luck what ever you decide.
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Old 08-25-2021, 05:54 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeinca View Post
Great post and perspective.

I'll put aside the fact that I've towed a 25' Airstream with an F150 and a diesel F250 and, hands down, much prefer towing with the F250. Instead, I'll just focus on the fact that I love my diesel Platinum model. Effortless power for any situation and all the creature comforts I could ask for, which my wife and I really appreciate on a long trip. Driving this truck is just a pleasure.

Will I recover the extra expense of the fancy trim and diesel? I guess I'll find out eventually but I almost don't care. I decided to pay for the experience and I'm really enjoying it.
+1

2021 F250 Diesel Platinum. 2671 payload. 21-22 mpg empty. 15 mpg towing 27’ GT.

I tow about 15% of the time. And my cost for gas, DEF, cetane, maintenance is running me about 19 cents a mile. I won’t recover the cost of the engine thru gas savings.

I used to tow same trailer with a F150 - 10 to 11 mpg. It’s gas/maintenance cost also ran me about 19 cents a mile.
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Old 08-25-2021, 07:14 PM   #55
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To each their own but I just arrived at Glacier Natl Park and must say I am loving my F250 6.7 diesel. While at Yellowstone I saw diesel .20 less than reg unleaded gas.
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Old 08-25-2021, 08:33 PM   #56
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Originally Posted by Capt who View Post
To each their own but I just arrived at Glacier Natl Park and must say I am loving my F250 6.7 diesel. While at Yellowstone I saw diesel .20 less than reg unleaded gas.
Capt who, but diesel is $3.25 & gas $2.99 at Valero in
Berlin, Maryland, that's 26 cents, which now a days diesel typically 20 to 30 cents higher nationwide.
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Old 08-25-2021, 08:39 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Capt who View Post
To each their own but I just arrived at Glacier Natl Park and must say I am loving my F250 6.7 diesel. While at Yellowstone I saw diesel .20 less than reg unleaded gas.


Just left there, I too love the 6.7 just a little more payload . F350

And re fuel costs my experience is fuel costs what it does. I don’t sweat the small stuff. Assuming diesel was 0.20 per dollar more everywhere (which it’s not) at you ran 15000 miles @ 14 mpg the total excess would be about $200. If that’s a make or break in your decision great. Not mine. I’d much rather have the 1000 ftlbs of torque especially in the mountains out west. And let’s not forget the engine brake going down.
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Old 08-26-2021, 09:42 AM   #58
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Originally Posted by sctinman44 View Post
Capt who, but diesel is $3.25 & gas $2.99 at Valero in
Berlin, Maryland, that's 26 cents, which now a days diesel typically 20 to 30 cents higher nationwide.
Hi

If you are lucky enough to live in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania ( all hail William Penn ) :

They have "fiddled" the tax on diesel so that driving down to Maryland saves quite a bit of money on a fill up. Figure another 20 cents a gallon "premium" for diesel over regular cheap-o gas at current prices.

We see zero fuel cost savings at the PA prices. (and yes, I do have a diesel truck ....).

Bob
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Old 08-28-2021, 12:38 AM   #59
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10,000# as?

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Towing a 10,000 pound 30' ……
Bob
Why does your 30’ AS weigh 10,000# ?
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Old 08-29-2021, 07:44 AM   #60
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Why does your 30’ AS weigh 10,000# ?
Hi

Max weight loaded, per the AS spec on the trailer. I'd suggest that's the target you should use looking at any lash up.

Bob
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