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Old 09-13-2020, 01:54 PM   #1
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I'm enjoying the tow vehicle debates...

I'm pretty new to this site, although I've towed many trailers with a variety of tow vehicles of the years. I must say that I've found the debates on this site informative, but also quite amusing at times.

On one side of the argument, there are the people who aggressively argue that you can tow a Classic 33 FB with a Buick Encore, with no problem whatsoever. The Classic has a dry weight of 8,261 lbs. and a hitch weight of 1,175 lbs. The Encore has a max payload capacity of 1,018 lbs. and isn't recommended for towing. No matter, there will be somebody who argues that it's more than enough with a weight distribution hitch, and they've towed this exact combination over 50,000 miles over extreme mountain passes.

On the other side of the argument, there are the people who argue that an F350 Super Duty with a payload capacity of 7,850 lbs. and a max towing capacity of 37,000 lbs. will struggle to pull a Bambi 16RB with a dry weight of 3,000 lbs. and a hitch weight of 430 lbs. They'll argue that they've seen people struggle with this combination, and they need to consider an even bigger truck.

The thing that I find amusing is how strongly people feel about this topic. When you ask for opinions on an Internet forum, you'll most certainly get them. And you may not agree with them! I'm not directing this at any specific person or post, I'm just pointing it out as a general observation. My examples above are clearly exaggerated for effect, but they aren't that far from some of the things that I've seen here!

I think the debate centers on one major thing: risk tolerance. Some people are more conservative, and they want to stay within the recommendations of the manufacturer of their tow vehicle and their trailer. They don't want to push the limit. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that approach. Some people are more comfortable pushing or exceeding the limits, as they feel that the published limits are overly conservative. There's nothing wrong with that either, to a point.

This post is really just an early observation, including some Sunday afternoon babbling as I watch some NFL football. I find this site very useful and informative, and I love the entertainment value. Keep it up Air Forums!
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Old 09-13-2020, 01:57 PM   #2
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Talking

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Originally Posted by Dennis C View Post
. . .
The thing that I find amusing is how strongly people feel about this topic.
. . .
You might want to check out all the Tire threads . . .

https://www.airforums.com/forums/f438/

. . . or The Argue Thread:

https://www.airforums.com/forums/f16...ead-60297.html

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Old 09-13-2020, 02:01 PM   #3
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Nice, thanks. I'll check those out!
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Old 09-13-2020, 02:25 PM   #4
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Cannot ignore hitch threads either.
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Old 09-13-2020, 02:40 PM   #5
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First rule of Fight Club: Don't talk about Tow Vehicles...unless you really want to fight!
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Old 09-13-2020, 02:58 PM   #6
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I think for the few who are informed and understand the dynamics of towing it is largely a debate about risk tolerance as you suggest, but for most who choose to push the OEM towing limit guidance it is born out of ignorance or misunderstanding of the nature of towing stability and the meaning of the limits.

I find these people don't understand, don't want to understand and therefore can't get their mind around the idea that their chosen tow vehicle is not and cannot be designed to do everything better than some vehicle they consider substandard even though the vehicle they consider substandard is designed to tow larger trailers than theirs. In short, I find it is a combination of blissful ignorance, self deception and narcissism.
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Old 09-13-2020, 03:16 PM   #7
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Quote:
On one side of the argument, there are the people who aggressively argue that you can tow a Classic 33 FB with a Buick Encore, with no problem whatsoever. The Classic has a dry weight of 8,261 lbs. and a hitch weight of 1,175 lbs. The Encore has a max payload capacity of 1,018 lbs. and isn't recommended for towing. No matter, there will be somebody who argues that it's more than enough with a weight distribution hitch, and they've towed this exact combination over 50,000 miles over extreme mountain passes.

On the other side of the argument, there are the people who argue that an F350 Super Duty with a payload capacity of 7,850 lbs. and a max towing capacity of 37,000 lbs. will struggle to pull a Bambi 16RB with a dry weight of 3,000 lbs. and a hitch weight of 430 lbs. They'll argue that they've seen people struggle with this combination, and they need to consider an even bigger truck.
I know, isn't it a fun read! I do not understand why people get so upset though. A forum or any social media site, is a place for people to post their opinion. Heaven forbid we be monitored to only say a certain thing like some topics of late on certain other sites (responsible clean talk of course). I do find it amusing when people post about towing with vehicles not at all designed for towing. At my school a married couple, coworkers, bought a new trailer and a new Honda Odyssey in 2005. They drove the Odyssey a few months to break it in and spent a couple thousand having a special hitch put on it to tow. They headed out to Yellowstone from southwest Florida. I was told their transmission burned up and they had to buy a different rig. They ended up with a Leprechaun class C motorhome and loved it but, the lesson was an expensive one. The dealers both told them all would be fine.
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Old 09-13-2020, 03:22 PM   #8
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Itís a great conversation. I believe my X5 or my F-350 Super Duty Powerstroke will tow any airstream from point A to point B. But there are a lot of circumstantial variables along the way which make one better than the other at times.
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Old 09-13-2020, 07:16 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by Dennis C View Post
Some people are more comfortable pushing or exceeding the limits, as they feel that the published limits are overly conservative. There's nothing wrong with that either, to a point.
The problem is that for some people, that "point" is far beyond where they are endangering other people on the road.
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Old 09-14-2020, 08:49 AM   #10
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I'm enjoying the tow vehicle debates...

In light of the fact TVís & Airstreams are so expensive itís not surprising that people feel as strongly as they do about the combination in which theyíve invested. Weíve literally voted with our pocketbooks.
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Old 09-14-2020, 09:10 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by GCinSC2 View Post
Cannot ignore hitch threads either.
^2 the hitch threads are the very best. All you have to do is throw out a (slightly) controversial comment and sit back with the popcorn. 😂
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Old 09-14-2020, 10:00 AM   #12
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Yep ... you can tow an AS with a bicycle or a Mac Truck what ever works for you. Just let me know so I can be somewhere else...
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Old 09-14-2020, 10:45 AM   #13
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The problem is that for some people, that "point" is far beyond where they are endangering other people on the road.
Yeah, some people define that point differently than others.
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Old 09-14-2020, 11:08 AM   #14
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And just like that, a thread about towing threads has become a towing thread!
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Old 09-14-2020, 11:12 AM   #15
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This video is what drives all of my conversations when it comes to tow vehicles:

I have an Excursion, but with the help of this forum and the Ford Truck Enthusiasts forum, I have been able to build a solid platform for towing. The biggest takeaway from this forum, for me, has been top speed. Thanks to all of you, and this video, I will not go over 65 mph.
Everytime I click on one of these posts, I learn something. You guys have been very helpful!
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Old 09-14-2020, 11:32 AM   #16
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In short, I find it is a combination of blissful ignorance, self deception and narcissism.
If it is a multiple choice, I choose blissful ignorance. Nothing better than to not know what is going on, unless of course if it bites you in butt.

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Old 09-14-2020, 11:42 AM   #17
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If it is a multiple choice, I choose blissful ignorance. Nothing better than to not know what is going on, unless of course if it bites you in butt.

Mike
I choose D--None of the above. Over-eager and under-informed tow vehicle sellers and over-eager and, well, over-eager RV sellers enthusiastically claim "Heck yeah, it'll tow it just fine! Sign right here. Want an extended warranty with that?"

In the immortal words of the late, great POTUS 40: "Trust, but verify"
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Old 09-14-2020, 12:11 PM   #18
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And just like that, a thread about towing threads has become a towing thread!
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Old 09-14-2020, 02:53 PM   #19
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Other side of the coin.
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Old 09-14-2020, 03:05 PM   #20
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I was actually considering writing up "The Definitive Tow Vehicle Thread" with many of your points but you beat me to it!!
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