Idle or Shut down your diesel when stopped

[Msmoto]

As one who pulls with a 2008 Dodge/Cummins diesel, I have had some concerns when pulling into a stop, e.g., for fuel, or other, as to whether I should shut down the diesel, and risk burning up the turbocharger due to the high heat and no oil circulation when shut down. This effect is even more severe with the newer DEF utilizing diesels as they run higher combustion temperatures, thus higher exhaust temps.

The solution is to allow the engine to idle when stopped for any reason. Of course, one can sit in the truck for five minutes idling while the turbo cools and oil is circulated, or to simply go in and arrange fuel payment, leaving the truck unlocked and idling.....not a good idea IMO.

So, locking the vehicle while engine is idling....cannot be done unless one has a remote start installed, about $350 expense by two installers.

Oh, wait.....I have discovered a way to leave the key in the ignition, the engine idling, yet lock the doors of my Dodge. And, here is the secret.

When idling, unlock the doors with the driver door unlock button on the armrest, open and close the door, then re-lock the doors with the armrest button. Using the remote will not work, this must be done manually with the door electric locking button on the armrest.

Then, using the actual mechanical door lock knob on the door near the sill, unlock the driver's door. Open, exit the vehicle, close the door, then re-lock using the key in the key hole on the door.

Viola, you now have the engine running, doors locked, and can do your necessary business as usual, knowing the vehicle is secure and the turbo is being cooled by oil flow.

I just saved $350 and it works like a charm on my older Dodge.

Do not know if this will work on the more modern vehicles, but I suspect manually locking the door does not tell the computer the door is locked, thus we have fooled the anti lock device to prevent locking one's keys in the vehicle.

Comments?

[overlander63]

Why not just buy a normal spare key, and take it inside with you? The "real" key can stay in the truck, you can lock the doors, and use the spare key to unlock them. That key should cost less than $5.

[jcl]

If you are at the top of a long hill, and have been pulling at full load, then idling for 3-5 minutes before shutting down is a good idea. But if you are just driving on the highway, at typical light loads, then taking the off ramp and turning into the fuel stop is usually enough to cover 3 minutes. Turn it off at the pumps. You are wearing your engine faster than at load when idling. The myths about reasons to keep idling engines when stopped have been around for decades, and won't die.

Each jurisdiction will be different, but where I live, you get three minutes maximum idling before you can get a ticket, and leaving a vehicle locked with the engine running is reason for a ticket right away. Lots of places have similar anti-idling laws.

[tjdonahoe]

JCL is right, No Idleing , it is hard on the engine....

[Bill M.]

I sometimes remember to worry about the turbocharger but usually I just forget and shut it down. Is synthetic oil more forgiving about shutting down without cooling the turbo? I do know that both going slow and idling seem to burn a lot of fuel in my truck.

[Wingeezer]

I always shut down when fueling.

If just finishing a heavy climb, I would let the truck ideal few minutes first, but otherwise I just shut it down right away and fuel.

Our diesel is now 7 years old and running just fine.

Brian.

[barts]

If I'm climbing hard and I pull off I'll let it cool down for a bit. Normally I just shut our 1996 PowerStroke off.... and we have 200+k miles on this truck.

These engines do use a water jacketed center bearing on the turbo from what I understand, so this helps prevent oil overheating.

- Bart

[Bob4x4]

Originally Posted by Msmoto

As one who pulls with a 2008 Dodge/Cummins diesel, I have had some concerns when pulling into a stop, e.g., for fuel, or other, as to whether I should shut down the diesel, and risk burning up the turbocharger due to the high heat and no oil circulation when shut down. This effect is even more severe with the newer DEF utilizing diesels as they run higher combustion temperatures, thus higher exhaust temps.

The solution is to allow the engine to idle when stopped for any reason. Of course, one can sit in the truck for five minutes idling while the turbo cools and oil is circulated, or to simply go in and arrange fuel payment, leaving the truck unlocked and idling.....not a good idea IMO.

So, locking the vehicle while engine is idling....cannot be done unless one has a remote start installed, about $350 expense by two installers.

Oh, wait.....I have discovered a way to leave the key in the ignition, the engine idling, yet lock the doors of my Dodge. And, here is the secret.

When idling, unlock the doors with the driver door unlock button on the armrest, open and close the door, then re-lock the doors with the armrest button. Using the remote will not work, this must be done manually with the door electric locking button on the armrest.

Then, using the actual mechanical door lock knob on the door near the sill, unlock the driver's door. Open, exit the vehicle, close the door, then re-lock using the key in the key hole on the door.

Viola, you now have the engine running, doors locked, and can do your necessary business as usual, knowing the vehicle is secure and the turbo is being cooled by oil flow.

I just saved $350 and it works like a charm on my older Dodge.

Do not know if this will work on the more modern vehicles, but I suspect manually locking the door does not tell the computer the door is locked, thus we have fooled the anti lock device to prevent locking one's keys in the vehicle.

Comments?

Your truck is not secure while it is running with the key in it,it would take seconds to get inside and driveaway,With the remote start it will turn the engine off if a driveaway with out the key in place

[Rawn77]

I have a '15 Duramax. I leave it idling with the key in it all the time; got to keep the dog cool. I lock the doors with a second key/remote. I always have two sets of keys/remotes in the truck. I'd rather someone be pissed at me for idling rather than my dog be uncomfortable; God forbid heat up in the truck with the windows slightly open. I think most people realize that there's a dog in the truck with the AC running. I've never had any incident with the idling.
BTW I use an Edge CTS scanner to know when I'm in regen mode; so to leave the engine running till the temps go down (regen will cancel when in Park)

[Knuff]

Idling an engine is a waste of fuel, makes you look bad to others who don't understand your reasoning, and I believe that it is not needed. The TC design should compensate for hot shutdowns. I would check with Cummins or your Dodge repair shop whether your theory is correct, I doubt it.

[cabinetmaker]

I'm a old dieselhead. Been pulling heavy with Ram Cummins diesels for years. Let her cool down. If you check your manual it has cool down times. My new 2015 Ram 3500 duelly does and my old ones did too. This isn't old school hearsay. It's important to your engine and turbo. Don't believe me just google it.

It helps if you will raise the idle. Just turn on your cruise control and hit the set button. Idle will jump up a couple hundred rpm. Hit the plus button to raise it even more.

If your going to be idle for over a few minutes raise it. Much better for the engine. Even if your only idle for a few raising it will kick the fan in and cool things down quicker.

Now I'm talking about a working diesel here. Grocery getter's are not included. If I'm unhitched and running around town I don't bother with any of the above.

If yours has a oil temp guage (most newer ones do or you can get a scanguage II and access oil temp and much more through the OBD port) just keep a eye on the oil temp. When temp goes down to what it normally runs when not towing it's safe to shut down.

[cabinetmaker]

Here you go. Direct from owners manual

stop and go / empty / idle time less than one minute

stop and go / medium load / one minute

highway speeds / medium load / two minutes

city traffic / max gcwr / three minutes

highway speeds / max gcwr / four minutes

uphill grade / max gcwr / five

I would vary that some depending on outside temp. If it's 100+ and I just pulled off the interstate pulling a load and pulled into a station I would go five or more myself just to be safe.

[robert claus]

Mercedes discourages long term idling of their diesels unless you get the "high idle" option, which raises the idle speed considerably. Long term idling can wreak havoc with the EGR valve, while the high speed idle keeps the engine temp up. I believe they are talking about idling for hours, though.

[wvstreamer]

I idle as well and least for a fuel stop/rest area. Only takes a few minutes. Good for the turbo and the dog in hot weather. Mine is an 02 7.3 F250 so may be kinda old school but old school works for me. The new trucks may have different needs for cooling. Idling for short stops has worked for nearly 30 years of diesels and never a turbo issue. I just think a few minutes for a working truck is being on the safe side. I also carry the extra key. So far so good.
Dave

[Ted S.]

I shut it down out of fear I will get grilled chicken instead of my Big Mac.

[NevadaGeo]

Watch your turbine temperature gauge, when it comes down to the safe temp, you can safely turn the diesel off.

[Msmoto]

Typically I will idle when I go in to pay for my fuel....about two to five minutes, head back to the trailer to use the facilities, again, two to five minutes.

Then, shut down when I add fuel, as this takes about 10 minutes or more.

And, from Cummins website:
http://www.cumminsturbotechnologies....Down_Large.jpg

Shut Down
Before shutting your engine down, let the turbocharger cool down. When an engine runs at maximum power/high torque, the turbocharger is operating at very high temperatures and speeds. Hot shut down can cause reduced service life which is avoidable by a minute or two of idling. Most mobile equipment applications include an adequate cooling period during parking or mooring procedures.

Engine Idle
Avoid running your engine for long periods in idle mode (greater than 20-30 minutes). Under idling conditions low pressures are generated in the turbocharger which can cause oil mist to leak past seals into the two end housings. Although no real harm is done to the turbocharger, as load is applied temperatures increase and the oil will start to burn off and cause blue smoke emission problems.

A note, my Dodge will not allow the vehicle to be locked via the remote if the engine is running, also, the lock button in the armrest of the driver's door will not lock the vehicle with engine running and door open, as one might do with engine off and to lock up for errands, etc.

If one were to open my door by breaking glass and attempting to enter the vehicle, the alarm goes off when doors are locked as in my OP.

Thanks for comments.

[Bob4x4]

Originally Posted by Msmoto

Typically I will idle when I go in to pay for my fuel....about two to five minutes, head back to the trailer to use the facilities, again, two to five minutes.

Then, shut down when I add fuel, as this takes about 10 minutes or more.

And, from Cummins website:
http://www.cumminsturbotechnologies....Down_Large.jpg

Shut Down
Before shutting your engine down, let the turbocharger cool down. When an engine runs at maximum power/high torque, the turbocharger is operating at very high temperatures and speeds. Hot shut down can cause reduced service life which is avoidable by a minute or two of idling. Most mobile equipment applications include an adequate cooling period during parking or mooring procedures.

Engine Idle
Avoid running your engine for long periods in idle mode (greater than 20-30 minutes). Under idling conditions low pressures are generated in the turbocharger which can cause oil mist to leak past seals into the two end housings. Although no real harm is done to the turbocharger, as load is applied temperatures increase and the oil will start to burn off and cause blue smoke emission problems.

A note, my Dodge will not allow the vehicle to be locked via the remote if the engine is running, also, the lock button in the armrest of the driver's door will not lock the vehicle with engine running and door open, as one might do with engine off and to lock up for errands, etc.

If one were to open my door by breaking glass and attempting to enter the vehicle, the alarm goes off when doors are locked as in my OP.

Thanks for comments.

The door can be opened by using a tool under the door handle and disarming the alarm in one fell swoop

[Bob4x4]

An issue not brought up yet is the harmful effects on the aftertreatment from idling time,you are adding extra soot load to the dpf.The dpf has a finite amount of soot capacity,it is burned down to ash during the regen process(using additional fuel)but you are reducing it 'snormal life.Not an issue if you trade off but for those that keep a vehicle over 100k it will be an extra expense.

[2trackrr]

For the sake of those of us who breath please shut it off