Ford F150 PowerBoost or F250 PowerStroke for 25FB?

[1StreamDream]

Originally Posted by davidrrand

1SD, good points! We are close to the limits when fully loaded and would like to bring along a small Honda ATV on our cross country treks. Thought we would trade up to
250/350 gas this spring but lack of supply and higher costs with covid and chip shortage killed that. Maybe next year and maybe the 7.3 gas! Would miss my F150 though. Sweet ride unhitched and economical. Hate the column shifter and lack of Auto fwd on super duties. What engine do you have?

Wow ... such good karma ... you are naming many of the specifics of my scenario

I upgraded to the F-250 w/ 7.3l "godzilla" plant, and I also got the 4.30 rear end gear. I don't regret a single thing about it, but I was hoping for just slightly better fuel economy. You might consider sticking with the 3.73 rear end gear to maximize that, although most of the stuff I have read on various on-line posts say the MPG difference is negligible. I love the "grunt" I have, and I am sure the 4.30 is part of that. The torque in the 7.3 is also a huge part of it. I have a 4x4 supercab this time, with 6-1/2ft bed. My payload sticker says something just over 2900lb ... so I gained about 1,000lbs of payload moving up from my F-150 to my F-250 The first 7k miles or so was really tough at the pump, expect a break in period where MPG suffers. Now that I am past that, I can get above 15mpg non-towing, on the interstate, doing 72mph or so. My towing MPG can be above 10, if mostly flatland, and I stay around 67mph or below. Hills obviously will make it worse, and fighting a headwind will also make it worse. I feel for all those who hoped to upgrade and are unable due to this chip shortage. I got my truck just in time as they say, I ordered mine, and I took delivery in early December of 2020 (it is a 2021 model truck). No question about it, the ride quality is not as good as the F-150, but its a truck, built for a purpose, and stiff springs come with the territory. Turning radius not quite as good either, but it is a towing beast. Fun to have all that power/torque at your feet. Best of luck to you in trying to secure one ...

I should have also stated that I have the factory de-rate to 10,000lb GVWR, to make my annual license cost a bit more economical. I suspect that might have reduced my payload number some ... not sure how much, but if you opt not to get that derate, I suspect you might gain even more payload.

[dlec123]

I tow our 2017 25’ signature with the F150, eco boost, no problems whatsoever.
Also, I am in PHX and one AC works fine.

[AZTinCan]

Originally Posted by dlec123

I tow our 2017 25’ signature with the F150, eco boost, no problems whatsoever.
Also, I am in PHX and one AC works fine.

A family member has a 25FB with single AC. Unless he finds decent shade or the temps are cooler, the single AC only cools down 15 degrees. That’s not nearly enough of a margin for us. He’s been kicking himself for not ordering the second AC for 4 years now.

[CRH]

A gas Super Duty works for me. My 25 ft is probably only about 6k lbs. With over 4k in available payload, I can carry about anything I want in the bed with no worries.

[jondrew55]

And while diesel is more expensive (at least here in Florida) it's nice to have 400 mile plus range with my 35 gallon tank. I'm almost tempted to to carry an extra 10 gallons in cans which would get me to around 500 miles which would be the max I'd ever want to drive in a day.

Originally Posted by Old Fart

I have a 2020 23BF GT and tow it with a F250 Power Stoke. I towed with a F250 gas TV, got 7-8 MPG. With the Diesel I get 13-14 MPG at 70 - 75 MPH. Have power to keep up with the speed limit going up into the mountains, 7000 feet above sea level. The reserve power makes a big difference when you need it.

[CWSWine]

Originally Posted by jondrew55

And while diesel is more expensive (at least here in Florida) it's nice to have 400 mile plus range with my 35 gallon tank. I'm almost tempted to to carry an extra 10 gallons in cans which would get me to around 500 miles which would be the max I'd ever want to drive in a day.

If you use diesel and fill up at truck stops you can get a TDS fuel card and get discounts like the truckers get. I normally fill at Petro and TA and get somewhere between .40 and .80 discount per gallon. I have been using this card for two years and saved me a lot of money and it is nice not having to deal with gas stations with questionable space.

https://www.tsdlogistics.com/services/fuel-program/

[numbakrrunch]

My experience: I have a 2020 F150 Ecoboost (non hybrid) and we have happily towed our 2021 FC 25RB up and down the east coast over the past year. I have a basic weight distribution hitch and curt sway control, nothing fancy, and we have some occasional sway but nothing major where I've had to hit the trailer brakes to stop sway. Power is fine. I do need to counteract steering input when getting passed by big trucks but it's not a big deal once you're used to it. I initially regretted not getting a 250 but now I'm glad I got a 150 when it comes to parking garages, etc. It may be windier where you tow but this was our experience.

[Daquenzer]

Originally Posted by 1StreamDream

Lots of valuable insights in that article and I totally agree about power, in that I always felt I had plenty of power, for my trailer anyway. Three things stick out in my mind as I re-read some sections and content. The first is the tail end of the final summary … “ just to satisfy an arbitrary number that does not actually matter when towing? “. Presuming his inference is 1/2 ton vs 3/4 ton as that number, I don’t agree that it is arbitrary. It conveys a great deal of initial information in regard to the more heavy duty nature of the frame and related critical components. The second is he spends a good deal of time describing upgrades to a 1/2 ton (shocks, tires, even mentions springs) to improve handling aspects to a stock 1/2 ton so in some cases he’s not comparing 1/2 to 3/4, he’s comparing a modified 1/2 to a 3/4. The third is he is digging pretty deep in detail, that’s a good thing, because all of those points are important. Tire ratings, axle ratings, tow ratings, etc. It should be a reminder to all of us that you can’t only look at the tow rating … or the hp rating on the power plant … or even the 1/2 vs 3/4 rating. All of it matters. I have had both 1/2 and 3/4 and towed the same (airstream) trailer with both. I have no argument at all with the fact that 1/2 ton trucks *can* do it, it’s just too close to the edge of comfort for me, and not enough payload margin for me, so I am solidly in the group that favors the 3/4 ton class vehicle as a towing platform.

A few modifications to an F150 are reasonable. For example I put on the roadmaster suspension to stabilize the ride. Cost $650. It is a big difference. I didn't change shocks or tires. Both of which would be far more expensive. I did however go to the 20" tires. That was a more expensive option. But it increased the rear axle weight rating significantly.

I think the point of the article is that you can get what you need in the F150 with a few mods. They aren't expensive. And you get a pickup that is easier to park, get into, and has a better ride.

As to the person about "being soft." I'm not going to spend a ton of money to feel tired from bouncing around when driving, deal with terrible gas mileage, and aggravating parking.

[CWSWine]

You can take an F150 Platinum with 1200 payload and put a 30 foot AS behind and be overloaded by a few hundred pounds. Put on a couple of aftermarket products and cover up the overweight problem and even not produce much of sway problem during normal driving. But when the rubber meets the road is when you top the hill and there is an accident in your lane with people just get out of their cars and you need to do a fast maneuver/lane change to avoid hitting them would you rather be in an overloaded F150 or one running right at the limits or an F250 with stiffer suspension with plenty of unused capacity. This happened to me with my previous AS and Ram 2500 and yes it was a non-event. I not only had to change lanes fast I even end up with driver-side wheels on the shoulder of the road.

PS If I had hit the car that was partway in the fast lane there was a father getting his kid our child seat in the back seat that I would hit.

[AZTinCan]

Originally Posted by CWSWine

You can take an F150 Platinum with 1200 payload and put a 30 foot AS behind and be overloaded by a few hundred pounds. Put on a couple of aftermarket products and cover up the overweight problem and even not produce much of sway problem during normal driving. But when the rubber meets the road is when you top the hill and there is an accident in your lane with people just get out of their cars and you need to do a fast maneuver/lane change to avoid hitting them would you rather be in an overloaded F150 or one running right at the limits or an F250 with stiffer suspension with plenty of unused capacity. This happened to me with my previous AS and Ram 2500 and yes it was a non-event. I not only had to change lanes fast I even end up with driver-side wheels on the shoulder of the road.

PS If I had hit the car that was partway in the fast lane there was a father getting his kid our child seat in the back seat that I would hit.

The wife will opt for option 2 all day long, even though she’d be able to handle the 150 far easier and enjoy it more. It was worth investing and posting. I liked the lower cost of the 150 and the ability to park it in my garage even more, but there will be less regrets and guesswork with the 3/4 ton.

[davidrrand]

Originally Posted by 1StreamDream

Wow ... such good karma ... you are naming many of the specifics of my scenario

I upgraded to the F-250 w/ 7.3l "godzilla" plant, and I also got the 4.30 rear end gear. I don't regret a single thing about it, but I was hoping for just slightly better fuel economy. You might consider sticking with the 3.73 rear end gear to maximize that, although most of the stuff I have read on various on-line posts say the MPG difference is negligible. I love the "grunt" I have, and I am sure the 4.30 is part of that. The torque in the 7.3 is also a huge part of it. I have a 4x4 supercab this time, with 6-1/2ft bed. My payload sticker says something just over 2900lb ... so I gained about 1,000lbs of payload moving up from my F-150 to my F-250 The first 7k miles or so was really tough at the pump, expect a break in period where MPG suffers. Now that I am past that, I can get above 15mpg non-towing, on the interstate, doing 72mph or so. My towing MPG can be above 10, if mostly flatland, and I stay around 67mph or below. Hills obviously will make it worse, and fighting a headwind will also make it worse. I feel for all those who hoped to upgrade and are unable due to this chip shortage. I got my truck just in time as they say, I ordered mine, and I took delivery in early December of 2020 (it is a 2021 model truck). No question about it, the ride quality is not as good as the F-150, but its a truck, built for a purpose, and stiff springs come with the territory. Turning radius not quite as good either, but it is a towing beast. Fun to have all that power/torque at your feet. Best of luck to you in trying to secure one ...

I should have also stated that I have the factory de-rate to 10,000lb GVWR, to make my annual license cost a bit more economical. I suspect that might have reduced my payload number some ... not sure how much, but if you opt not to get that derate, I suspect you might gain even more payload.

Glad you are enjoying your truck and that engine is intriguing. Thanks for the experiences you shared. My current truck is a Super Cab as well as my previous “99 F350 Powerstroke. That generation 7.3 diesel was simple, economical and dependable. Paltry in power compared to the current gen with only 235 hp and 500 lbs. torque but I never had any issues towing my 6000 lb. boat on the ball. Wife hated manual trans and lack of creature comforts, though. If things calm down next year may go with a Lariat F350 equipped similar to current F150 but Super Crew this time and the 7.3. No more payload considerations. Just hope those idiots in DC will quit spending money and people go back to work before inflation drives the price of gas up to $5! Retired on fixed income!

[uncle_bob]

Originally Posted by AZTinCan

A family member has a 25FB with single AC. Unless he finds decent shade or the temps are cooler, the single AC only cools down 15 degrees. That’s not nearly enough of a margin for us. He’s been kicking himself for not ordering the second AC for 4 years now.

Hi

Sitting here in the full sun in a 30' running only one A/C. It's 86 outside and 72 inside. The A/C is running about half the time right now. Yes, I'd have both turned on if the power post had a working 50A breaker .... It may hit 97 later today.

Humidity also counts a lot when looking at this stuff. Out in the desert with 10% RH an A/C can do amazing things. Right now, we're at 60% RH.

Bob

[Nosnurbs]

…will this work for towing the FC 25’ fbt? Or should we drag our new trailer home from the dealership and get busy actively looking for an F-250 or -350? The Airstream site says our trailer (due within the next month) has a hitch weight of 800lbs😳. We plan to go to the mountains once or twice a year but other than that, we’ll be doing weekend trips to state parks around AL/GA/FL most of the time.

[1StreamDream]

Originally Posted by Nosnurbs

…will this work for towing the FC 25’ fbt? Or should we drag our new trailer home from the dealership and get busy actively looking for an F-250 or -350? The Airstream site says our trailer (due within the next month) has a hitch weight of 800lbs😳. We plan to go to the mountains once or twice a year but other than that, we’ll be doing weekend trips to state parks around AL/GA/FL most of the time.

Your payload and axle rating numbers are right where my 2016 4x4 f150 was (5.0 gas v-8). I have a 25’ Rbt, and the #1 issue for my setup back then was that the f150 rear axle was overloaded, even though I was still under my payload limit. I was using an equalizer WD hitch, setup was good, just too much weight so I went up to the f250. I think folks say the fbt is heavier in the tongue than the rbt, so be very careful about that aspect.

[uncle_bob]

Originally Posted by Nosnurbs

…will this work for towing the FC 25’ fbt? Or should we drag our new trailer home from the dealership and get busy actively looking for an F-250 or -350? The Airstream site says our trailer (due within the next month) has a hitch weight of 800lbs😳. We plan to go to the mountains once or twice a year but other than that, we’ll be doing weekend trips to state parks around AL/GA/FL most of the time.

Hi

Best guess is that your 800 pounds dry weight will be over 1,000 pounds once you fully load the trailer for camping. That just seems to be how it works. Will it weigh this or will it weigh that dry? Who knows.

You will have a hitch and a shank. They will add something. Is that 200 pounds? It depends on what hitch and shank you buy.

Can you (alone) hop in the (empty) truck and tow the trailer all over the place? Sure. Nobody I've ever met weighs 700 pounds. You mention "we" so one would guess others will be along. Now we are into the grubby details of how many and indelicate questions about what they each weigh.

It's never about just the trailer. Not in the real world.

Once you get within a couple hundred pounds of the payload limit, you start each trip with a visit to the CAT scale. That gets really old really fast. After a few "back to the house to drop off ...." the crew starts to make plans for a mutiny.

As noted above, getting enough weight onto the front axle can be tricky. The WD setup that does that probably isn't going to be gentle to your trailer .... ( = all the heavy stuff gets loaded in the back ...).

In this market, I'd head over and see what sort of a deal various dealers will give you on a factory order / trade in. Used prices still are insane.

Bob

[Nosnurbs]

We’re at a dealership right now and the salesman is trying to sell us an F-150 3.5 ecoboost with max tow package, but the payload still shows 1952 lbs. Which number(s) do we go by?

[Fungus]

Originally Posted by Nosnurbs

We’re at a dealership right now and the salesman is trying to sell us an F-150 3.5 ecoboost with max tow package, but the payload still shows 1952 lbs. Which number(s) do we go by?

Maybe it comes down to how long your trips will be. If you’re a weekender who camps close to home, that nearly 2000# of payload is likely plenty. If you take long camping trips far from home, you’ll haul more gear, some of it parts, tools, and other contingencies. I’ve already mentioned on this thread what we went through with tow vehicles. On our current trip during the autumn months that started in north Texas but will go who knows where, we have the F-250 and its 3000# of payload. I packed a small air compressor to winterize the water system, just in case. I replaced a brake assembly 1000 miles from home a few months ago but had a heck of a time finding one I could buy along the way. So for this trip I’m carrying a set of spares and the impact driver. Close to home on a weekend trip, I’d remove the guts from the drum at the camposite then replace the assembly in my driveway. Then there’s the two cases of wine and other beverages that ride in the cab. Etc, etc.

The other thing about trips close to home is that the driving distance tends toward shorter and less tiring. Our first stop this trip was about eight hours of driving (should have been five hours but dumbo here forgot his wallet and didn’t discover it until 75 minutes from home). No problem. Six hours was a stretch with the F-150. It’s simply a different drive.

This is just my limited experience. Other folks make longer trips work with a half-ton tow vehicle.

[1StreamDream]

Originally Posted by Nosnurbs

We’re at a dealership right now and the salesman is trying to sell us an F-150 3.5 ecoboost with max tow package, but the payload still shows 1952 lbs. Which number(s) do we go by?

There is no single number that is a magic answer, all the critical numbers matter, the tow rating, tire rating, the hitch rating, tongue weight rating, axle rating, payload rating ... keep in mind that the salesman is trying to "sell" a product. You are the one that has to be the responsible party to make sure you are satisfied that whatever you are about to buy is a safe/responsible solution for your circumstance. My vote is you are best served by a heavier truck, but there are lots of opinions on this. It's ultimately your decision to make.

[Bobbo]

Originally Posted by Nosnurbs

We’re at a dealership right now and the salesman is trying to sell us an F-150 3.5 ecoboost with max tow package, but the payload still shows 1952 lbs. Which number(s) do we go by?

My F-150 3.5 EcoBoost with max tow package has a payload rating of 1895#. I am comfortable towing my FC23FB with a 6000# GVWR. That means I will have a max tongue weight (at 15%) of 900#. That leaves me almost 1000# for us and everything else. If I had a heavier Airstream, I would have gone with an F-250 or better for better payload.

[Woolecox]

Originally Posted by Nosnurbs

We’re at a dealership right now and the salesman is trying to sell us an F-150 3.5 ecoboost with max tow package, but the payload still shows 1952 lbs. Which number(s) do we go by?

My son has that same truck, 2018 model Crew Cab. He does a couple of hunting trips a year in the mountains towing a large covered trailer for tents and gear. He is headed to Colorado this coming weekend.

Once getting into the inclines, he says the turbo charger runs constantly. I don't know if these engines were really designed to have the blower gong full blast for long periods of time or not.

He has never reported any overheat issues but, his trailer is a lot less weight than what we are talking about with these airstreams. Something to consider.