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Old 05-19-2021, 08:49 PM   #21
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I think the truck is great. I commend Ford in their strategy to adapt, invest and evolve. Game changer. Range, more capabilities, etc.. will come over time. Evolution takes time. Consumer adoption takes time. This is a great and important step forward.

My late father was a professional photographer his entire life from the age of 18 until he retired in his late 60's. He was retiring just when digital cameras where starting coming out. I brought home a Nikon digital SLR camera I bought to show him when I was 19 or 20 or so (I traded in my trusty Minolta X700 35mm to buy it). It was 4 megapixel I think. I remember sitting at the kitchen table as he looked over the camera - he looked at me and said "This is amazing. This changes everything for photography."

Similar change is happening now with automotive. Only gets better from here.
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Old 05-19-2021, 09:57 PM   #22
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The toolbox range extender, if they offered it, would make sense as an aftermarket/dealer-install thing (dealer-install could still get that sweet sweet 7-year financing people seem to use these days...*cough*) so that it wouldn't have to be evaluated as part of the truck for EPA regs, but still seems like a stretch. It's a slick patent, though, with fuel, electronics engine and emissions contols all in one box. I don't think Ford has a small enough engine to make sense in it, though.
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Old 05-19-2021, 09:59 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by wulfraat View Post
I think the truck is great. I commend Ford in their strategy to adapt, invest and evolve. Game changer. Range, more capabilities, etc.. will come over time. Evolution takes time. Consumer adoption takes time. This is a great and important step forward.

My late father was a professional photographer his entire life from the age of 18 until he retired in his late 60's. He was retiring just when digital cameras where starting coming out. I brought home a Nikon digital SLR camera I bought to show him when I was 19 or 20 or so (I traded in my trusty Minolta X700 35mm to buy it). It was 4 megapixel I think. I remember sitting at the kitchen table as he looked over the camera - he looked at me and said "This is amazing. This changes everything for photography."

Similar change is happening now with automotive. Only gets better from here.
Hats off to your dad for seeing the benefit of the new technology. I’m a hobby photographer and I know a lot of people that rejected the idea of digital photography. But your dad was spot on, it changed photography for ever.
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Old 05-20-2021, 02:43 AM   #24
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The big reveal is tonight:
Good intro by Bill Ford, focusing on the future. Link should open up at 4:40: https://youtu.be/Yjisj5T0VqE?t=280
Gerald Kariem of the UAW 7:30: https://youtu.be/Yjisj5T0VqE?t=452
[Lightning in the middle here]
E-Transit van brief mention 26:00: https://youtu.be/Yjisj5T0VqE?t=1565

Well done, Ford.
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Old 05-20-2021, 02:57 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wulfraat View Post
I think the truck is great. I commend Ford in their strategy to adapt, invest and evolve. Game changer. Range, more capabilities, etc.. will come over time. Evolution takes time. Consumer adoption takes time. This is a great and important step forward.
. . .
Very well said!
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Old 05-20-2021, 02:59 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by Daquenzer View Post
https://www.caranddriver.com/ford/f-150-lightning

It was in a previous post that had a bunch of links that I read.
. . .
Thanks for the link.
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Old 05-20-2021, 04:50 AM   #27
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Very well said!
Agreed. It’s a good first step, but not something that I’d buy at this point. I was a bit underwhelmed by the specs.
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Old 05-20-2021, 04:59 AM   #28
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Agree with the others in that it is an important step forward. Great analogy by Wulfrat with the digital cameras. I too had one of the tiny 4 megapixel cameras when they first came out. I think the screen was not much bigger than a postage stamp. Now look where we are today. About the same time I had a flip cell phone. Taking pictures with it was unheard of. Imagine that. I don't think the future of RV-ing is in jeopardy. It will adapt like everything else has. Call me old fashioned but what I loved most about this reveal last night was that it is an American company leading this, and that this truck will be built in America!
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Old 05-20-2021, 05:03 AM   #29
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Bingo!

Well said.

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Old 05-20-2021, 07:21 AM   #30
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A *lot* of vocational trucks run 100-200 miles per day. Deliveries, parts runners, yard work, you need to move a couple things across town, this is perfect. Like the Airstream plant uses a couple JD's to move trailers around. Perfect candidate for electric. At least at first. As we learn, more things will become viable.

Long haul gets more complicated. Slide in battery packs? Fuel cells? New types of hybrids? It's all on the table.

There's enough installed base for hydrocarbons that gas/diesel won't dissappear all at once.
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Old 05-20-2021, 07:41 AM   #31
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Agreed. It’s a good first step, but not something that I’d buy at this point. I was a bit underwhelmed by the specs.
I want the electric to work...though underwhelmed as well. We need it to tow at least 250-300miles. Car & Driver estimates towing at the maximum will be <100 miles.
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Old 05-20-2021, 08:55 AM   #32
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I want the electric to work...though underwhelmed as well. We need it to tow at least 250-300miles. Car & Driver estimates towing at the maximum will be <100 miles.
And that is with the long-range battery that only gives you 300 miles! The kicker is if you follow Ford's E-mustang reviews, it charges 80% (240 miles) and then reduces the amperage to 12A. That would take an additional 4-5 hours to finish the charge to 300. So 240 is all the Ford lighting can do for now. Let us guess how far you can tow 8000 lbs Airstream down the road now! I doubt let than 100 miles.

That is at the $70,000 to 90,000 price point! But it is all good as this is Ford's first attempt at an electric truck. They just did not get in while Elon Musk was spending over a decade perfecting the technology. My money is on Tesla. Well, at least $100 deposit on the Cybertruck!

I own a Model 3 and it is a fantastic car. We've had no problems in 3 years. We charge mostly at home with 30 miles per hour of charge on a 50a circuit. Even Tesla will have issues when the Cyber truck comes out the beginning of next year. The charging stations are well designed and integrated with your car, but you still have to unhook your trailer to get into one.
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Old 05-20-2021, 09:16 AM   #33
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Hi

Ok, so you have this tool box gizmo ( or an outboard generator ). There's no free lunch here.

If you use 30 gallons of fuel driving X distance in a normal vehicle, you will put at lest that same amount of fuel into your tool box gizmo or generator. (fuel to generator to electricity to charger to battery is less efficient than fuel to motion down the road).

At least for my truck, you are up around 35 gallons of gas for a 350 mile trip. Gas, diesel or propane, that fuel is going to take up space and add weight ..... Getting that all rigged so that it isn't a PIA ... yikes .... Even if the range (and fuel) is half that, it still sounds like a challenge to rig up.

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Old 05-20-2021, 09:47 AM   #34
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People, including the commenter about boondocking, are forgetting about solar power. You can re-charge your truck at your campsite (you cannot fill up with gas at your campsite).

I am dismayed at how many people just want to list reasons it won't work instead of looking at the problem a different way. I am pretty sure that long-haul Airstream owners are not their target market for the near term. What is amazing is that a major manufacturer is announcing an electric pickup truck that will probably be a drop-in replacement for 80% of existing 1/2 tons given how they are used. Who would have bet on that ten years ago? It is incredible!
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Old 05-20-2021, 09:57 AM   #35
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People, including the commenter about boondocking, are forgetting about solar power. You can re-charge your truck at your campsite (you cannot fill up with gas at your campsite).

I am dismayed at how many people just want to list reasons it won't work instead of looking at the problem a different way. I am pretty sure that long-haul Airstream owners are not their target market for the near term. What is amazing is that a major manufacturer is announcing an electric pickup truck that will probably be a drop-in replacement for 80% of existing 1/2 tons given how they are used. Who would have bet on that ten years ago? It is incredible!
While I think there are a many good use-cases for electric vehicles (even electric F150s) I don't think solar charging while camping is going to be a game-changer anytime soon. A good solar suitcase is about 200W... let's say you have 2, for 400w. The long-range Mach-E has an 88 kWh battery pack (I'd expect the F150 pack to be bigger but this will do for now), so 400w at 100% efficiency would require 220 hours of sunlight for a full charge. Of course you never need the full charge, but you'd never get 100% efficiency either, and even if you're aiming the panels, the amount of energy you'll get out of them is lower early and late in the day, etc. It would take several days to get a useful amount of charge from portable panels.
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Old 05-20-2021, 10:07 AM   #36
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While I think there are a many good use-cases for electric vehicles (even electric F150s) I don't think solar charging while camping is going to be a game-changer anytime soon. A good solar suitcase is about 200W... let's say you have 2, for 400w. The long-range Mach-E has an 88 kWh battery pack (I'd expect the F150 pack to be bigger but this will do for now), so 400w at 100% efficiency would require 220 hours of sunlight for a full charge. Of course you never need the full charge, but you'd never get 100% efficiency either, and even if you're aiming the panels, the amount of energy you'll get out of them is lower early and late in the day, etc. It would take several days to get a useful amount of charge from portable panels.
Yes, I understand. But for the most part campgrounds (even boon docking) are likely not more than 30-40 miles from a town. I mean sure, you can come up with extreme situations where this won't work but for extreme situations there are people who take extreme measures (at least 800W of solar plus a pole with a blade to catch wind). At this early state I do not see these extreme cases as being a target market for any EV producer so it seems silly to even bring it up. I mean, did they pitch pulling a 5th-wheel across the country weekly and camping 100 miles from any town in their video?
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Old 05-20-2021, 10:52 AM   #37
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It seems no one remembers the Chevy Volt, all electric drive-train with a generator under the hood for extended range.
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Old 05-20-2021, 11:37 AM   #38
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10k tow rating, truck can actually weigh what's on the hitch and help with proper weight distribution, truck can weigh the loaded payload.

It really is a neat truck and I'm pretty far from being a Ford guy---BUT

300 miles I am assuming is not towing and if that is the case, it's just not gonna work. My guess is that the cost per kWh for batteries has not yet come low enough. The top of the line truck is $90k, so adding $10k in battery capacity to get another 100 miles, that might push it towing to 300 just doesn't yet seem in the cards. I was really thinking this would have come close to 400 miles given the real estate under the truck, but maybe someday.

....and yes I recall the Volt, I drive it every day as my daily driver.....it's a shame they didn't put that tech into a truck. In fact, Bob Lutz that shook GM to built it said afterward he thought they hit the wrong end of the spectrum.....IE taking a car that got decent MPG and making electric vs a truck that normally gets dismal MPG and made it the Hybrid. Still love my Volt, and perhaps one day that diesel pickup dream will be replaced by an electric pickup/SUV.....but not today, at least for me, not yet.
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Old 05-20-2021, 12:05 PM   #39
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"To every thing, there is a season"

Great electric tow vehicles will come in their time . . .
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. . .
As Mr. Miyagi said, " . . . learn to crawl before walk" . . .
. . .
. . . or . . . "first learn stand, then learn fly" . . . ---> https://youtu.be/r59VS4V2J-A?t=130
[This short video clip will open at the Crane Technique scene at 2:10 after the ads]

Full clip here:
[Click on the URL at the top to open Full Screen etc. options in a new tab/window/frame]

A great movie!

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Old 05-20-2021, 12:21 PM   #40
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I love the torque offered by EVs, and I think it will be a great thing in towing applications. Range and charging are the keys to success when towing with an EV. Trucks are nice because they have more room for a larger battery pack compared to cars, and this has the potential to create EV Trucks with long ranges as the battery technology improves. Throw in a few more years of development of the charging infrastructure around the country, and it will be a very compelling option.
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