Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 06-26-2012, 10:31 AM   #1
Rivet Master

 
2015 27' Flying Cloud
Portland , Oregon
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 569
Send a message via AIM to hhendrix Send a message via Yahoo to hhendrix
F250 diesel vs. F150 gas tow comparison

Not a scientific study here but observations for those interested.
We have almost completed our round trip from Portland, OR to Alaska. See our blog, http://tandhalaska2012.blogspot.com/. I have a 2009 27' Flying Cloud FB towed by a 2011 Ford F250 4WD diesel. We are traveling with friends and their 2007 19' Bambi towed by a 2011 Ford F150. He says his trailer is about 5,000 lbs and his truck is loaded. My AS probably weighs close to 9,000 lbs and my truck is loaded too.
I've been following him for about 5,800 miles so far and have almost 7 solid weeks of observation of how both combinations perform.
He slows down on grades because the truck wants to shift down often and high rev the engine. His concern is both engine wear and fuel mileage. He also has to be careful going down grades because there is not much engine assist in controlling speed. It tows fine on level ground and accelerates easily.
My combination has been a real pleasure. With the 6 speed transmission, engine braking, built in automatic yaw control, and huge amount of torque, I can just set the cruise control and forget it. It maintains speed perfectly and effortlessly going both up and down grades. If need be, I can even accelerate and pass long trucks on grades without fear. I can also easily stop the trailer if for some reason I lose the electric trailer brakes.
Towing a trailer with an under powered TV is frustrating and stressful. Same too for inadequate brake capacity when you need it.
The really funny thing is that my friends and I are both getting the same mileage, about 14-15 mpg.
__________________

__________________
The ability to follow instructions is highly underrated.
Always be wary of stupid people in large numbers.
hhendrix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2012, 11:20 AM   #2
3 Rivet Member
 
2004 16' International CCD
Orem , Utah
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 213
everyone knows turbo diesel kicks booty

max torque without the drama
__________________

starcraft is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2012, 11:24 AM   #3
Rivet Master
 
Wayward's Avatar
 
2006 25' Safari FB SE
Cary , North Carolina
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 824
The tranny and software have much to do with this

Quote:
Originally Posted by hhendrix View Post
With the 6 speed transmission, engine braking, built in automatic yaw control, and huge amount of torque, I can just set the cruise control and forget it. It maintains speed perfectly and effortlessly going both up and down grades.
This describes well my experience with the 6.2L gas motor in the same truck as yours with a similar Airstream. Ford did an outstanding job with that transmission, tranny controller and, their integration with the sensors and engine controller.

When towing, the truck always finds the best gear that my right foot is calling for. It will lock the torque converter when necessary and knows when I want to slow down on descent, and the rate. This actually provides more effective engine braking than the 3/4 ton Chevy diesel it replaced. The 6.2L gas also has a wide flat torque curve which, like the diesel, helps the tranny work as well as it does.

I am surprised Ford did not use these towing algorithms in the new F150, or is it just a more narrow torque curve than the F250 motors?
__________________
2006 Safari SE FB
2000 F150 4.2L
2011 F250 6.2L
Broadway, NC
Wayward is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2012, 12:08 PM   #4
Rivet Idiot
 
AirHeadsRus's Avatar
 
1999 34' Excella
Currently Looking...
Currently Looking...
On The Lake , Georgia
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 999
I have a 2011 F-150 6.2 gas and like it a lot. It does stop when I apply the brakes. I think if I had to, I could get it stopped even without the trailer brakes. And, like Wayward said, awesome engine braking.
Regards,
Joe
__________________
Annette
AirHeadsRus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2012, 12:18 PM   #5
Rivet Master
 
richinny's Avatar
 
2011 34' Classic
Westchester Cty.NY , / Miami FL
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 3,122
can you post the engine size and gear ratio of your friends rig? my experience with my setup more closely matched your experience.
__________________
Ricky
2012 F150 Super Crew 5-1/2' bed Ecoboost 4x4 3.73 elec. lock diff. Propride hitch
give life. kidney & pancreas transplant 9/9/06
Ingrid-my unofficial '"World's Oldest Streamer" 1909-2008 R.I.P.
richinny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2012, 01:22 PM   #6
Rivet Master
 
AWCHIEF's Avatar
 
2006 23' Safari SE
Biloxi , Mississippi
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 8,278
Images: 33
It seems that most currently produced diesels get no better mileage than their gas counterparts. With the current cost of diesel that is not very comforting. I have been looking at the new 3.7 ecoboost engine. It seems to be getting excellent mileage (better than others trucks) and has plenty of torque, HP and towing capacity to get the job done.

Ricky, sounds like you have what I have been looking at. How has yours been working out for you. Gas mileage etc
__________________
MICHAEL

Do you know what a learning experience is? A learning experience is one of those things that says "You know that thing that you just did? Don't do that."
AWCHIEF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2012, 01:29 PM   #7
Rivet Master
 
richinny's Avatar
 
2011 34' Classic
Westchester Cty.NY , / Miami FL
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 3,122
michael,
i posted in the thread i started. the usage report is here: http://www.airforums.com/forums/f463...ml#post1159233 :-)
__________________
Ricky
2012 F150 Super Crew 5-1/2' bed Ecoboost 4x4 3.73 elec. lock diff. Propride hitch
give life. kidney & pancreas transplant 9/9/06
Ingrid-my unofficial '"World's Oldest Streamer" 1909-2008 R.I.P.
richinny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2012, 02:17 PM   #8
Rivet Master
 
AWCHIEF's Avatar
 
2006 23' Safari SE
Biloxi , Mississippi
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 8,278
Images: 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by richinny View Post
michael,
i posted in the thread i started. the usage report is here: http://www.airforums.com/forums/f463...ml#post1159233 :-)
Thank you, Michael
__________________
MICHAEL

Do you know what a learning experience is? A learning experience is one of those things that says "You know that thing that you just did? Don't do that."
AWCHIEF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2012, 04:32 PM   #9
Rivet Monster
 
wahoonc's Avatar

 
1975 31' Sovereign
1980 31' Excella II
Sprung Leak , North Carolina
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 7,174
Images: 40
I tow with either a 2003 F150 with the 4.6 V-8 or a F350 PSD. The mileage is the same, the F350 doesn't know that the trailer is back there. Mileage is about 13mpg.

Aaron
__________________
....so many Airstreams....so little time...
WBCCI #XXXX AIR #2495
Why are we in this basket...and where are we going
wahoonc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2012, 05:15 PM   #10
Rivet Master

 
2015 27' Flying Cloud
Portland , Oregon
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 569
Send a message via AIM to hhendrix Send a message via Yahoo to hhendrix
Quote:
Originally Posted by richinny View Post
can you post the engine size and gear ratio of your friends rig? my experience with my setup more closely matched your experience.
I'll do it as soon as I can. Right now we are in Grand Coulee and it's pouring rain.
__________________
The ability to follow instructions is highly underrated.
Always be wary of stupid people in large numbers.
hhendrix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2012, 05:39 PM   #11
Rivet Master
 
overlander63's Avatar

 
1993 21' Sovereign
Colfax , North Carolina
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 21,138
Quote:
Originally Posted by AWCHIEF View Post
It seems that most currently produced diesels get no better mileage than their gas counterparts. With the current cost of diesel that is not very comforting.
I recently upgraded our tow vehicle to an F250 gas engine truck. My mileage is not that far below that of a diesel, and I can buy a lot of gas for the savings in purchase price. The truck has all the towing accessories the diesels do, except for the engine.
__________________
Terry
overlander63 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2012, 05:43 PM   #12
Rivet Master

 
2015 27' Flying Cloud
Portland , Oregon
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 569
Send a message via AIM to hhendrix Send a message via Yahoo to hhendrix
[QUOTE=AWCHIEF;1166071]It seems that most currently produced diesels get no better mileage than their gas counterparts. With the current cost of diesel that is not very comforting. I have been looking at the new 3.7 ecoboost engine. It seems to be getting excellent mileage (better than others trucks) and has plenty of torque, HP and towing capacity to get the job done.

I think I'd have to disagree with you first statement. Remember my truck/trailer combo weighs almost twice as much as my friends and we are getting the same mileage.
__________________
The ability to follow instructions is highly underrated.
Always be wary of stupid people in large numbers.
hhendrix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2012, 05:51 PM   #13
Rivet Master
 
Bruce B's Avatar
 
2012 16' International
Jamestown , Rhode Island
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 1,504
Images: 1
[QUOTE=hhendrix;1166178]
Quote:
Originally Posted by AWCHIEF View Post
It seems that most currently produced diesels get no better mileage than their gas counterparts. With the current cost of diesel that is not very comforting. I have been looking at the new 3.7 ecoboost engine. It seems to be getting excellent mileage (better than others trucks) and has plenty of torque, HP and towing capacity to get the job done.

I think I'd have to disagree with you first statement. Remember my truck/trailer combo weighs almost twice as much as my friends and we are getting the same mileage.
Might be interesting to see what happened if you swapped trailers for a day.....
I keep reading in the forums of how the aerodynamics have more impact than weight in terms of power needed to tow. I tow a 16' Airstream with a 2010 F-150 and I get between 13 and 15 mpg depending on the hills.

Bruce
Bruce B is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2012, 08:15 PM   #14
Vintage Kin
 
Fort Worth , Texas
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,014
Images: 1
The power needed to tow the TT is just the same . . the power needed to move the TV is always the real question . . the trade-off of miles towing versus miles solo per fuel burn.

Spec'ng a vehicle to run best for 20% or less of it's total miles is the common RV'er mistake. A TV that has to work for a living is no penalty to the experience of travel, epecially if it is better suited for solo miles (and few would argue that a 1/2T is much easier to live with). A Bambi can be towed by about anything, after all.

The OP's comparison would make more sense with GVW shown. The thread is thus far lacking basics such as scale weights (just a total for each would do), engines, gearing, trans types, etc, that one would expect with a "comparison".

For example, there are any number of approaches to ". . He also has to be careful going down grades because there is not much engine assist in controlling speed" in understanding the statement as made. The above would help to clarify this as driver skill is first, then last in this kind of assessment. The "in-between" is the vehicle spec and its' mechanical condition, the least important consideration in grade descent (for roadworthy combinations).

Not enough info, IOW.

.
slowmover is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2012, 08:33 PM   #15
Rivet Master
 
1994 30' Excella
Mississauga , Ontario
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,008
I've towed my 8000 lb 31 foot Airstream at 55 mph 5 hours straight four times now to check mileage that can be had and have averaged 15 mpg all four times. Imperial gallon. That's in Ontario and down to Cleveland and back. I am very happy with that fuel economy. It does this at 1500 rpm with the 3.5 litre ecoboost six.
Oh and when not towing I can get up to 29 mpg.(imperial) You can't match that with a diesel. I understand how much more hp and torque the diesels have but from my experience with this truck I think it is overkill, and expensive to buy if only to tow an Airstream.
Al
__________________
Al and Jean

TAC ON-3
BigAl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2012, 08:43 PM   #16
3 Rivet Member
 
2008 31' Classic
Lake Charles , Louisiana
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 153
We've had our F-250 Power Stroke for about four months now and have towed our 31 Classic about 2k miles. Our old tow vehicle was a 2007 Expedition EL with the 5.4. There is no comparison. I debated a lot over the 6.7 or 6.2 gas burner before I settled for the diesel. Best decision I've made in a long time. I'm getting 13 towing and that is running 65 on the interstate. Unhitched I average 17 running around town and best I've done was 23 running 55 with the cruise set on level road. Best thing I like is the power and torque. No lack of power with this beast :-)
Steve & Mary is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2012, 09:00 PM   #17
Rivet Master
 
MrUKToad's Avatar
 
2011 28' International
Chatham , Ontario
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,376
Images: 17
Blog Entries: 13
I'm not sure that the comparison being cited by the OP is a fair one in any meaningful sense. Using identical trailers would even things out a bit and give a fairer set of figures. There is no mention, either, of the gas mileage when not towing which, for people like me who use their daily driver as their TV, is very important and one of my key factors in deciding what sort of tow vehicle to buy.
__________________
Steve; also known as Mr UK Toad

"You can't tow that with that!"

https://toadsoftowedhaul.com
MrUKToad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2012, 10:33 PM   #18
Rivet Master
 
dkottum's Avatar
 
2012 25' Flying Cloud
Battle Lake , Minnesota
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 7,716
Sounds more like someone loving his oversized truck (that's fine), than a comparison of two trucks; we don't even know what the other truck is.

For towing an Airstream and everyday use the F150 Ecoboost may make both of them obsolete.

doug k
dkottum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2012, 10:44 PM   #19
Rivet Master

 
2015 27' Flying Cloud
Portland , Oregon
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 569
Send a message via AIM to hhendrix Send a message via Yahoo to hhendrix
[QUOTE=dkottum;1166288]Sounds more like someone loving his oversized truck (that's fine), than a comparison of two trucks; we don't even know what the other truck is.

Try reading the second paragraph again.
__________________
The ability to follow instructions is highly underrated.
Always be wary of stupid people in large numbers.
hhendrix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2012, 11:10 PM   #20
Rivet Master
 
ROBERTSUNRUS's Avatar

 
2005 25' Safari
Salem , Oregon
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 7,972
Images: 18
Blog Entries: 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by hhendrix View Post
He slows down on grades because the truck wants to shift down often and high rev the engine. His concern is both engine wear and fuel mileage. He also has to be careful going down grades because there is not much engine assist in controlling speed. It tows fine on level ground and accelerates easily.
Hi, forget the comparison, if you want to go up hill with a gas engine you need to bring it up in RPMs into it's power range. And if you are going down hill, you need to manually downshift your transmission into the proper gear. My half ton Lincoln has been down many steep mountains with barely and / or never even touching my brakes. Sorry, but your friend needs a bigger truck and /or driving lessons.
__________________

__________________
Bob

2005 Safari 25-B
"Le Petit Chateau Argent"
[ Small Silver Castle ]
2000 Navigator / 2014 F-150 Eco-Boost / Equal-i-zer / P-3
YAMAHA 2400 / AIR #12144
ROBERTSUNRUS is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by the Airstream, Inc. or any of its affiliates. Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:02 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.