Diesel vs Gas Engine? Better MPG When Towing??

[james.mileur]

If you would like a referral to the nation's top selling RAM truck guy due to volume and return customers, PM me. He will ship from CA by rail if you don't want to pick up and will charge only a modest fee to deliver it to you at the border if you don't want to pay CA sales tax. We were picked up at LAX airport and driven (in our truck) to the first truck stop inside Arizona where we met the Notary to take delivery.

Lovin' my ride (first diesel) and just got 20.5 mpg cruising at 70+ last weekend in Utah with about only 600# of payload (about 16.5K total miles). It seems to be tuned for 65 mph, where I get much higher 20's. We get about 11.5 - 12.5 towing the trailer and truck well-loaded, but when you push the pedal, it goes quick as you would ever want to accelerate or cruise.

[james.mileur]

JFYI, on our recent trip from Texas to Utah, while trying to sprint and drift between winter storms J - L, we extended our mileage quite a bit to stay on interstate high and dry (mostly).

I had to drop into a RAM dealer in Las Vegas for my 6-month, 15K service which mysteriously would have converged the day I would have arrived in SLC, on the eve of another big storm, M. Oil & filter, fuel filter and water separator, air filter, tire rotation, and 29 other points of interest, with coupon and military discount was $444. for a drop-in Saturday morning. He even had a place to drop the trailer off if needed. I passed on the double or nothing offer at the cashier's counter.

I'll buy the few handy tools and do it my self the next time so I don't pay the storm dodger tax again.

[leje]

Originally Posted by Countryboy59

I don't think most people would consider a gas engine in a truck a bad choice. Horsepower is horsepower, been an engineer 37 years, mostly automotive. The diesel vs gas discussions just get ridiculous. I commute in mine, diesel is not the best choice for that. Also I run up the miles a lot higher than most. All my past trucks, gas and diesel, are over 300k miles and still running. Got a master mechanic in the family and I wrench myself so all the blah blah blah about maintenance from people who take it to the dealer means nothing to me.

Unless your drive is less than 10 miles, what's wrong with the diesel for a commute?

[Countryboy59]

Originally Posted by leje

Unless your drive is less than 10 miles, what's wrong with the diesel for a commute?

Cold starting next to the neighbor's house at 4:30am, much higher fuel cost, and much higher maintenance cost. It stinks up the attached garage and odor gets in the house too. I get the same horsepower (actually a bit more) from the 6.2 and it pulls like a tank.

Don't get me wrong, loved my diesels. Just don't need 'em right now.

[xrvr]

Opinions!

[Countryboy59]

Originally Posted by avionstream

Opinions!

Like I said, the topic gets ridiculous.

[leje]

Originally Posted by Countryboy59

Cold starting next to the neighbor's house at 4:30am, much higher fuel cost, and much higher maintenance cost. It stinks up the attached garage and odor gets in the house too. I get the same horsepower (actually a bit more) from the 6.2 and it pulls like a tank.

Don't get me wrong, loved my diesels. Just don't need 'em right now.

Ah, you are talking about the old diesels. The 2011+ diesels aren't loud and the emissions are less than gassers. Fuel costs aren't "much" higher in my parts, and the diesel gets 40% better MPG than my dad's GM 6.0 of the same year. Maintenance is higher by the incremental oil and fuel filters, everything else is the same. For me, using more expensive full synthetics, that's less than $100 in maintenance over and above what a gasser would cost. If you're talking about repairs when you say maintenance, that's a completely different debatable story.

For pulling trailers, I'll take torque any day. Driving 65 mph down the highway takes far less than peak HP. It's torque that gets you to 65 and that exhaust brake is great for getting you down to zero.

[Countryboy59]

Originally Posted by leje

Ah, you are talking about the old diesels. The 2011+ diesels aren't loud and the emissions are less than gassers. Fuel costs aren't "much" higher in my parts, and the diesel gets 40% better MPG than my dad's GM 6.0 of the same year. Maintenance is higher by the incremental oil and fuel filters, everything else is the same. For me, using more expensive full synthetics, that's less than $100 in maintenance over and above what a gasser would cost. If you're talking about repairs when you say maintenance, that's a completely different debatable story.

For pulling trailers, I'll take torque any day. Driving 65 mph down the highway takes far less than peak HP. It's torque that gets you to 65 and that exhaust brake is great for getting you down to zero.

65mph? Need to get up to 75 or 80 to merge around here, 65 will get you run over on 696! Here we go with the "torque is better than horsepower" again.

I had a 2014 diesel. My boss has a '16, still too loud. Yes they are quieter than my old 6.5 was but still much too loud between houses or in a small urban yard if you care about your neighbors and leave for work at 4 am. There is smoke on start up, the truck needs to be moved out of the garage immediately to keep from smelling up the house.

I changed the oil in my diesels at 3000 miles and the oil changes, gas, DEF etc etc cost too much for my usage of the truck. Not looking to argue, I don't need to, I've owned both. You can go synthetic, stretch the oil changes, etc. I've worked on engines and I don't do that. I've had Volkswagen TDIs, Rabbits, Isuzus and even an Escort diesel that got 65 mpg. Did timing belts myself on all of them. I know a little more about diesels than people who drive one or two year old pickup trucks, trust me.

Horsepower and torque are related. Can't have one without the other. I can pull anything with my 6.2 my boss can pull with his Powerstroke. End of story. I'm an engineer, I know what I'm talking about. 400 horsepower is 400 horsepower, torque is multiplied or reduced through GEARING to make the vehicle pull at any speed you require. I really cringe when people who obviously aren't engineers say "I'll take torque any day". You get both whether you like it or not.

Like I said, I have all the power I need for commuting and pulling anything I own. I paid cash for my truck, also bought an Airstream and a second car same way. I've had diesels too, for God's sake how many times do I have to say I loved 'em. Chose a gas truck as it fits my use, glad I did this time. Most of the trucks sold here are gasoline. Doesn't mean they're better or worse.

[rodsterinfl]

I have only two longer trips under my belt with a 2009 F 150 4.6L 3V 3.55. I drove from Fort Myers to Jackson Center and then back via I-95 along the coast. My first trip was over 2000 miles throughout South Carolina and home. On both trips I averaged 12mpg (11.62) with a 25' Airstream and I could have done better if I would have driven more slowly. I averaged 68 mph on the JC trip (I do not hold to the trailer tire 65mph with the truck tires on the trailer). The other trip was much lower speed due to hills.

I did not read through all the posts but Diesel UREA costs the equivalent of about 2mpg when I did the math based on usage/consumption a year or so ago on an average year's driving.

In older threads of this topic the conclusion tends to be a few mpg more with the diesel but the newer gas models are about the same, especially considering UREA. In other words, from my experience getting 12mpg, the diesel would have to get 14mpg to equal the same after UREA based on 15K miles a year while towing. Anything above that is betterment.

The 2015 Ecoboost I have no longer trips yet. I calculate by hand at the pump as I do not trust onboard computers for MPG.

[nickclifford]

[QUOTE=Countryboy59;1911881]Cold starting next to the neighbor's house at 4:30am, much higher fuel cost, and much higher maintenance cost. It stinks up the attached garage and odor gets in the house too. I get the same horsepower (actually a bit more) from the 6.2 and it pulls like a tank.

That's the one thing that pisses me off about diesel trucks is the godawful smell and why do diesel trucks owners feel the need to leave the engine running while they run into a store or something ? The smell is disgusting and by all accounts not good for the lungs .. Older diesel trucks that belch black soot need to be decommissioned by law IMO ... get em fixed or scrap them.

[wdkennedy]

When it is sub zero it may be best to leave the beast running. I agree with you regarding the odor. Ford/International have the most obnoxious odor. My '15 Ram/Cummins has little odor issue (except when I put off cleaning out the interior). Regarding DEF, get ready for higher injection rates and larger catalytic converters with more back pressure. The California air quality resouce board is driving a huge effort to eliminate all diesel engine use. Can you say VW......BMW.....etc.? I reluctantly sold my '12 VW Golf back to VW so they can re-sell it in another country, same atmosphere. Love my Cummins, running a '16 Piston Bully this AM powered by Cummins, the ONLY company willing and able to meet CAT 5 emissions standards.

[Thiss]

Originally Posted by wdkennedy

Love my Cummins, running a '16 Piston Bully this AM powered by Cummins, the ONLY company willing and able to meet CAT 5 emissions standards.

I wish I was following your work today. Which resort?