Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×
 


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 02-20-2003, 11:39 AM   #1
JD1
1 Rivet Member
 
JD1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 19
Airstream / Intrepid

The legendary 1994 Chrysler Intreped that Can Am used for many years has been mentioned a few times in different threads. I was going through a newsletter and saw this article. This is the notorious Intripid at a test track negotiating a slolam run with a big A-S in tow. Here are the highlights.

The Intrepid is used to demo large Airstreams over 90% of its driving time.
It has over 60,000 miles of towing on it.
Few problems developed as a result of towing.
It went through the slalom faster than a Suburban or a Blazer. Note that this Intrepid towing a 34' A-S went through the slalom almost as fast as some vehicles did solo.
Options were a custom hitch & HENSLEY, transmission cooler and brake controller.
3.5 V6 front wheel drive ( weight on drive wheels) proved to be a success.

This won't appeal to everyone but does illustrate the capabilities.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	int air 34.jpg
Views:	5730
Size:	50.0 KB
ID:	1543  
__________________
JD
JD1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2003, 01:10 PM   #2
4 Rivet Member
 
markjoandall's Avatar
 
2001 30' Excella
Bedford , New Hampshire
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 347
Images: 4
Sure doesn't look like a 3/4 ton hd diesel duramax psd 4:10 ... etc.

I guess I'm from MO. I need to see it in person.
__________________
-Life is a journey, not a destination.
Aerosmith
markjoandall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2003, 01:58 PM   #3
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 544
Images: 29
Talking

I bet he must check his brake connection very carefully before traveling in mountains.

Can anybody calculate how fast he will go, the day he looses the brakes on the trailer, let's say downhill on a 10% grade?

Chantal
femuse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2003, 04:49 PM   #4
Rivet Master
 
LOST , Hawaii
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 2,193
Did the article have an asterisk and disclaimer at the bottom, professional driver on a closed course? I wonder how Chrysler feels about this, and I wonder if CanAm accepts liability for adapting vehicles to tow 2, 3, or 4 times what they are rated to tow?

CanAm is modifying machinery which is easy to do. The problem comes when you put people (most of whom aren't going to tow 60,000 miles in their life) in their daily driver with 8000 lbs. strapped to the rear and give them the impression it isn't there. Safety should be the primary concern when driving/towing, and I am a long way from being convinced this is safe in the hands of the average driver.

John
74Argosy24MH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2003, 06:15 PM   #5
rdm
2 Rivet Member
 
rdm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 83
Personal Experience

I had the good fortune to test drive Can Am's Intrepid 34' AS combo 3 years ago. This was the first time towing a trailer for me.

The man who founded Can Am specialized in matching tow vechicles and Airstreams from the beginning. To day his family carries on his work and are considered towing experts by the RV industry in both the USA and Canada. Visit their website and review the towing articles and you will understand and appreciate the level of expertise provided at Can Am RV.

As for my own experience using the Intrepid we did interstate driving , county road driving and emergency handling manevours including emergency braking. The combined unit exceeded all my expectatioins.

Seeing and driving plus knowing the large number of satisfied customers Can Am has indicates Andy Thompson Sr and his family are true pioneers that have proven their knowledge and capabilty to make the RV industry safer for both the owner and the future owner of an RV.

As you can tell from our profile we are proud owners of a Classic 325 MH we have owned MH in the past and the MH fits our lifestyle today.

Do not criticize something until you research all the facts and then make your descision pro or con.

Thanks for the support from this forum
Ray
rdm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2003, 06:32 PM   #6
Silver Condo III
 
kamadeca's Avatar
 
2015 30' International
Saskatoon , Saskatchewan
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 264
Well, I have to wade into this discussion.

My relatives have bought 5 Airstreams from Can-Am over the years and have come to trust Andy and his crew implicitly. He has always set up their tow vehicles, ranging from a Chrysler Imperial (late 60's early 70's) to a 3/4 Ton Dodge Van - needed to haul the Honda Goldwing and 31' excella.

I too will be joining the clan shortly and will be pulling my 25C Safari with a Chrysler 300 M to which Andy has added a custom receiver, tranny cooler, tranny temp guage and Hayes Dana brake controller.

I test drove/"towed" at Can-Am a 30 ft Classic with a Windstar (since traded in on a new Intrepid SE-same power train as my 300 M) and was suitably impressed with performance and drivability.

At the lastest RV show in Toronto, Andy had the Intrepid/30' Classic on display and had a video running of the trip he made to California last year with the rig.

As for losing the brakes going down a 10% grade, I am not sure many drivers would be able to handle the situation driving a Honda Civic, let alone pulling a trailer. I am not even sure how some drivers would handle driving an F350 PS and losing the brakes towing a trailer - I think there would be some major "brown" pants.

Just my two cents.
kamadeca is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2003, 06:54 PM   #7
Rivet Master
 
Chas's Avatar
 
Austin , Texas
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 949
Images: 22
It is interesting to see a definite difference in the realization of towing capabilities between us south of the border and north of it. I am just waiting for Wayne and his Nissan Quest/Tradewind combo to enter the fray. I do believe that us Americans are somewhat entrenched in the ideology of big V8's and towing mass when you see totally the opposite in almost every other country. Europe for instance. But in regard to Canada there is a big difference, seeing our Canadian friends pulling our American made Airstreams with FWD passenger cars and minivans as some have and that is probably what shocks us the most. I am sure if they were pulling Awards ( a now defunct Canadian brand) around like they do, it would probably be much easier for us to accept.

As for me, I will stick with my F-250 Powerstroke!!!

Chas
Chas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2003, 07:00 PM   #8
Rivet Master
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 917
It's all in the Hensley Arrow hitch!!!!

John
John is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2003, 07:56 PM   #9
Contributing Member
 
Pahaska's Avatar
 
2018 Interstate Grand Tour Ext
Austin (Hays County) , Texas
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 7,164
Images: 4
Look again

Quote:
I am sure if they were pulling Awards ( a now defunct Canadian brand) around like they do, it would probably be much easier for us to accept.
Chas:

Take a look at www.AwardRV.com or the latest Trailer Life Buyer's Guide. Award is live and well and selling trailers in the US and Canada.

OTOH, Awards aren't terribly light. Their lightest trailer, a 23-footer, has a slightly lighter dry weight than my 22' International (3980 vs 4200), but a heavier max weight (5400 vs 5000). Their larger trailers are likewise in the same ball park, weight-wise, as the similar length Airstreams.

If I did not own an Airstream, Award would probably be my next choice. They are definitely first class trailers.
__________________
John W. Irwin
2018 Interstate GT, "Sabre-Dog V"
WBCCI #9632
Pahaska is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2003, 09:13 PM   #10
4 Rivet Member
 
markjoandall's Avatar
 
2001 30' Excella
Bedford , New Hampshire
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 347
Images: 4
Well I'm jealous. I would certainly like to have had the opportunity to drive such a rig. I was wondering if one of you from north of the border would be so kind to post the web site for the Can Am Company. There's got to be something we can learn here.

As for the Award travel trailer. We owned one from 94 to 01. It was a 27 foot model and had a 5000 gvw. Once I scaled the entire rig. (Astro Van pulling an Award) and all axels of the tow vehicle and trailer were under gross wights. The trailer was difficult to tow until we purchased the pullrite hitch. I think the wheelbase of the astro was just a little short for the job.

We finally traded the award in for the Airstream and are very happy with our decision. The award began to loose its integrity to keep the weather out. Once moisture made it into the sandwich wall construction, mildew, mold and panel separation soon followed. I never want to own another sandwich constructed vehicle.
__________________
-Life is a journey, not a destination.
Aerosmith
markjoandall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2003, 09:56 PM   #11
rdm
2 Rivet Member
 
rdm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 83
Can Am RV Link

Here is the Can Am address
www.can-am-rv.com

hope this helps
Ray
rdm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2003, 08:41 AM   #12
Rivet Master
 
Chas's Avatar
 
Austin , Texas
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 949
Images: 22
I didn't know they were actually building Awards anymore. I was interested in them years ago, saw a new 27' back in the early 90's at Stahlmann Sales near S.A. Tx, fell in love with it but they sure as heck were pricey. I am glad I didn't get one for I have heard they have a tendency to come apart, actually splitting down the center at the roof!! The frames on the first generations were galvanized steel, probably something to do with the Canadian winters, road salt and such. Most of the ones I see down here are turning dingy yellow, the sun is taking it's toll on the plastic and fiberglass.

Chas
Chas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2003, 10:10 AM   #13
Rivet Master
 
Road Ruler's Avatar
 
Currently Looking...
St. Catharines , South Western Ontario
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 2,367
Images: 38
Intrepid v6 Puller

Chas... Ya buddy, I'm here. Was out of town with a family emergency and all is well. Might as well jump into this one. It is my cup of tea.

JD1...Cool pic at the track. This combo is familiar to me.

Hundreds, maybe thousands of test drives were performed in that Intrepid combo over the years. I first drove it about 7 years ago when it was hooked up to a 31'. While jaw waggin with Andy I for the most part forgot the trailer was in tow. The combination felt so right and stable. A couple years later my dad was visiting from BC and I took him to Can am to see this amazing rig. On that particular day the Intrepid was hitched up to the 34. Dad took that combo for a run on the highway and was impressed with the ease at which the whole packaged handled. He had towed RV's for 45 years but nothing over 21'. Now at 70 years old he got to pull a 34' triple axle. I thank Can Am for the opportunity. I know Dad talked about that drive for a long time after that.

John.. Re Hensley... I have read about the testing that Can Am did. I will try to find the paperwork but I can recall the Hensley was added to all of the test vehicles and made a major increase in the speed on all test runs. Jd1 may have this info as well but I also read that wider wheels and low profile tires were added to the Suburban but it still wasn't enough to keep up with the Intrepid combo.

Ray... You best summed it up. Can Am's knowledge, capabilities, and experience are the key. Their dedication to quality and safety...... their customer sat.
The other issue you spoke of is "research all the facts and then make your decision pro or con". Sounds fair.
We are very lucky to have such a broad base of tow vehicles to choose from. If we all towed with the same thing we would have little to talk about.

Chas... There were some Awards at the RV show. They are back in production. They are known to tow well but like Mark said they probably don't have the longevity of the A/S's.

Here is a link that I posted before that gives one an understanding on Can Ams view and methodology on towing.

Click on the link below and view the blue "Features" column. Scroll down and you will see an article, "Hitch Hints" Looking for a tow vehicle. The article is written by Andy from Can Am

http://www.rvlifemag.com/

or ( see thread on the "Perfect Tow Vehicle")
__________________
Airstreams..... The best towing trailers on the planet!
Road Ruler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2003, 12:18 PM   #14
Rivet Master
 
Chas's Avatar
 
Austin , Texas
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 949
Images: 22
Just wonderin', maybe your fellow Canadian, "Super Dave Osborne", was the original test pilot on the Intrepid/triple axle A/S lashup?

Chas
Chas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2003, 06:47 PM   #15
Rivet Master
 
3Ms75Argosy's Avatar
 
1975 Argosy 26
1963 24' Tradewind
Seattle , Washington
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 2,341
Images: 7
Up Up and away?

I'm impressed that the Intreped looks so level with the AS! But, how did the car pull the trailer up the hills? Anyone out there drive it loaded in the hills of Canada? I'd really like to stay away from a big truck. Did the motor have enough guts up the mountains? I'd assume that the trailer brakes did a lot of the stopping duties going down?

A four wheel drive caravan would be super, if only it had enough brawn for my 25 footer. I'd worry that a front wheel drive car would spin it's wheels going up a dirt hill to my campsite.

P.s- what did ever happen to Super Dave? I used to love his show as a kid! Didn't he have a motorhome with a "mother in law" seat up top?
Marc
3Ms75Argosy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2003, 09:55 PM   #16
Rivet Master
 
Chas's Avatar
 
Austin , Texas
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 949
Images: 22
I believe he was doing or still is a comedy on the cable channel FX, called "Son of the Beach" I hardly recognized him, almost bald now, but as usual he makes me laugh my a#$ off. I do remember him playing a piano on top of a motorhome before it went through a tunnel, crashing into brick walls, stopping greyhound buses with his body, etc.

Chas
Chas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2003, 03:44 AM   #17
Silver Condo III
 
kamadeca's Avatar
 
2015 30' International
Saskatoon , Saskatchewan
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 264
I thought I would quote a post that Andy from Can-Am posted in another group about his trip to California last summer.

To give you an idea of what to expect I just returned from a 6,000
mile trip with a 2003 30' Classic Airstream and I was towing with a
vehicle with just slightly more power than your Suburban (234 hp vs
your 210). This is his new Intrepid We went West on Interstate 80 from Ohio to San Francisco
along the coast to San Simion and then we crossed to Sequoia National
park from there we went south to Bakersfield and through Vegas on
I-15 and across Interstate 70 from where it starts in Utah to Ohio.

I needed second gear to climb hills a total of 44 times in 5000 miles
of interstate. In total I towed no more than 60 miles in Second gear
and never below 50 mph. If I could have climbed all these hills at
65 MPH I would have saved a grand total of 7 minutes

I did need first gear on three hills in Colorado, Vail Pass,
Eisenhower Tunnel and Floyd hill, These are 10-11,000 feet elevation.
Near the top of the Donder Pass I needed first gear when the traffic
slowed due to construction. The climb into Sequia where you go from
100' elevation to 7000 feet required first gear for about 12 miles
but it is a twisty 2 lane road with sheer drops I don't think many
people climb it much over 25 mph any way. Though I was in low gear
in these locations I had plenty of reserve power and was by no means
foot on the floor.

For many people this is an acceptable trade off for a smooth quiet
ride and economy of operation. In fact I would have spent more time
in gas stations feeding a 454 than I could have ever saved climbing
hills. Personally I would not have wanted to listen to a Diesel for
6000 miles in 3 weeks and since I occasionally quietly leave
campgrounds a 6 am a deisel is not an option for me. For me the
biggest advantage to owning an Aristream is the flexability of being
able to tow efficently and safely with what you want to.

By no means am I critisizing those who choose to tow with big
powerfull trucks it is certainly their choice and I am sure they feel
secure knowing they have an abundance of power. I just wanted you to
know that it is not a prerequeset to owning an Airstream and to give
you a realistic idea of what performance to expect.


Andy
kamadeca is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2003, 08:04 AM   #18
Rivet Master
 
Road Ruler's Avatar
 
Currently Looking...
St. Catharines , South Western Ontario
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 2,367
Images: 38
Hi Marc

Good questions. It took me over 6 years of asking questions, test driving various combos, and pondering the front wheel drive concepts before we jumped in and the experience has exceeded our expectations. It didn't happen overnight. This is my understanding as to why it works.

Engine / drive train weight is on the drive wheels. Front / rear ratio is around 55 / 45.
Camping last year ( four weeks in total ) we had no issues with the front wheels spinning. The newer vehicles are even better with traction control. Wheel slippage is more apt to occur with front engine rear drive where the drive wheels are on the light end of the vehicle.

Low centre of gravity: It works for a racing car so why not a tow vehicle. A low centre of gravity and independent suspension gives the vehicle great handling characteristics. Low profile performance tires have no side play and great grip. Also realizing that if you were to get a blow out with the Intrepid the rim would only drop about 2 to 3 inches to the pavement. In a large vehicle with high profile tires the drop would be more like 5 to 7 inches. Low profile tires would appear to be more desireable.

Aerodynamics: The Intrepid and Airstream are in tune aerodynamically. Far less horsepower is required to move this combo down the road. A high powered, heavy bulky vehicle would be quicker off the line because of torque and gearing but it looses its advantage with the extra weight and wind resistance as the speed increases.

Hills: Hills were the biggest concern with my rig because I have less HP and torque than the Intrepid / 34 combo. Then again I have half the weight with my 23'. Aerodynamics help. The faster the speed, the more the advantage. With my rig I can respectably climb any hill in Ontario quicker than most 18 wheelers.

I walked past a Dodge Grand Caravan today and noticed disc brakes on the rear. Their large V6 is a proven engine. Can Am however swears by the Ford Windstar ( sport version is preferred). At one of our local RV dealers we recently demo'd a Windstar / 25' Trailite combo and the van pulled it effortlessly. Much more powerful than my Nissan. It would be reasonable to say that there are hundreds of Windstars towing travel trailers in Canada.

There are a number of front wheel drive V6 vehicles towing 34' A/S's. By comparison using one to tow a 23 or 25' A/S would seem very reasonable.

Again...Tow vehicles are personal preference based on likes, needs, or usage. Every one and every case is different and I do respect that. Although I prefere the "V6 / AS thing" the coolest rig I've ever seen was a custom Freightliner pulling a triple axle 5th wheel. Easily a half million dollar rig (cdn funds).


Chas / Marc We had Super Dave but you got Ozzy. What's with those Osbourns?
I think it was "Awesome (Can Am) Andy" driving the Intrepid in JD1's pic.
__________________
Airstreams..... The best towing trailers on the planet!
Road Ruler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2003, 09:54 AM   #19
Rivet Master
 
RoadKingMoe's Avatar
 
2001 34' Limited
The State of , Ohio
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 1,605
Images: 23
Wow! No wonder cars and trucks cost so much these days! Manufacturers are wasting millions on teams of hundreds of powertrain and chassis engineers and all those big-buck computer systems with sophisticated software to establish vehicle parameters like tow ratings. All they really need to do is come to this forum or visit the Can-Am website. According to our "experts" here, they're getting it wrong by a factor of three to seven times!

For newbies viewing this thread, let me just remind you of this... the Internet is a sample of the entire population... the population subject to the process of natural selection. If you look hard enough, you can find justification for whatever you want to do.

Darwin would like RVs because those who've slipped through the process so far and have already bred, often take their genetic spawn with them when they go. When it comes to matters of health and safety, choose carefully who you and your family follow through this process that we all go through.

For me and mine, we'll tow that 9800 lb, 1000 lb tongue weight, 34' triple axle trailer with a near 8,000 lb truck with 12,500 lb tow rating instead of a near 4,000 lb car with a 1,500 lb tow rating.
__________________
Maurice
RoadKingMoe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2003, 10:48 AM   #20
Rivet Master
 
3Ms75Argosy's Avatar
 
1975 Argosy 26
1963 24' Tradewind
Seattle , Washington
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 2,341
Images: 7
Hmmmm....

I don't think anybody here has stated that they are an "expert" on the field of towing. I asked a question about people's experiences. This post was about one person's experience with the Intreped / AS combo. Other's had mentioned the combo, others stated disbelief, and here was the actual deal.

True, you DON'T see semi-trailers being pulled by pickup trucks. But you have to agree that this is facinating concept. You are right however, it is up to each person to decide what is right for them. Safety is a HUGE factor in my mind, and I'm sure everyone else's too. Yes, buyer beware, but the more info, the more people can make their own decision.

In the construction industry, people laughed at OSB and steel studs, pretty prevalent here now. In Germany, concrete reins big (brother in law just had his "tract home built" you should see the rafters, 8x8 rough sawn lumber, in a TRACT non-custom home!) and they laugh at our "sticks." They also pull with Mercedes, Audi's and BMW's (I've seen with my own eyes). Each place has their thing.

I don't think I'd pull an 31 ft with a car, but I love hearing about it
Marc
3Ms75Argosy is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Announcing Airstream Life magazine! Airstream Life Commercial Listings 29 10-14-2004 06:52 PM
airstream! airstream! airstream! 83Excella Our Community 0 03-23-2002 10:37 PM
Airstream Related List Servers Andy R Link Archive 0 02-22-2002 02:05 PM


Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by the Airstream, Inc. or any of its affiliates. Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:34 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.