Free 7 Day Trial RV GPS App RV Trip Planner Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Free 7 Day Trial ×
 


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 07-10-2017, 09:07 AM   #41
Vintage Kin
 
Fort Worth , Texas
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,014
Images: 1
Use the scales. Always work from a numerical baseline.

Whether or not one set of bars is better than another should be tested.

As a general rule of thumb, the more "bend " in the bars, the greater the resistance to sway.

Andy R of Inland RV has plenty to say on it. Worth the reading. (And, know anyone else who's tested an AS at 110-mph?). Fifty years plus of AS experience shouldn't be discounted lightly.

Good luck.
slowmover is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2017, 10:41 AM   #42
Half a Rivet Short
 
2017 30' Classic
2022 Interstate 24X
Carlisle , Pennsylvania
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 12,613
Quote:
Originally Posted by NOAZRK2690 View Post
In April I started towing my 34' Classic Slideout with a 2017 F250 6.7 L Diesel with 3.55 rear, using a Hensley. After 250 miles interstate driving, I noticed excessive brake dust on the chrome wheels. I disabled the Ford stability control, drove another 1,200 miles without the black dust reappearing. There was no noticeable change in control. I custom ordered this TV in cooperation with the Ford Super Duty Program Manager. My suggestion is this. If you are not going to use your TV for OFF ROAD driving in mud & rocks, do not get the off road package. Get the CAMPER PACKAGE instead. (Not to be confused with the towing package. ) For about $160.00 you get an absolutely essential rear axle stability bar, one step higher front coil springs, the auxiliary rear leaf spring plus Ford's written camper certification. In my AirForum member info, I've listed other options. I think we built the perfect tow vehicle f a 30 or 34 foot AS without going overboard at the expense of fuel economy. I have no stability issues at all with the F250. I found the new electric steering to be right on once I stopped over steering.
Hi

I happen to also have the camper package on my F-250. There is one weird note on the springs: They are bumped up *if* max springs are not already selected. The whole spring thing gets driven by several option packages. You will get max springs with the camper package, you *might* have had them already. The sway bar is indeed a "camper only" item. Very much worth the $160 by it's self.

Bob
uncle_bob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-11-2017, 08:18 AM   #43
Rivet Master
 
Moflash's Avatar
 
2007 28' International CCD
Springfield , Missouri
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 1,423
2017 Ford F250 and trailer sway ???

You can order a better hd rear stabilizer from Hotchkis suspension.About $250.Takes about 1hr to install.
The Off Road Package does include Hill Descent in which I use but it's a personal preference.Hd front springs do provide a harsher ride if u are into that.
Moflash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-11-2017, 09:27 AM   #44
Rivet Master

 
2015 27' Flying Cloud
Portland , Oregon
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 621
Send a message via AIM to hhendrix Send a message via Yahoo to hhendrix
Quote:
Originally Posted by gypsydad View Post
I've got a soft floating kind of ride without hard jolts at bridges or whatever. I just don't understand why anyone would use heaver then 700 to 1,000 lb. bars on an Airstream and put that much tension on the AS & TV. If two 1,000 lb "SPRING Bars" lift 1000lbs of my tongue weight the remaining 125lbs is nothing to let on the rear of the TV.
The 1500 lb bars are recommended by Blue Ox for anything over 1000 lbs tongue weight. When I asked about the 1000lb bars, the "experts" at Blue Ox told me to go with the heavier bars for more stable ride and safety.
I know my tongue weight is over 1000lbs, since the AS dealer had a scale they used...unfortunately, it only went to 1000lbs; they were surprised also that the 28' was so heavy.[/QUOTE]


I agree. I bought a new 27' front bedroom Flying Cloud and my TV was a 2001 F350 one ton. Despite many years of towing, I never had used a WD system before, so a local trailer dealer sold me a system with 1200 lb bars. It was WAY too much for the trailer with my one ton suspension. The truck and 1200 lb bars were beating the trailer to death. Cabinets opening, drawers opening, etc. But the worst and most obvious were the stress cracks at both of the front outside compartment lower corners. It was like someone jumping up and down on the top of the trailer literally crushing the shell.

I happened to read a thread here about WD hitches and Andy from Inland Trailer posted a comment about using bars too strong for a truck's heavy duty suspension. Show light bulb going on. Fortunately the dealer who sold me the WD hitch allowed me to switch to 600-800 lb bars and the improvement was immediate.

Move ahead to now with a 2015 27' FC and no drawers flying open, cabinets stay closed, and a much smoother ride all around.

That being said, IMHO, the best way to "tune" any WD system is to use truck scales. Read my earlier posting in this thread describing the method I use.

Bottom line here is to be very careful about using 1000 lb or greater bars with a stiff suspension on 3/4 and 1 ton suspensions.
__________________
The ability to follow instructions is highly underrated.
Always be wary of stupid people in large numbers.
hhendrix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2017, 08:15 AM   #45
Half a Rivet Short
 
2017 30' Classic
2022 Interstate 24X
Carlisle , Pennsylvania
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 12,613
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moflash View Post
You can order a better hd rear stabilizer from Hotchkis suspension.About $250.Takes about 1hr to install.
The Off Road Package does include Hill Descent in which I use but it's a personal preference.Hd front springs do provide a harsher ride if u are into that.
Hi

I have absolutely no doubt that every single part of the stock suspension has a "better than" replacement out there for not a lot of money.

At least to me, after the "old F-250" ride, the one I have (with max springs) is not anything I would call harsh. Yes, it's not what you get in a sedan, but it's also not the truck of ten or twenty years ago.

The engine braking on the gas engine caught me by surprise the first time it cut in. It's a cool feature.

Bob
uncle_bob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2017, 04:25 PM   #46
4 Rivet Member
 
2017 26' Flying Cloud
Granbury , Texas
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 412
When I called Blue Ox recently to ask about the sway pro and different bars I learned something I didn't know. They said whatever bars or hitch I decided on to be sure and turn off the trucks sway / stability control.

I ask why and they said because the two would work against each other.

Could this be your problem?
cabinetmaker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2017, 04:43 PM   #47
Rivet Master
 
dkottum's Avatar
 
2012 25' Flying Cloud
Battle Lake , Minnesota
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 7,714
Quote:
Originally Posted by cabinetmaker View Post
When I called Blue Ox recently to ask about the sway pro and different bars I learned something I didn't know. They said whatever bars or hitch I decided on to be sure and turn off the trucks sway / stability control.

I ask why and they said because the two would work against each other.

Could this be your problem?
We've heard this before on the forum and its generally been discounted as bad advice. What's the latest, and could someone explain how the tow vehicle's electronic stability/sway control works against mechanical sway control at the hitch?
__________________
Doug and Cheryl
2012 FC RB, Michelin 16, ProPride 1400
2016 Ram 1500 Laramie Crew Cab 4X4 Ecodiesel 3.92 axles

The Truth is More Important Than the Facts
dkottum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2017, 06:41 AM   #48
Rivet Master
Commercial Member
 
Andrew T's Avatar

 
2019 27' Tommy Bahama
London , Ontario
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,265
Electronic sway control does not engage until you are in a pretty dramatic sway. If it is engaging just driving down the road then your hitch is set up is very poor or your trailer balance is very bad. It will not be affected by the hitch system.

In our testing at the race track we have never had an issue with it causing a problem.

Think of a properly set up hitch system as a seat belt and electronic sway control as the air bag. It's nice to know its there, you never want to have to use it.

Andrew T
__________________
Andrew Thomson
London, Ontario

"One test is worth a thousand expert opinions."
Tex Johnston, Boeing 707 test pilot
Andrew T is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2017, 07:52 AM   #49
Rivet Master
 
dkottum's Avatar
 
2012 25' Flying Cloud
Battle Lake , Minnesota
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 7,714
Thanks Andrew. Many of us have learned he importance of a well set up hitch system and appreciate your expertise and generosity in helping.
__________________
Doug and Cheryl
2012 FC RB, Michelin 16, ProPride 1400
2016 Ram 1500 Laramie Crew Cab 4X4 Ecodiesel 3.92 axles

The Truth is More Important Than the Facts
dkottum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2017, 10:51 AM   #50
Half a Rivet Short
 
2017 30' Classic
2022 Interstate 24X
Carlisle , Pennsylvania
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 12,613
Hi

There are literally hundreds of different vehicle models with different "stability controls". What's on this year's model probably is better than what was on last years. The one with this option package is different than the one with that option. Trying to work out exactly what each one does or does not do .... good luck. Lumping them all into one big bucket - no way.

It would be *very* nice if the Blue Ox guys could let the world know what issue they happened to come across. Tossing out every single system made in the last 20 to 30 years with a single "turn it off" is not at all helpful.

Bob
uncle_bob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2017, 08:36 AM   #51
Rivet Master
 
gypsydad's Avatar

 
2017 28' Flying Cloud
2014 25' FB Flying Cloud
2008 25' Safari FB SE
Georgetown (winter)Thayne (summer) , Texas & Wyoming
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 4,162
Blue Ox

Quote:
Originally Posted by uncle_bob View Post
Hi

There are literally hundreds of different vehicle models with different "stability controls". What's on this year's model probably is better than what was on last years. The one with this option package is different than the one with that option. Trying to work out exactly what each one does or does not do .... good luck. Lumping them all into one big bucket - no way.

It would be *very* nice if the Blue Ox guys could let the world know what issue they happened to come across. Tossing out every single system made in the last 20 to 30 years with a single "turn it off" is not at all helpful.

Bob
I had a lengthy discussion with a Blue Ox tech yesterday, and he "quoted" their recommendation to "disengage" the anti-sway on the TV. I told him about the discussion on our thread, Canam recommendations from testing on track, and he backed off, but said that was news to him. I agree, they need to confirm what they are saying to customers.
I also asked again about the 1500# bars on my 28' being very stiff....he said that's the size they recommend when above 1000# tongue weight. I would like some others opinions on this. Although my AS is tracking fine now, it seems way too stiff when loading/unloading. Still wondering if I should go down to the 1000# bars or if that would cause issues since my tongue weight is over 1000#?
__________________
Empty Nesters; Gypsies on the road!
2017 28' Twin Flying Cloud
2017 F250 King Ranch, 4X4, 6.7L, Blue-Ox WDH
Summer-Star Valley Ranch RV Resort (Thayne, WY); Winter-Sun City (Georgetown,TX)
gypsydad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2017, 06:06 PM   #52
Rivet Master
 
2007 27' International CCD FB
San Diego , California
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,769
Part of setting up any WD hitch is adjusting how much preload is on the WD bars. Perhaps you have too much tension dialed into the 1500# bars?
pteck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2017, 05:08 PM   #53
Rivet Master
 
gypsydad's Avatar

 
2017 28' Flying Cloud
2014 25' FB Flying Cloud
2008 25' Safari FB SE
Georgetown (winter)Thayne (summer) , Texas & Wyoming
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 4,162
Quote:
Originally Posted by pteck View Post
Part of setting up any WD hitch is adjusting how much preload is on the WD bars. Perhaps you have too much tension dialed into the 1500# bars?
The head is factory set now on the BO; you just insert, set the tension to 4.5 links or adjust up or down a link if not working properly...
__________________
Empty Nesters; Gypsies on the road!
2017 28' Twin Flying Cloud
2017 F250 King Ranch, 4X4, 6.7L, Blue-Ox WDH
Summer-Star Valley Ranch RV Resort (Thayne, WY); Winter-Sun City (Georgetown,TX)
gypsydad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2017, 11:01 AM   #54
NOAZRK
 
NOAZRK2690's Avatar
 
2004 34' Classic S/O
Currently Looking...
Kutztown , Pennsylvania
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 189
I posted earlier in this discussion. I've towed with a Ford Excursion & a F250. I have 1125 lb. tongue weight, pulling a 34' S/O Airstream. I've towed with a Reese Tuition & Hensley and have never used more then 1000 lb. Bars. I trust my own towing experience not the opinion of someone who answers the phone at a hitch company. If 1000 lb. Bars leaves the back end of your truck sagging then take your rig to a spring shop & have the a leaf added or heaver coil installed rather then putting more tension on your Airstream frame. I max out my "spring bars" that's true. So what? They aren't going to break. I prefer to have it that way rather then to have 1500 lb. Bars that are too tough to act like a"spring bar" and instead force the Airstream frame and my back to absorb the lack of spring action.
NOAZRK2690 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2017, 11:59 AM   #55
Rivet Master
 
2007 27' International CCD FB
San Diego , California
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,769
Quote:
Originally Posted by gypsydad View Post
The head is factory set now on the BO; you just insert, set the tension to 4.5 links or adjust up or down a link if not working properly...
Yes, just trying to say if it feels too stiff with the 1500 bars (or even 1000 bars), that you may need to let up a link. The attitude of the trailer also affects the preload to a degree.
pteck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2017, 06:24 AM   #56
Vintage Kin
 
Fort Worth , Texas
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,014
Images: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew T View Post
Hi Davis

One of our customers gets a new 250 every year and he noticed a substantial reduction in stability with the 2017.

The truck is 3" taller than the 16 which was already very tall so the center of gravity is higher but I think the biggest difference is that they have softened the upper level of the rear suspension.

If you reduce pressure on the torsion bars it helps the rear suspension but then the steering is light. It seems the best solution is about 800 pounds of cargo in the box and then set you torsion bars from there.

Your extended drop is likely putting you ball a long way behind the bumper which does not help.

Andrew T
OP, correct these items. They've set up more than 10,000 tow rigs at that man's family RV dealership.

FWIW, if the truck doesn't have 1k or more in bed, it was wrong choice of TV

.
slowmover is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2017, 02:17 PM   #57
Rivet Master
 
Moflash's Avatar
 
2007 28' International CCD
Springfield , Missouri
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 1,423
2017 Ford F250 and trailer sway ???

Quote:
Originally Posted by slowmover View Post
OP, correct these items. They've set up more than 10,000 tow rigs at that man's family RV dealership.



FWIW, if the truck doesn't have 1k or more in bed, it was wrong choice of TV



.


Another Troll slowmover?
Moflash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2017, 02:32 PM   #58
Rivet Master
 
Currently Looking...
Gainesville , Florida
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 7,061
Blog Entries: 2
Hardly, you could learn from his advice. Slowmover is generally right on.
xrvr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2017, 05:41 PM   #59
Rivet Master
 
Moflash's Avatar
 
2007 28' International CCD
Springfield , Missouri
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 1,423
2017 Ford F250 and trailer sway ???

Quote:
Originally Posted by avionstream View Post
Hardly, you could learn from his advice. Slowmover is generally right on.


Sorry but I have been in the automobile business for 43 years .
I am certified in medium and Hd trucks.In my career I have ordered thousands of new vehicles traded for thousands more.
Drove on most of the racetracks in the United States and most of the famous ones in Europe.I have worked with and consulted for Chevrolet,Mercedes Benz,Ferrari,Lamborghini,Porsche,Rolls Royce,Bentley,Lotus,Mclaren just to name a few.I am also a ASE certified technician and started building engines in my bedroom when I was 13 and currently restore vintage motorcycles to relax.I have won many accolades over the years that I won't bore u with....

.I enjoy helping others on this forum but some who pretend to be experts and preach on this forum have know clue other than what they read on Canadian websites or what they feel with the seat of there pants. and they cause people to make the wrong choices in tow vehicles.
Sorry I am still learning but not from slowmover and his cronies.

I am sure slowmover is a great truck driver.
Moflash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2017, 06:33 PM   #60
Rivet Master
 
Currently Looking...
Gainesville , Florida
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 7,061
Blog Entries: 2
Yes you are still learning. How much of your experience is in towing? Race tracks and service dept experience doesn't count. Motorcycles? What does that have to do with anything.
xrvr is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Ford's electronic sway control VS Blueox sway bars Vitaver Towing, Tow Vehicles & Hitches 42 09-23-2020 10:36 AM
Newer Models Ford F250 Gas Vs. F250 Diesel Hopeful1 Tow Vehicles 138 09-15-2019 06:55 PM
2017 F250 and Equalizer Hitch ksteve06 Hitches, Couplers & Balls 44 09-15-2018 07:01 AM
Ford 2017 f250 4x4 experience. THEPILL Tow Vehicles 22 12-06-2016 09:14 AM
Airstream Disc Brakes and Ford F250 Air Apparent Tow Vehicles 11 04-28-2009 11:32 AM


Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by the Airstream, Inc. or any of its affiliates. Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:41 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.