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bobzdar · 08-22-2022, 12:45 PM

Just picked up our FC 25RB and have a few late summer/fall trips planned, but we are also (or once were and trying to be again now that our kids are old enough) avid skiiers and Snowshoe and Canaan in WV both have camping with electric hookups. Given it's a 4 hour drive to either, we'd rather take the A/S there than rent for the weekend, but want to get some pointers from those that have done the same. It'll be a family of 4 and a dog for the weekend. Tow vehicle is a Gladiator Rubicon (7000lb towing, 1200lb payload for those wondering) so winter travel shouldn't be a problem, I don't plan to travel if there's a storm.

Typical temps will be teens at night, upper 20's to low 30's during the day. Our unit has heatpump and ducted propane - looks like we should be ok for a weekend if we use the freshwater tank and keep the propane heat on, maybe with the addition of a dehumidifier? Anything else to keep in mind? We're thinking 1-2 trips per year, not a regular thing, so not worried about propane consumption or having to winterize/re-winterize as long as 2 full propane tanks can get us through a weekend (will also have shore power in both places).

Dennis C · 08-22-2022, 01:31 PM

Congrats on your new 25RB!

We live in ski country just west of Denver, and we have often though of trying to use our Airstream for winter activities and ski trips. After much consideration, we decided against it. While it is possible, it takes a great deal of work and preparation, and it has some potential risk and issues. The obvious issues/risks are keeping the lines from freezing and bursting, keeping the inside of the trailer comfortable, dealing with humidity inside the trailer, and dealing with road salt used to melt snow and ice. Once you've handled all these issues, you then are faced with the need to winterize the trailer every time you put it back in storage. For us, it was just too much work. Fortunately I can be on the ski hill in less than an hour from my house, so day trips work for me.

Have you towed the new trailer with your Gladiator yet? I'm not trying to turn this into a towing thread, but your new 25-footer likely has a tongue weight between 1,000 and 1,200 lbs., which will essentially use up all your payload capacity. How have you dealt with this?

Assuming you get through all the stuff above, you should be fine for a weekend with two propane tanks. We camped in the high country in April last year and the low temperatures at night were in the teens. We used a single 30 lb. tank of propane in just under a week.

Bcc75 · 08-22-2022, 02:07 PM

Ditto everything Dennis just said.
We did one winter trip last year in February. Mid 20’s at night and 40’s in the day.
That’s about as cold as I would want to get in an Airstream. They are really just not built for cold winter camping. Especially boondocking.
My bigger concern for you would be your tow vehicle situation. 4 people, dogs, and winter camping/skiing gear plus the tongue weight with full propane tanks puts you well over the rated payload limits of the Gladiator I am afraid. Even if you load all of your gear in the trailer, you are even getting dangerously close to your 7000lb tow rating. Throw in some dicey winter roads and you’ve got an unsafe situation.

bobzdar · 08-22-2022, 02:34 PM

With weight distributing hitch set for even distribution, the gladiator has around 600lbs on it. We don't have skiis anymore (well I do but they're pushing 20 tears old) and for a weekend for sure will not be packing heavily. I do not know how much water affects that as I haven't yet (and never have in other campers) towed with fresh water. Both sites say they have potable water available, so would plan to fill there. I know at Canaan it can be filled in winter, but not sure about snowshoe, I'll have to check.

As to how it tows, it feels the same as our '67 overlander but is less susceptible to sway. The jeep does not feel like it's working as hard, which was surprising to me as the 23 is wider (but appears a bit shorter) than the 67. It worked harder towing the supposedly lighter and smaller 21' wilderness my mom had, so not sure what aero magic airstream has pulled but it does not work hard to do 70 and I have not felt the typical large vehicle tug when a tractor trailer is next to me. I bought the rb for the lighter tongue weight and larger bathroom vs the fb, so far the jeep is not struggling at all, but if it does I'll upgrade to a power wagon or something similar.

bobzdar · 08-22-2022, 05:47 PM

Also, not planning to boondock, any place we'd go in winter has electric.

Bcc75 · 08-22-2022, 06:03 PM

Just remember, with weight distribution you are not eliminating the weight, just putting it somewhere else. Regardless of how it 'feels', that Overlander is MUCH lighter than a new Airstream. At least by 500-600lbs on the tongue.

As far as the cold, if you have shore power, use electric space heaters to conserve propane. Run your fantastic fans to help with humidity. You will have to run the furnace at night to heat the tanks though. Your heat pump is useless below 45 degrees.

dbj216 · 08-22-2022, 06:24 PM

Hello from Colorado: Snow is one of our main economic drivers in this state. And we have a lot of skiing as a result. I'm too old anymore, but my sons enjoy it.

For me, pulling a trailer on slick roads is forbidden. I won't do it. Snow and ice on the roads makes trailer towing a real challenge. We were coming back to Colorado from a trip in May and ran into a snow storm over Vail pass. The highway was wet, but temps were 30f. I was a bunch concerned. I thought thank goodness for the deicers the DOT puts on the roads. Well, the dicers really corroded our Airstream which was polished. I had a bear of a time repolishing it.

Here a photo of my son's 69 Globetrotter 21' on a ski trip. It was just an aluminum tent in the parking lot. No water, just propane heat. Not my idea of a fun trip, but to him it was just another Airstream adventure. Where is the shovel.

You folks are farther south than we are, and also at a lower altitude. But you may have icing conditions more often than "powder snow" Colorado.

David

Dennis C · 08-22-2022, 06:50 PM

I’m imagining driving down a 7% grade on a snow packed road while towing a trailer. That won’t be me either!

Many of the campgrounds in the mountains that are open in the winter months have heated water connections. You can buy a heated fresh water hose, and it’s probably a nice thing to have if you plan to camp in freezing conditions.

waninae39 · 08-22-2022, 08:16 PM

IMHO, i would not use it in cold weather

the water lines will freeze and may burst
humidity levels inside the AS will get too high
the summer tires will freeze
going down hill will be very dangerous

bobzdar · 08-22-2022, 09:03 PM

Let's assume I make it there (won't go if roads or weather are bad). Is conserving propane a concern for a weekend trip? Hell, I could probably crank it to 80 and still not burn through 60lbs of propane in 48 hours. I was thinking of using a dehumidifier to combat moisture, will it be able to keep up?

I did some winter camping in the overlander, it was not much of a challenge as I didn't use the water (which was an adventure even in perfect weather due to the age). Hit the teens a few nights and kept warm with electric heat, but I'd rather the full amenities if it's just a matter of running the propane heat and taking some other precautions. Condensation was not an issue in either trip, but we were not using water and electric heat is pretty dry.

As to corrosion, I'd hope the clear is still intact on a brand new a/s but will be sure to clean it asap. I'm also planning to give it a coat of ceramic in the fall to protect it.

Thiss · 08-22-2022, 09:37 PM

Congrats on your new trailer! We too are moving from an Overlander to a 2023 and ski every weekend.

We are set up with full hookups just down hill from Mt. Hood. I too am interested to see how the fuel usage will change. We used about 12 gallons of propane every two weeks. That was with pilot lights 24/7 but the heater only when occupied. We had space heaters for when we were gone.

Anyway, happy shredding!

Dennis C · 08-22-2022, 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobzdar

Let's assume I make it there (won't go if roads or weather are bad). Is conserving propane a concern for a weekend trip? Hell, I could probably crank it to 80 and still not burn through 60lbs of propane in 48 hours. I was thinking of using a dehumidifier to combat moisture, will it be able to keep up?

I did some winter camping in the overlander, it was not much of a challenge as I didn't use the water (which was an adventure even in perfect weather due to the age). Hit the teens a few nights and kept warm with electric heat, but I'd rather the full amenities if it's just a matter of running the propane heat and taking some other precautions. Condensation was not an issue in either trip, but we were not using water and electric heat is pretty dry.

As to corrosion, I'd hope the clear is still intact on a brand new a/s but will be sure to clean it asap. I'm also planning to give it a coat of ceramic in the fall to protect it.

You’ll have plenty of propane.

jeffb831 · 08-23-2022, 07:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobzdar

Let's assume I make it there (won't go if roads or weather are bad). Is conserving propane a concern for a weekend trip? Hell, I could probably crank it to 80 and still not burn through 60lbs of propane in 48 hours. I was thinking of using a dehumidifier to combat moisture, will it be able to keep up?

I did some winter camping in the overlander, it was not much of a challenge as I didn't use the water (which was an adventure even in perfect weather due to the age). Hit the teens a few nights and kept warm with electric heat, but I'd rather the full amenities if it's just a matter of running the propane heat and taking some other precautions. Condensation was not an issue in either trip, but we were not using water and electric heat is pretty dry.

As to corrosion, I'd hope the clear is still intact on a brand new a/s but will be sure to clean it asap. I'm also planning to give it a coat of ceramic in the fall to protect it.

Personally, I wouldn't do it because an AS is really a 3-season camper. Yes, you can do it the winter but it'll not be easy, you'll make too many concessions, and possibly damage the trailer.

That said, almost everyone here has a similar opinion and has raised valid concerns, which you seem to refute or dismiss so you can justify what you plan on doing. It's your trailer so give it a try and see how it works out.

GetawA-S · 08-23-2022, 07:48 AM

Congrats on your new RV! We hope you have many enjoyable trips in it.
Like many others, my main concern would be the trip to/from. “All it takes is one…” “Bridges freeze before roads.” There are some significant passes (I assume you’ll be crossing the Appalachians around Front Royal?) but it’s the sneaky ice patches that would be the most concerning. My own experience was driving a 28’ SOB (pretty light, about 6,000 lbs) behind a one ton Ford van from Florida back to northern Illinois after a winter break trip. Snow descended across TN, and we had no cushion in our schedule. We took refuge at a motel at the TN/KY line, and continued on, planning a long day to get home. The roads cleared in KY, but the wind kicked up in Illinois and there was the slightest glaze on the interstate. Driving under an overpass, the change in wind pressure kinked my rig, the speed control reacted wrong, and immediately I was driving along at 60 mph in a near jack-knife configuration. God and his angels got me straightened out, and we drove MUCH more slowly WITHOUT the speed control to get home. A colleague with a similar itinerary was an hour or so behind, until the state police shut down the interstate and he had to camp overnight in a parking lot.
Just sayin’ - a cozy winter ski trip sounds idyllic until it isn’t. Don’t be too invested in your schedule, don’t be overconfident in your tow vehicle and driving skills, don’t be too optimistic about what Mother Nature is going to throw at you. Aerodynamics on an Airstream are wonderful, but that pleasant towing experience goes away when it is purely a matter of weight, rubber patches on the road, and a relatively short wheelbase.
Were it me, I’d be looking for someone else to supply the cozy accommodations and focus on the good times on the slopes.
However you decide, have the best of times!

Thiss · 08-23-2022, 07:49 AM

From my asking around, the only thing that needs modified is the outdoor shower. It needs a shutoff valve in the trailer to keep it from freezing at the head unit.

bobzdar · 08-23-2022, 08:32 AM

Concerns seem to be around propane usage and freezing pipes - I'm trying to ascertain whether running the propane will prevent the freezing (no comments on that) and if the propane will last the weekend (sounds like that will be no issue). I'm not dismissing the issue, more trying to understand if they are long term winter camping concerns or Friday to Sunday (ie 48 hours) once or twice in a winter concerns.

I will not be traveling if the roads are bad or if there is a storm projected, trailer or not, as that will turn a 4 hour trip into a 6+hour one. If there are legitimate concerns that treated roads will damage the clear on the camper, then I will rethink, but the one commenter on that has a classic polished camper, which ostensibly has no clear coat on it.

So, my main remaining questions are:

If I run the propane furnace the whole time set to 65 and running self contained for roughly 48 hours, will I have to deal with pipes freezing? Will winter road spray damage the finish on a new airstream if properly cleaned and maintained? I have mud flaps on the tow vehicle so should not be kicking large stuff on it, it'll mostly be road spray. I'm originally from NY so understand the effects of road salt if left on vehicles all winter, one of the reasons I left.

I'm not new to either airstreams, camping, towing or winter camping for that matter (see here, bonus vintage avion content, https://youtu.be/2LLdOI6bDuk for one of my other adventures), what is new is the camper and my desire to do some skiing again.

bobzdar · 08-23-2022, 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thiss

From my asking around, the only thing that needs modified is the outdoor shower. It needs a shutoff valve in the trailer to keep it from freezing at the head unit.

This is good info, thanks.

80Ram · 08-23-2022, 09:52 AM

I had read a “Live Rivited “blog about “The Joy of Adventuring in the Coldest Months”. Diane Tripels frequently drives across Canada during the winter months and gives her tips in doing so. Worth the read if your still interested. My tip would be to bring the best Dehumidifier you can get.

Wazbro · 08-23-2022, 10:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 80Ram

I had read a “Live Rivited “blog about “The Joy of Adventuring in the Coldest Months”. Diane Tripels frequently drives across Canada during the winter months and gives her tips in doing so. Worth the read if your still interested. My tip would be to bring the best Dehumidifier you can get.

For the dehumidifier I would suggest a desiccant version. The tiny peltier ones barely do anything especially under 75f. Likewise the compressor versions are rated at 88f and do less the lower the temp, at 65f they will not do much and start to freeze up.

pcskier · 08-23-2022, 01:38 PM

If you can get there safely then you are fine. I got caught towing on a *flat* slippery interstate won’t once and did not like it one bit. Don’t listen to the naysayers beyond that.

I have lived in my 23 foot flying cloud the past two winters down to temps of -10 F at night. Especially if you have an electric hook up, just leave your furnace set to 45 or 50 and nothing inside will freeze. I don’t like sleeping in a warm room so I use an electric heated mattress pad which is a game changer. With that, I leave my furnace at 45 and no supplemental heat and have never had a problem. Obviously that might be too cool for some people but my point is even set at 45 nothing freezes. Set at 50 or 55 or 60 or whatever you wish.

For extra security use the fresh tank. But I have also used a heated hose with no issue. I would recommend a skirt, which you can make or buy ones that are easy to remove and reinstall. That keeps the trailer 10 to 15° warmer underneath the floors. Also a dehumidifier is a must, the dessicant type.

Winter Airstreaming is awesome!